Schools for a Cerebral, Liberal Jock

Parents Forum
41

<p>cangel, Accessibility of football tickets is a problem in the SEC- although so far, both sons have been able to procure tickets without camping out. Actually, UF runs a season ticket lottery, which IMO is the way to go. For $80 you get all home games, if you win the lottery. Students with over 31 hours get a better priority under the lottery, so it's really just the freshman year that you have to worry about. Older son won but younger son didn't. Younger has still managed to purchase tickets from other students- we set him up with a $500 budget (:eek: But we don't pay a dime for tuition so the $420 extra is an easy pill to swallow) and it seems to be working; he worked a deal with some girl to buy all her tickets at various prices (she has no intention of going to even one game, although she entered the lottery. Go figure.). </p>

<p>With UF basketball, there's a priority system based on past attendance. Last year, Older made sure he went to as many "unimportant" games at the front of the season as he could, that way he was given priority for the "big" games.</p>

<p>I'll take the lottery system (with black market) anyday over having to camp out.</p>

42

<p>Very grateful for the excellent suggestions. Will present the list to S so we can plan our mega-college tour. Much will depend on SAT scores. Agree that Stanford would be perfect, but the kids we know there all have almost superhuman accomplishments and he might not be in that league.</p>

43

<p>I think at Duke going to the basketball games is as much about the tenting as it is actually attending the game, so that is a little special.
I agree that the lottery is probably the best way, no way is perfect, I just know that a significant number of tickets are now won by students who have no intention of going to the game, it is sad for the kids who would attend the game, but can't afford to buy someone else's lottery ticket. It's not been that many years ago that all the students who wanted to go to a game could generally get a ticket, except for big rivalry games or very important games.</p>

44

<p>Just to clarify for those who may think that Duke students have to camp out to attend any basketball games:</p>

<p>Tenting is reserved for VERY high-profile games (Duke/UNC, e.g.). Your student wouldn't have to camp out to attend most games.</p>

<p>That said, the tenting experience is also a bonding experience. Our S gets together regularly with is tent mates from last year. I think they have a standing dinner date.</p>

45

<p>I remember camping out for basketball tickets while at UNC- back when Michael Jordan played! (I'm showing my age.) Brrrrrr! I also remember missing classes and bombing quizzes as a result. I didn't have the organizational skills to pull it off! :(</p>

46

<p>Do visit Wisconsin, especially to contrast it with Michigan when you are in the Midwest. You may want it as a safety compared to Stanford, like other flagship schools there will be students with the same qualifications as those in the most elite schools. There is an Honors program as opposed to a separate college so all students mingle in the dorms, it's the course work that is different when chosen. Students "study hard and play hard", they have higher test scores than in years past. There is a large enough student body to have several groups of friends- the ones you study with, go to games with, participate in sports with, are politically active with. It may be harder to find people to match all the facets of his personality at small schools. Do not let size scare you, let your son see several of the top public U's, they all have different characters. At this stage it is good to sample different sized schools that meet other criteria, you may find your son feeling small campuses are limiting once he sees a campus such as UW-Madison's (BTW- some large campuses are contiguous, such as UW, others, such as U of Minn and Michigan, have two or more geographic areas accessed by shuttles).</p>

47

<p>^for most undergrads at Mich, that's a little misleading. The outlying campus only holds a couple schools (engineering and I think music.) If you are in one of those, you would definitely be well served by living there. I myself lived on the main campus and had every class on the main campus (plus, the two campuses are extremely close; you could walk between them if you wanted to.)</p>

<p>Also, Mich also has an Honors Program, not an Honors College.</p>

48

<p>Your are right -- sorry. An honors program not college.</p>

49

<p>Went over these suggestions with my son. Based on his very extensive sports knowledge and a few anecdotes from older classmates, he would like to visit the following schools (still keeping Michigan, with the possibility of the Residential/Honors Colleges, at the top of the list):</p>

<p>Michigan
Northwestern
Wisconsin
Vanderbilt
Georgetown
UC Berkeley (we're in-state - that's why he eliminated USC and UCLA - too close to home)
Dartmouth
Williams?</p>

<p>He acknowledged Stanford and Duke would be wonderful, but longshots. Will have to wait for SAT scores to get a better idea.</p>

50

<p>neurotic, I'd try to see Williams and Amherst to give you and your son an idea of what LACs are all about. Georgetown seems like the odd man out on your son's list but maybe there's another underlying reason like politics?</p>

<p>Garland, I dunno, I'd say walking between the two UMich campuses would not be practical on a daily basis. The art school is on North Campus now too so we spent quite a bit of time looking it over. It had expanded exponentially since I was there decades ago. We were told that firstyears could be randomly assigned to dorms in North Campus even if their majors were not based there. Maybe we misunderstood?</p>

