“External circumstances” is pretty vague and could be anything, although it sounds like something outside the control of the faculty member. Those things certainly did happen prior to covid. At least they were able to reschedule the lecture.
Nothing prevents students from doing the same, they do it all the time.
Ok but I feel like a broken record. Kids might be happy on campus but it’s still hard to swallow to pay full price for remote learning and such limited campus activities. When you decide to pay X for college, you know what you are buying and it’s not this.
Bentley has cancelled all study abroad for this academic year. Summer study abroad TBD.
My daughter’s “bomb” class last night - a once a week 3 hour class - was cancelled last night after the teacher couldn’t get his technology to work. She was frustrated.
In general, the classes have been going well but she misses in person classes. Heck I’m sick of Zoom at work, so I totally get it.
Class cancelation is happening more in virtual spring and fall than when college was in person. Cutting class short is most definitely occurring way too often–esp. for the longer T/R ones and 3 hour seminars. The latter tend to be cut an hour short every week.
While I can understand that stuff can legitimately happen, eg. internet crashes, what bothers me is that no cancelled classes have been re-scheduled. Students and parents alike are being gypped. Frankly, I still don’t see how sitting in a chair at home for an hour and a half in front of a laptop is that much more difficult than sitting in a chair in a lecture hall in front of a laptop. I think profs are milking the “sitting in front of a screen is tiring” excuse too much. Furthermore, while I get that life can be complicated with school-aged children at home, other working people with less flexible schedules than college professors are making arrangements to carry on with the demands of their jobs.
It’s much more difficult, for both students and teachers. 60 minutes of Zoom equals 120 minutes of real-time encounters in terms of effort and attention. There is a human limit to the amount of sustained engagement that one can expect via virtual meetings. There is much more stimulation in an in-person meeting. Communication and interaction are much harder online.
That’s why I decided to adopt a “hybrid” model of synchronous Zoom and asynchronous online activities (taped lectures, quizzes, discussion boards) to equal 3 credit hours per week.
Well, I’ve been attending Zoom meetings quite a bit lately and don’t see a difference once you get used to the format. In fact, at home I can sit in a comfy chair with my coffee and elastic waisted pants on! Today I recorded a lecture using Zoom with no distractions from an audience, and tomorrow I will be running a Zoom training, so I"ll get back to you if that feels harder than it did doing it in person.
I’ve been WFH and attending virtual meetings for nearly seven years and for what I do, there is a huge difference between those and in-person meetings. Virtual meetings are fine for the basic transfer of information. Better, even, in some respects, because of the ability to share screen. However, building and maintaining relationships is very difficult. I have to schedule in time to get up and move around. I get so sick of staring at a screen. Most of the day, my whole world is fifteen inches deep. WFH has its perks but in-person sure has its perks too.
My high schooler is hanging in there, but she can’t wait for in-person classes to start back up.
@123Mom123 Amherst hasn’t (officially) made a decision on study abroad yet.
It’s different because there’s no before or after class. There’s no chatting with your classmates or your professor. No hanging around afterwards to talk a little longer or to grab lunch with a classmate to talk more about what happened in class that day.
There’s no magic that happens when debate shows up in class. I know that students don’t act the same way on Zoom even if it’s a small class and live. They don’t jump in and talk as often.
I guess if you just want to lecture and leave, then zoom works. And if students don’t want to talk to each other and just take notes on a lecture, it works.
My son’s college, Northeastern, has spent millions of dollars on its Covid plans and done over 170,000 mandatory, frequent tests of every student, faculty and contract worker on campus with a .07% positive rate currently. He is a freshman, has found kids in his dorm to be friendly and made friends easily. Common room in dorm is closed but there are outdoor tables at the dorm. He enjoys his classes, which are mostly remote. Has played frisbee and done fun things in Boston. Clubs and events are virtual.
Other parents complain their kids have no friends, are bored, and are mad that more teachers chose to teach remotely than in person. I wonder about the social aspect and whether some freshmen would struggle socially without COVID or if these parents think college should be more like summer camp in terms of organized activities. I guess for people that are disappointed socially they could stay home for the spring, but I wonder if they transfer what their options would be like at other campuses. Maybe they would be happier at a college with no mandatory Covid testing or restrictions on group gatherings.
