<p>everyone is under the assumption that I got into a better private uni</p>
<p>Hahahaha… My son turned down Harvey Mudd for Berkeley and has not regretted his decision for one moment. It’s a personal choice. Do what you feel is best for you. You’ll make the right decision.</p>
<p>shadowzoid. the cards are dealt buddy. you have to play them. if you can’t graduate in 4 years i’d say that’s more a reflection on you rather than on the school. especially since many of us are well on track to graduate in that time with double majors and some people even strive to graduate early.</p>
<p>So if I have everything planned out, then I should be able to graduate on time? Because I heard there were waiting lists and stuff like that. THAT’S why some people cannot graduate in four years, even though they try to.</p>
<p>Planning in advance is important and so is being able to dynamically adjust your plan as needed. People who don’t graduate on time don’t consider enough alternative plans and don’t research enough in advance. If there’s an upper division class that you need for graduation and you know it’s impacted, start signing up for it in your sophomore or junior years.</p>
<p>See, that’s the problem. In the US system, we are allowed to wait until junior year to pick a major. It is one of the things that makes US colleges special. If Berkeley doesn’t allow that, I might as well go to school in Canada, which will only be like 15k.</p>
<p>I’ve rethought this situation and i figured maybe I was worrying too much. The kids who tend to have to graduate in 5 years. What kind of students are they? Are they the stereotypical jock type? the answer is obviously going to be a generalization</p>
<p>mickjagger - there are waiting lists for some classes. My son was on one this past semester but he did get in. You just need to have different plans for different situations and be willing to take a class during a time you might not like (ie. 8:00 on a Friday). My son has been able to get every class he has needed.</p>
<p>scared because there are waiting lists? are you kidding me, how old are you? maybe if you’re from an affluent area or culture where “waiting” doesn’t exist, you would not be able to adjust to berkeley. telebears is very stressful: a lot of waiting and patience and pulling strings is necessary if you want to get into a popular class. this isn’t preschool where they spoon feed it to you and then pat you on the back and call you “responsible” or “motivated.”</p>
<p>i’ve gotten into all my classes and THEN some (even popular AND restricted courses: reserved for jr/sr as a soph-standing student). yes i’ve had to take 8 am classes. yes i’ve had to meet up with advisers and counselors (and sometimes even lie a little) to get me into a class i wanted to take. yes some semesters my schedule is atrocious and can get messy. but never have i ever been squeezed by the pressure to get into a class. i’ve never gone to summer school in my life. and yes, i’m on schedule to double major (two totally unrelated majors to boot) and graduate in 4 years.</p>
<p>the amount of whining by you all is ridiculous. again, if you can’t finish in 4 years, maybe something important came up or there was a big incident in your life that may affect your ability to give your full attention to school. maybe you work full time AND go to school full time. maybe you just dont want to graduate so you wont have to face looking for a job so you stick around another semester. IDK. but if nothing outstanding happens, and you don’t graduate in 4 years (even though you WANT to), that again, is a reflection on… —dun dun dunnn-- you! </p>
<p>if so many people can graduate in 4 years: why. can’t. you. </p>
<p>talk about epic fail. and if you do fail, i don’t think anyone would honestly say you didn’t deserve it.</p>
<p>Like others have said, golden tip is to plan it out and have several backups. Try to plan so that if everything goes perfectly, you can graduate in 3.5yr and have a little fun your final semester. Although, that last semester is crucial if anything goes seriously wrong.</p>
<p>Don’t be set on only taking a very specific set of upper division classes. Be very flexible so that you’ll still end up in a good set of classes and remain on track (or even ahead) towards your goal despite not getting the exact classes you want.</p>
<p>Also, the waitlist isn’t that big of an issue. The idea is that with the two-phase Telebears, everyone signs up for up to 11 units during the first phase and the rest during the second phase. This way, if you really need to take some classes, be sure to sign up for it in Phase I, where you will almost always be guaranteed to get in. Then, you do the less critical classes in Phase II. After that, you play your chances with the waiting lists and hope you get lucky – chances are, you will get lucky, especially in majors like CS where up to 50% of the class drop / change schedules in the first couple weeks.</p>