<p>Don't get me wrong. Michigan provides a wonderful education, but it's big and comes with the pluses and the minuses inherent to its size.</p>

51

<p>neuroticparent,
I have posted often about colleges that I believe offer the very best undergraduate experiences through their provision of highest-tier academics, active and varied social life, and energetic and national quality athletic program and accompanying “scene.” IMO, there are only a handful of colleges that can provide all three:</p>

<p>A few months back, I created a thread called “Fabulous Academics…and Fun! Excitement! Drama!” A lot of the factors that you are looking for were discussed. Here is the link:</p>

<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=365636&page=9%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=365636&page=9&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>In that thread, I created a Honor Roll of colleges that had both academic and athletic excellence as measured by the USNWR rankings and the NCAA Directors Cup. I think that your son would be happiest at one of these colleges:</p>

<p>THE HONOR ROLE*<strong><em>THE HONOR ROLE</em></strong>*THE HONOR ROLE</p>

<p>STANFORD (#4 USNWR and #1 Directors Cup)-This is one of the premier academic institutions in the country and they combine this with an athletic program that has won the Directors Cup for 13 straight years. Good times to be had at Stanford Stadium, Maples Pavilion, Sunken Diamond, and multiple other world-class athletic venues. National champs in Women’s Cross Country and Mens Golf. </p>

<p>DUKE (#8 USNWR and #11 Directors Cup)-This is Stanford’s closest peer with equally outstanding academics and students and a (mens and womens) basketball program to die for. Top rivalry in college basketball might be Duke-North Carolina, particularly games at Cameron Indoor Stadium which is considered the premier venue in all of college hoops.</p>

<p>NORTHWESTERN (#14 USNWR and #30 Directors Cup)-The premier academic school in the Big 10, the womens sports at Northwestern are terrific (back-to-back national championships in lacrosse!) and the football team, with games at Ryan Field, won the Big 10 in 2000 and has been to 3 bowl games since 2000. </p>

<p>VANDERBILT (#18 USNWR and #33 Directors Cup)-The premier academic school in the SEC, the baseball team was ranked #1 in the country for much of this past season and the basketball team reached the Sweet 16 and also had a 20-point victory at home in Memorial Gym over national champion U Florida. I bet that was a LOT of fun. </p>

<p>NOTRE DAME (#20 USNWR and #22 Directors Cup)-Superb academics and proudest football tradition in the country. The football team is a consistent contender for the national title and seeing a game in South Bend is exciting with frequently spectacular finishes. I mean, does it get more fun than beating UCLA in the last 30 seconds?!Attending a college football game at ND will have you loving the team (and the school) for the rest of your life (and maybe beyond). </p>

<p>UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA-BERKELEY (#21 USNWR and #9 Directors Cup)-Watching a football game from the top of Memorial Stadium with the views all around is a magical experience and fun, fun, fun! With a nationally competitive football team (#14 last year) and national champs in water polo and rugby (23rd championship), this school’s combination of top academics and top athletics truly is impressive and fun. </p>

<p>U MICHIGAN (#24 USNWR and #4 Directors Cup)-Always ranked as one of the top public universities, U Michigan combines this academic strength with a fantastic athletic department and sports excitement that very, very few schools can match. U Michigan’s Big House seats over 110,000 for Wolverine football and the team consistently competes for the Big Ten and national titles. Great athletic breadth with Top 10 finishes in 11 sports. </p>

<p>U VIRGINIA (#24 USNWR and #13 Directors Cup)-Since 1991, USNWR has ranked U Virginia 1st or 2nd every year among public universities and the school’s athletic programs (especially lacrosse and soccer) are equally competitive at the national level. New basketball arena is thought by many to be the best in the country and ACC games (both boys and girlz) are electric. </p>

<p><strong><em>HONORABLE MENTION</em></strong></p>

<p>UCLA (#26 USNWR and #2 Directors Cup) </p>

<p>USC (#27 USNWR and #5 Directors Cup)</p>

<p>U NORTH CAROLINA (#27 USNWR and #3 Directors Cup)</p>

<p>WAKE FOREST (#30 USNWR and #23 Directors Cup)</p>

<p>U WISCONSIN (#34 USNWR and #16 Directors Cup)</p>

<p>GEORGIA TECH (#38 USNWR and #46 Directors Cup)</p>

<p>U WASHINGTON (#42 USNWR and #29 Directors Cup)</p>

<p>U FLORIDA (#47 USNWR and #6 Directors Cup)</p>

<p>U TEXAS (#47 USNWR and # 8 Directors Cup)</p>

52

<p>Momrath--agree that walking would be strenuous, I was just trying to convey that we're not talking a big distance. And again, except for a few schools (add in art school) the bulk of the U is on the main campus.</p>

