Haven’t read the whole thread. Checking in from time to time. Conversation seems to be going round and round although nuanced with additional information as facts on the ground change.
Bottom line - until there is a vaccine (s) available in massive quantities, the spread will not / cannot stop. Perhaps it can be slowed with rigid rules (and enforcement), but not stopped. Unless our society (not just an individual college) was willing and able to lock down the bubble, this thing spreads. The trip to target, the off campus party, the profs dinner party on Saturday night, the Profs kids at their local school, etc.
We have to decide what level of risk we’re willing to take. I firmly believe the colleges are stuck in a liability mitigation situation. If there was an “agreement” that no school would face damages if a student or staff person falls ill from Covid, this would be a different conversation. The reality is essentially the same number of people will fall ill with or without the schools. If kids were home, sans total lockdown, they would be out and about, exposed to many “bubbles”. Actually, in that regard, the kids are probably safer being in their large campus related bubble.
If a vaccine was likely available in thirty days, I’d say lock everything up and massively vaccinate since we’ve come this far. With no known end in site, it comes down to risk. Let’s fortify the safety of seniors in facilities. The ones at home are most likely taking precautions (my mother and MIL haven’t left their homes in months - thank you food delivery services). I know not everyone is or can do that but they can control their risks by minimizing times in public and always wearing a mask in public.
Test, contract trace, and live life taking reasonable precautions. I feel it’s unreasonable to assume or plan on 18-22 yr olds not socializing in person, regardless of the “rules”. No way to enforce it without Marshall Law. The schools are stuck in the middle. They won’t be the cause of spread, but they will get blamed and sued without a very restrictive agenda.
Is it the colleges and K-12 schools making the rules, or is it the States’ Department of Health driving these policies? How much leeway, if any, do the colleges have when determining campus regulations?
Half the people I know in Florida are retirees; they didn’t bring their grandkids with them when they moved; they either live alone or with another retiree just like them. I live in New York City where multi-generational households are pretty muchthe norm. One of my best friends caught a so-called, “mild case” of COVID-19 (IMO, if this had been any place else, she would have been admitted to the emergency room) and she thinks it was from her grandson who alternates between staying with her and with parents.
The other half are service workers. And, it certainly seems like an awful lot of South Beach bartenders are wearing masks.
It’s looking like the virus isn’t likely to be transmitted by touch. Especially when everyone is wearing a mask so they can’t put their fingers in their mouth and nose. I bet the 1 hour is for the HVAC system to cycle the air.
Regarding Florida - it does seem odd that their Covid death numbers are so low, but didn’t they have an issue with reporting? Like an official resigned because she thought the numbers were being falsified in some way? In any case, while Florida has ramped up testing, they still lag way behind on testing per capita compared to other states. And they may be reporting Covid numbers only for residents of the state, and there are a lot of folks from out of state spending the winter months there.
At this moment in time, is it feasible to test all students when they arrive on campus for fall term?
Are there enough accurate tests available? If so, can colleges afford such testing?
I can’t find the answers, but some on this thread probably either know or have really good educated guesses.
Thanks in advance.
In theory, it seems everyone on campus, (faculty, staff, students), could be issued and wear enough PPE to be safe from risk of infection on campus. As far as I can tell, there not only isn’t agreement on wearing PPE, there just isn’t enough available.
NY, NJ, and CT have developed the habits needed to lower the infection rate, so the workers in those states pose less of a threat than in other states,
Colleges want to protect their students and staff to the best of their ability. While I certainly understand the frustration that some parents have regarding hanging out in dorm rooms, the school has the right to make the rules. If students choose not to follow those rules…then they will have to deal with the consequences.
Is it fair that off campus students don’t have to follow such strict rules, and that they are permitted to have visitors? Off campus houses are generally not run by the school (some are), and the school’s job is to keep as many students safe as possible…on their campus. Their school, their rules.
I might add that we are in a pandemic and cases are spiking throughout the country. Be happy the school is opening at all…there will likely be infections. Personally, I would be happy with the restrictions in place, as they are designed to keep people safe.
Some parents seem to be very, very heavily involved in the rules that their young adult children may have to follow. Why get hyper involved in day to day tasks? Why not take a step back and let the students handle it? If the students are not happy, let them do the research, analyze the data, present their case…and hope the school changes the rules for them.