<p>crowslayer91’s experience basically sums it up – you can easily do it if you are responsible; the forces only go against you if you try to pull something reckless, such as trying to do 13 units per semester and cramming all your requirements into your final year.</p>
<p>@crowslayer: your views are very one-sides. Yes, it’ll take effort to get the classes you want and life demands effort, but your portrayal of life is so biased that it’s ridiculous. First of all, competition isn’t a prerequisite of success. In America, competition is valued because of the self-made mentality. This feeling is further emphasized by the rise of Asian immigrants, who are influenced by the merit-based civil exams that China used in the past. How about in other countries? In Sweden, equality is valued over competition. There is actually a Swedish word, lagom, that doesn’t exist in any other language. It means moderation, but the connotation is that moderation is better than excess, even victory in some cases. What’s the result? Well Sweden has a strong economy for one. Better than CA for sure. There are other countries that follow a system like this; countries with a strong Social Democrat presence. Furthermore, these countries, including the rest of Scandinavia, and Canada some-what, are constantly ranked “happier” by whatever rankings that do that. </p>
<p>Furthermore, neurologically a lot of behavior is determined by genetics. In some cases, it is mentality IMPOSSIBLE for a person to learn basic algebra, no matter how hard he tries. Even if he spent a billion years learning it, he won’t be able to. This is objective science</p>
<p>Competition may be required at Berkeley, and maybe our baby-ish attitude will lead to our demise at UCB, but don’t talk like those who can’t compete are inherently inferior. A person may not be Berkeley-material, but they are still valued human beings with different strengths that you wouldn’t be able to match.</p>
<p>But anyway, I do respect your drive. What are your double majors? Also, I really want to study abroad. Could I do this without doing summer school or a 5th year? </p>
<p>@ExcelBlue: Won’t you have trouble catching up if you’re waitlisted for even a week? Also, by planning, are you saying I should know my major the first day I walk in?</p>
<p>You can still attend classes that you are waitlisted for. Just continue to attend lectures/discussions as you would any other class. Email or talk to the Prof and GSI (TA) and let them know that you are on the waitlist but you really want to get into the class and your reasons etc etc. The prof may choose to bump you off the waitlist if there’s still some space. A small percentage of students will usually drop the class a couple of weeks into the semester and you may also be able to get in if you aren’t too far down the waitlist. </p>
<p>The main trouble I’ve faced regarding waitlists is when students are moved off the waitlist manually. This means priority is given to juniors and seniors who need the class to satisfy graduation reqs. As a sophomore trying to graduate early, this hurts a lot since even with a good position on the waitlist, there’s no guarantee of making it into the class even though I also need the class for major reqs. This shouldn’t be an issue for you if you intend to fully utilize your 4 years here.</p>
<p>By planning, I think excelblue means to plan out a 3/4 year roadmap with the classes you intend/need to take each semester in order to graduate so that you don’t find yourself taking random classes every semester that don’t count towards your major. Personally, I planned out all the classes needed to fulfill my double major at the end of my freshman year. I’ve had to make changes many times because of time conflicts and trouble getting off waitlists but as long as you provide yourself with enough alternatives and don’t restrict yourself to certain electives you will be fine. </p>
<p>If you’re undecided as to what you should major in, you can try completing overlapping pre-reqs for the majors that you’re interested in and the 7 breadth classes required for L&S. Try completing the 7breadth reqs by taking classes within the majors you’re interested in as well so as to get a better feel for the major while completing other grad reqs. Common overlapping pre-reqs include lower-div math classes such as the 1/16 series. Google the prereqs for the majors you’re interested in (available on the dept websites) and start planning early.</p>