<p>I think that NP's kid has a great list to work on!</p>

53

<p>neuroticparent,</p>

<p>Duke is no harder to get in than Dartmouth or Williams. But I agree Stanford is incredibly difficult to get in especially if you are from CA.</p>

54

<p>Neuroticparent,
Re your political comment and interest in a liberal environment, I also suggest you consider the political diversity of the students and the professors and let that be your guide rather than the geographic setting of the school. The top six all-around colleges in the Southeast (Duke, Rice, Vanderbilt, U Virginia, U North Carolina, Wake Forest) may be located in conservative, Red states, but each has broad cross-sections of political thinking among their students. Wake is probably the most conservative, but the other five have plenty of diversity and room for a variety of political views among their students. </p>

<p>There was a thread on this not too long ago:</p>

<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=366539&highlight=facebook+political%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=366539&highlight=facebook+political&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

55

<p>Coming from California be sure to consider climate.The Upper Midwest has hot/humid to cold/snow... The South will have hot/humid weather- neither is dry like CA. Make sure you visit during the worst, not best, weather. A day of mountain skiing is not the same as spending 2 months in winter conditions without a break. Despite climate differences your son can thrive anywhere if he chooses. Also make sure to visit while classes are in session.</p>

56

<p>Hawkette - Thanks so much for the sports thread. Very informative - and entertaining...lots of witty repartee and insight into the sports-obsessed mind. Looking forward to reading the whole thing - It will be better than any college book in helping my son come up with a list. </p>

<p>wis75 - You are so right about the weather. There are many stories at our school about kids who come back to UCSB after one semester at NYU or Tufts. My son has traveled a lot and is very resilient, says he'll be fine in a harsh climate, but I will look into scheduling a few visits in the winter.</p>

57

<p>Hawkette- great info. Nothing wrong with a kid wanting to combine academics and a big sports scene. I think your list is great even though you left off PSU (Director's Cup #13 USNWR #48). IMO, their excellent honors college puts them over the edge for those students who can get in. Especially for those in state (like us!).<br>
Regarding sports, my son, now a sophomore at PSU, knows quite a few students who are clueless about sports but LOVE the football games and the atmosphere. It's really hard to describe. Everyone wearing their colors and coming together to make noise for their team in a huge stadium. It inspires community and loyalty for sure. We went to a game this fall and I can't tell you how many old couples we saw at the game - holding hands, having fun - some as old or older than JoePa. The whole stadium was white. It's pretty cool. But hard to understand for those who "hate" sports.<br>
To the OP, you have a great list. Be sure to check out those honors college and programs. Good luck to your son!</p>

58

<p>toneranger,
You are absolutely correct about Penn State. Not sure how I missed that one and I will include it in the future. I know their Schreyer Honors Program well and the students in that program are every bit as strong as those at the non-HYP Ivies. As for their athletic scene, on TV I saw their "White-out" for the Notre Dame game. WOW! In retrospect, the win wasn't so great, but the scene was absolutely marvelous and undoubtedly a ton of fun for truly anyone there, sports fan or not. </p>

<p>Neuroticparent,
Sometimes people (particularly those who attended schools that can't offer this type of experience) think or argue that you have to be a sports fan to go to or follow these games, but I can tell you and others that that is just not the case. For me, the games are secondary to the fun and the people and the pageantry and the electricity of the "scene." And the effect of these high profile sporting teams on a college campus can be HUGE, eg, look at the galvanizing effect that Georgetown's basketball team has on that campus every year and especially last year as they went to the Final Four. Or at Rice where their baseball team spent time at #1 in the country and then advanced to the National Semi-finals. </p>

<p>I think your son is going to have a lot of fun with the athletic scene during his four years of college while still getting a fabulous academic experience. Heck, I get jealous just thinking about it. :)</p>

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<p>When I first got to Umich, I was clueless about football. I was also dirt poor. What I did was sell my tickets for the "big" games (Ohio State, ND, MSU), and attend the blowout games just for the fun and excitement of it. Nothing like a perfect autumn football Saturday, a packed stadium, the band, the cheerleaders (male--more like gymnasts) and the crowd for a great afternoon--oh, and apparently there was a game going on, too!</p>

60

<p>I second the message from wis75 about the weather being a factor for a California kid. I took my (Northern California-based) sister to visit New England colleges in February. The same girl who was scoffing about how she was used to cold weather (skiing) was stunned by how cold it really it is to walk around a college campus in the dead of winter. She chose Berkeley. This is an issue every year for kids from our California high school who visit at spring break or summer and who never experience life in the snow until their first miserable winter. One mom I know promised her child a Hawaiian vacation every winter of college if the student went to a school in New England.</p>