I like your approach. My D (Duke) and all of her friends are really struggling with sustaining their online learning. Of her housing block of 10, they all have similar schedules…all classes online except one hybrid class that meets once /week in person. Yes, they are happy to be on campus. But she says she spends at least 60 hours+/week working on her computer btwn. class zooms, student group zooms, her lab research done online/online meetings, and online time to complete assignments that use software/online programs, watching required videos, etc. Only 2 students allowed in the study room at a time makes meeting with study groups in person a little challenging and she just can’t stand any more zoom meetings. They are burnt out and it’s absolutely nothing like pre-covid in terms of the learning experience. It’s also a little more intense because the semester was shortened by about 2 weeks so the profs are chugging through at a fast pace. Kudos to Duke admin…they have the testing down, and great protocols in place. High compliance by students. But it’s still pretty strict in terms of eating inside dining facilities (it’s mostly to go), accessing the gym, meeting with a group, etc. Having more in classes in person would help. I don’t know that it’s going to happen next semester, though. Duke required all classes to also be available to students remotely as an option. I imagine it’s a lot of work and logistically difficult for a teacher to design an in-person class that is equally productive/accessible to someone also taking it remotely, and D thinks this is why the profs of her 3 smaller classes (less than 15 students each) still all went full remote when given the option.
Oh, I don’t disagree. The Zoom experience is certainly less socially satisfying and makes community- building difficult. But shortening class time or canceling class altogether does nothing to solve that. It makes the problem worse!
@2ndthreekids - Your post was extra helpful. All of the details were greatly appreciated. Many of us are yearning for feedback like that to get a clearer picture of experiences on (in this case, DU) campus.
@2ndthreekids thank you for your detailed description of remote class while on campus. I’m not surprised in the least. It seems many want to praise campuses that are keeping cases low but not mentioning what the academic or social experience is on campus. Of course fewer cases is better than more cases but look what has to be done in order for that to happen? The students have been stripped of the experience they signed up for and of course it’s a lesser experience.
I understand the pull of wanting to be back on campus with friends and trying to figure out a new (hopefully temporary) normal on campus. Students are maybe asking themselves the wrong question though. Don’t ask do I want to be at school or do I want to take a break and face that there’s not much to do. The question is more this - do I want to use up 1/4 of my college experience to this new reality or can I wait and have a way better chance of having a full four years of the experience I want for myself including classes in person, meeting new people every week, making memories with college traditions, enjoying all of the extracurricular experiences and clubs that all colleges offer?
No 18-22 year old wants to stay home while most of their classmates return to school. I get that it’s uncomfortable to think about deferring when it was never a plan to do so but I wonder how many students are going to look back in five years and regret not taking a break. I hear people say their kids are enjoying school “enough” or that “it’s better than being at home” but that just seems like such a short term view. Of course I’m coming from the perspective of a full pay parent with a sophomore who chose a school that is all about the experience on campus. I think that’s an important distinction but certainly lines up with a lot of parents at Duke. Sounds like Duke is doing the best they can under the circumstances but it’s still good to know what that “best” looks like so students who will be invited back next semester can make an informed decision.
I’m starting to feel badly for parents that pay for the college “experience.”
Hm. I guess some families just pay for a degree?
You can’t go where you’re not welcome. Beyond all of the safety and travel realities, there are several countries blocking non-essential travel from all counties, with many specifically blocking travel from the US. We continue to be have high infection rates, and aren’t welcome in many countries (notably nearly all of Europe).
Everyone expects things to improve, but until they do and governments/schools can plan with a reasonable expectation of success, study abroad is going to be nearly impossible.
In 50 years time I think that people will look back at today with a mix of awe, confusion and interest of how we have altered our lives for this mother******* virus.
I think that college kids should regard this time as a badge of honour. They are going to be the grandparents telling tails of this as their WWII.
Those are THE questions that every single student and parent are grappling with, assuming they are lucky enough to be in a position to control their own timing with a strong sense that opportunities and costs from year to year are similar. That is a luxury.
I think the potential for regret is enormous, but varies greatly by considering if the experience losses are new or expanding. If you’ve been on campus for a few years, made friends, been to the tailgate, joined organizations, teams and clubs…you’re missing out on doing things again. Our senior was lucky enough to have done the fall semester abroad last year. A legal drinker now, the parties and the drama and the on-campus socializing have gone from large to small. Evenings are spent with friends that you can count on fingers (occassionally toes?), and honestly school itself isn’t impacting that a great deal. Friends and connections have been set.
As seniors, they are more interested in completion and figuring out next steps. GMAT’s, LSAT’s and applications are the topics of discussion.
About 15,000 comments ago in this thread, I posted that I thought schools should engage with the differences in experience levels and bring those students to campus who will benefit the most from being there. Having fewer seniors gives first year students more space to engage with each other, even if from a distance.
I would be hard pressed to pay $60k in tuition for an online first year experience, and would very seriously consider waiting. Now that we’re $200k into the process, it’s time to live with the loss of some experience and appreciate that everything new that happens next year is only because you completed class online / off-campus.
I’m one of those. We like to refer to it as being European. lol.
My D gets to keep the savings and use it for grad school or whatever. It really adds up!