Hi,
I’ll be applying to colleges this fall but really cant decide where to apply Early Decision. So far, Kenyon seems to be my favorite college in terms of campus, social life, community, resources and financial aid. For a student with my background and particular circumstances (cant go into detail here), Kenyon is really THE best college for me to apply Early Decision to. There’s just one catch. It doesn’t offer my intended major : Computer Science.
Ok, its not like im dead set on studying computer science. I wish to explore a lot of fields in college including English, which Kenyon is famous for, but I want to get a Science degree, and i have both experience and aptitude for Computer science. I really love computer science BUT I am not too sure if i want a career in it. Meanwhile, I am also REALLY into Physics but once again, need to explore it in college to know whether i want it as my career. Kenyon offers Physics. It also offers Mathematics and a concentration called “Scientific Computing”. Should I give up my Computer science degree option to apply to Kenyon and possibly be a Physics major?
Can i change fields in my Masters if i have a Bachelors in Physics and apply for a Computer Science masters degree? I do believe that i can learn programming and coding on my own in college, but will that be enough to land me a programming job? I have seen Kenyon’s limited Computer-related courses and a potential CS minor they plan to start. Should i take the risk and go to Kenyon, discover whether i really like Physics or not (i might even love it. i just need to experience what it means to be a Physicist), teach myself coding?
Or should i choose a different college (there’s none as much suited for me as Kenyon) that offers both Physics and CS and go from there.
Although physics graduates do sometimes go into computing jobs, they do need to learn the needed CS on their own, which is more difficult for most people than learning it with instructors in the structure of a CS major (although physics majors, with stronger logic/math skills, tend to do better at such CS self-education than biology, business, etc. majors).
Suggestion:
- Do not apply ED anywhere. Apply RD (or non-binding EA) to all of the colleges on your list.
- Try self-studying CS at https://cs10.org/ and https://cs61a.org/ . See if you (a) like CS to want to study it, and (b) whether you are sufficiently motivated to study it on your own.
Based on the answers to 2(a) and 2(b), you then can make a more informed decision in April:
Yes/Yes: You are interested in CS. Attending Kenyon and self-studying CS (obviously beyond those two introductory courses) is a possibility, but it is still likely better from a CS standpoint to attend an affordable college with a good CS major if you have that option.
Yes/No: You are interested in CS. But if you are not motivated enough to study it on your own, then it is unlikely that you will be able to move into computing after attending Kenyon.
No/whatever: You are not interested in CS. This means that the absence of a CS major at Kenyon is no longer important in your decision.
The “Scientific Computing” major looks fine. Check out the after Kenyon section here @ https://www.kenyon.edu/academics/departments-programs/scientific-computing/after-kenyon/
The interdisciplinary approach to learning is a good one! All majors should be interdisciplinary. Some of us think of that as a LA education. Many traditional STEM universities even agree with the interdisciplinary trend, but are just approaching from a different historical direction. See Harvey Mudd and WPI.
I promise that there is no one perfect school for you. Consider what it is you like about Kenyon, and find other colleges which share those traits and have your desired major. A college is not a good fit if it does not have your major, regardless of how prestigious it may be.
hey, thanks for replying.
I have already studied CS online, (courses, youtube, programming tutorials) and really love coding. But I lack perspective since i havent really experienced physics in that way at all. Also, when i think of being a researcher in a lab vs going to the office to do programming everyday, Physics appeals MUCH more to me.
I am afraid I HAVE to apply ED. I am an international student requiring huge amounts of aid. Although my profile and stats make me competitive for top 30 schools, my financial need puts me at a huge disadvantage. And kenyon is a college students from my school have been accepted to in previous years with HUGE financial awards. My counselor recommends I apply there ED, since international applicants dont get much financial aid in Regular Decision. In light of that, would you change your answer?
“ucbalumnus” makes a good point: compare the Kenyon program @ https://www.kenyon.edu/directories/offices-services/registrar/course-catalog-2/course-requirements/requirements-scientific-computing/ and courses offered at WPI in CS @ https://www.wpi.edu/academics/departments/computer-science
WPI '67
@ucbalumnus @roycroftmom @retiredfarmer
Yeah i looked at the After Kenyon section and it looks really promising. Looks like even one physics major became a software engineer. While scientific computing graduates went into CS-related fields.
However, since I have no idea what studying for a degree in a US college means, I would really like to know if it would hurt my chances of CS jobs if i have a Physics major. The real question now is whether to be safe and choose a CS+Physics offering college or be a Physics major + Computing minor at a loved college that will be affordable.
P.S. applying to any other college for ED for me would be a bad move, since financial aid is really competitive and out of all aid-offering colleges, my counselor has assessed (from decades of past experience) that I stand the best chance at Kenyon
This is ridiculous. Yes, as an international needing lots of financial aid, you are in a difficult position. Why that points specifically to Kenyon of all the colleges in the US that might offer you aid is a mystery. Your counselor’s experience counts for something, but his or her view seems far too narrow considering that Kenyon doesn’t even have your major.
Kenyon claims to meet full need for international students and that should apply to RD as well as ED, although acceptance RD vs ED is another matter, as Kenyon is not need-blind for internationals.