If the students manage to make these changes, kudos to them…even if I don’t agree and prefer the tighter rules. I tell my kids either follow the rules…or present your case to change them. Surely these schools must have students involved in the decision process…get involved! I think it’s time to pass the reins and let them fight for what they believe in (even if I disagree).
Many companies are now allowing staff to work from home…some saying they must. This may last for a long time. My D and all of her friends are still working from home. Is this the life that a new grad envisioned? My guess is…no. It doesn’t end in college. I would hope young adults would learn the skills in college that they will eventually need when they head to work. This means following the rules…or presenting your case to possibly try and change them.
Parachuting in here as an incoming freshman student. I’m reading how school will require certain distancing measures in dorms and around campus. Has anyone been on instagram recently? I can tell you, without pause, that the vast majority of college age students have completely relaxed their social distancing. Whether it’s the hundreds of snaps per hour of get togethers or the very public insta posts…the young generation has, by and large, abandoned the quarantine.
This is not said for any purpose other than to dispute the possibility of social distancing on campus this fall. Not gonna happen. You’ll get students to wear their masks in class, and follow the guidelines for public spaces when they feel as though there will be a consequence for them not doing so. But in dorms and all the other places people would typically congregate…they’ll do so almost normally.
Colleges know this. But they’re primarily about $, students are primarily about the combined learning and social experience, parents are about all of the above…
Interestingly, there hasn’t been one word about testing in all the communications from my son’s school. They’ve talked about hybrid learning options, vague references to changes to dorm and food service, and lots of talk about flexibility , but not one word about testing. This is a large public university with the majority of students living off campus. Maybe they’ve just decided they can’t do it, or it doesn’t make sense. With the majority of students off campus, plus faculty and administrators and other campus workers coming in each day, there really isn’t a campus bubble. I think it more likely that they will just test people who have symptoms and isolate dorm residents who test positive.
On a related note, I tried to reserve a hotel room near my sons campus for the evening before his lease starts, and absolutely nothing close by was available. There are several chain type hotels in the area and they were all completely full. I have never encountered this before. It’s not a big deal - we just got a room a little further out, but I’m thinking the school has reserved all the rooms.
I can’t imagine any scenario in which faculty present more of a danger of spread to students than students to each other. Faculty presumably won’t be having sex, sharing a bong, or getting drunk with students.
I have always thought there are many parents who come to CC to vent, or speculate, or brainstorm, specifically so they don’t have to pass all their thinking and its evolution, as well as their anxieties on to their kids…I don’t necessarily think all the parents who use CC this way are ‘heavily involved’ in the rules or day to day, nor does it mean their kids aren’t involved.
Using CC like this seems to make sense, I think it helps some people limit how much they are talking with their kids about this stuff, which can be a good thing. I know it helps me in this way, and also allows me to tighten up my thinking before I do talk with my kids about certain things by getting additional perspective from the many thoughtful, educated posters here.
Some parents are “very very involved” in finding out the rules because they are trying to understand exactly what life will be like on campus. Together with their kids, they need to know the details to decide whether to go back to campus in the fall or take a break.
Colleges do this already. No smoking or drinking in the dorms. Kids move off campus so they can partake freely. Freshman year my daughter was randomly placed in a women’s dorm with such strict rules that even her brother could not stay overnight. She moved off campus sophomore year.
After posting this link, I read on CNN that NC has had record numbers of hospitalizations this last week. I started following NC weeks ago because some posters on the thread have students at NC public and private colleges and universities.
Well that’s actually kind of funny because, if kids can’t have guests in their dorm room, I don’t know where they are having sex or sharing a bong. Of course there are schools with lots of off campus housing but, for those without it, none of that stuff is going to happen.
And I thought the main concern was students passing the virus on to faculty, not necessarily kids passing it to kids. There’s going to be virus on campus and I think any of us sending our students back know there’s a chance they will come down with it. But, there has to be some flexibility in the rules for the students. It’s up to them to make the right choices. Remember 4/10,000 people under 21 get hospitalized with the virus.
In the NY metro area, definitely. In other parts of the country, social distancing was never a real thing., and they are paying for it now with rising rates. My NJ kid knows the ropes, but goes to U of SC, where Whole Foods is the only grocery store that requires, not suggests, masks.
I won’t dispute this…you might be right. What these students have to understand is that when they choose the behaviors…they also choose the consequences. In this case the consequences may lead to closing the school if the virus spikes.