Perhaps if you post your stats, you might get suggestions on alternatives that might also offer you aid and have your major.
Also consider colleges that would give you automatic merit scholarships for your level of stats.
With respect to physics, Kenyon, with its nine listed faculty and recent Apker Award finalist, could suit your interests in this field really well.
As to whether there’s only one college in the U.S. at which you could successfully enroll, even as an international applicant with financial constraints, well, I’ve never heard of that.
@evergreen5 i think you are confusing US student applications with international ones. The admissions process is vastly different for internationals, since ability to pay matters MOST to almost all US colleges. The is NO university that gives automatic merit scholarships to internationals worth the college’s cost of attendance or even full tuition. And also, there are about 40 colleges that meet full need for internationals, but competition at about 20 of these (ivies, stanford, mit, etc) is INSANE and the rest are LACs most of which (like Williams, Swarthmore, Bryn Mawr) only accept 1-2 students at max from each country (proven by my country’s history of acceptances, all of which are posted by schools online, also evidenced by my school’s counselors and by the fact that my school is about the only one in the country that teaches students how to apply to US. Other schools dont even aim for any foreign universities).
I have a 1520 SAT and 4.0 (4 scale) GPA. Unique ECs that prove my passions and my commitment to them, essays that show a very deep, personal side of me, and most likely good letter of recommendations.
But the fact is, i am not a US applicant. Students with profiles better than mine get rejected from everywhere each year. I know because I have asked dozens of them directly or through my school’s counselor. The ones that do get accepted mostly have no or very low financial need. Only Kenyon and a few other colleges have been known to give full aid to my country’s students in the past decades, and out of all those, Kenyon is the one with least international applicants and highest chances for me. Remember, for me getting financial aid is more important than ANYTHING else, because the chances of that are like winning a lottery.
Also, once again, my country and school’s history of acceptances PROVE that full financial aid is only given out in Early Decision rounds mostly. Students with perfect scores and mind blowing ECs get straight rejected in Regular rounds each year. I have been waned by many not to make the same mistake
@evergreen5 Also, I have talked directly with admissions counselors from top LACs and they advised that I should apply Early as there is more financial aid then. And moreover, you can go to the websites of most full need covering colleges and see their stats. For example, Vassar clearly states that they have about international applicants asking for aid each year, and about 30-40 are accepted. And its common sense that all 30-40 would be from different countries since colleges like to boast of the countries their student bodies represent. They cant just have 40 Indians or 50 Chinese students
.
Even after reading what you’ve posted, it still might seem that affordable options with CS majors could range from Mt. Holyoke to Hamilton to Grinnell. Admission to these schools would be highly competitive, though for any particular student in any given year, perhaps no more difficult than you’d encounter at Kenyon.
Two examples off the top of my head:
UAH would automatically give you full tuition plus two years of housing https://www.uah.edu/admissions/undergraduate/financial-aid/scholarships/freshmen (and yes, this applies to international students https://www.uah.edu/admissions/undergraduate/financial-aid/scholarships/international)
U Kentucky has a competitive scholarship for which you would be eligible to apply, full tuition plus 10k per year housing stipend http://www.uky.edu/financialaid/scholarship-incoming-freshmen
In addition, Alabama would give you 26k out of 43k total cost of attendance (nearly full tuition, leaving you with cost of room and board) https://gobama.ua.edu/international/scholarships/
Likewise, U Arizona would give you 35k out of the 53k total cost of attendance (tuition 36k) https://admissions.arizona.edu/cost-aid/international/international-tuition-award
https://admissions.arizona.edu/cost-aid/international
These aren’t the only schools, either. A place like U Buffalo might give you full tuition, though it doesn’t look automatic - unsure. This takes a little digging.
Check your ED rules to be sure, but you should probably be able to apply to these while waiting for your ED decision (because they are public universities), and they may have “priority” deadlines that occur prior to hearing your ED answer. Regardless of where you ED, you should have financial safeties.
Yes, you are in a difficult spot and yes, admission and aid are super competitive for internationals, and it’s good that you are being realistic. I can see the panic in your post. But, if you want the option to study CS, you have alternatives to Kenyon. It just seems shortsighted to ED to a school that doesn’t have your potential major for the sole reason that it’s the one your counselor/country has the most experience with.
@evergreen5 thanks for replying. i looked at those universities and have researched all these schools a lot over the past year. But no school have i found that promises full cost of attendance as an automatic scholarship, which is my most basic need. i literally cant attend without the full cost covered, since my parents’ income is around $30K and that too with 5 children.
Although i will be applying to a looot of colleges in Regular if i dont make it in ED just to improve my aid chances, I am beginning to see that Kenyon may not be that good of an idea. I’ll look at similar schools and try to find one that would be least competitive for me while fitting my criteria. Honestly, my only hope is the knowledge that other students in my position have succeeded in this process before me, just like that recent thread about the Greek Harvard applicant.
Ill work as hard as I have to. I just dont want to attend a university in my own country (there are only three with any substantial academics, and their atmosphere is super toxic: racism, extremism, discrimination, especially against someone like me ;a minority)
Kenyon College is a great idea if it is the only affordable option that you are offered. Especially so in light of your school’s relationship with Kenyon College & your counselor’s support.