<p>The only people I know who are graduating in more than 4 years are those who decide to switch majors in their junior/senior year and have to start completing prereqs/reqs anew.</p>
<p>Studying abroad is certainly viable without having to resort to summer school in order to stay on track for graduation. Just make sure that the classes you take count towards your major/grad reqs.</p>
<p>Some people have claimed that students staying an extra year or working over the summer is an exception…</p>
<p>I’d like to point out the rather depressing truth that the four year graduation rate at Berkeley is about 50%. The six year graduation rate is about 87%.</p>
<p>Staying more than four years is hardly rare, and hardly an exception.</p>
<p>That being said, I agree with everything most posters here are saying. You are completely able to graduate in four years. Talk with your major advisors, decide on a major quickly (I think a lot of students spend too much time dabbling in other classes to decide what they are interested in, which is fine, but realize that you should be “on track” by your sophomore year, or work over the summer), plan things out, etc.</p>
<p>As another poster mentioned, getting into classes is never a problem if you’re determined (sometimes you have to e-mail advisors, etc.) and willing to be a bit flexible with your schedule.</p>
<p>I know that California is running low on money, and California universities have accepted more students to get more money. </p>
<p>But how does that negatively affect students who decide to enroll? Could someone point out the negatives? I am actually not sure.</p>
<p>@ shadowzoid, i’m doubling in applied math and business. & yes i understand where you’re coming from, but i’m trying to convince you that the answer to your question “should i worry about the CA deficit when choosing UCB” is “no” because although life here can be tough at times, there are many ways to make sure that hopefully <em>you</em> are not the one who has a boot up his arse at the end of it all come graduation day 2015 (you’re class of 2015, yes?).</p>
<p>if you plan on studying abroad, just try to align it well with your studies. </p>
<p>[as for your comment about american competitive culture: yes it’s not fair, but if The People wanted “fair”, we’d be chillin with our pals down in Cuba, over in NorKor, or maybe even up at 'Nam. Yes, american culture may be unfair and it is unfortunate that many people who cannot “compete” are often belittled (though they do find their place in the workforce, it’s hard to think of jobs where employees who don’t have the capacity to comprehend simple algebra can be given bigger responsibilities and higher wages), but it’s a de facto culture. if you want to spearhead the revolution, i’d say go for it. ]</p>
<p>either way, here’s a good question: why do some students not graduate in 4 years?
here are a few of my answers:
-double/triple majoring in unrelated areas
-adding/changing majors late in the game
-undecided major by junior year (may be even by soph if it’s a major with many reqs)
-difficult major, so the student looks for a lighter course load and stretches to 9 semesters. (read: EECS)
-working full time while going to school
-incident out of student’s control forcing him/her to leave school or attend only part time.
-scared of going into a crap economy and not getting a job, so why not stay in school? (assuming they can’t get into grad school without work experience, or they don’t want to go to grad school)</p>
<p>this is probably the most concise anyone can get as far as advice goes: [Four</a> Ways to Graduate in Four Years - Fastweb](<a href=“http://www.fastweb.com/student-life/articles/549-four-ways-to-graduate-in-four-years]Four”>http://www.fastweb.com/student-life/articles/549-four-ways-to-graduate-in-four-years)
IMO, if <em>you</em> follow that, you have very high odds of graduating in 4 years, regardless of the CA deficit.</p>
<p>I live in CA, and follow the state budget…so, financially, plan on an average 5% to 7% increase in fees every year for the 4 years and you should be safe. It should be that or less, hopefully. But our state budget is and continues to be a huge mess.</p>
<p>bump this thread up, very interesting discussions that alleviate my potential worries</p>
<p>Haha. My excitement for attending Berkeley changes each time I read a new post. Silvern mentions an interesting statistic. Can anyone say more about that, especially those who say it is an exception?</p>
<p>And I think I’ve made the mistake of assuming everyone in all non-CA state schools graduate in 4 years, which is obviously false. Can someone make a sweeping generalization about, out of 10 people, how many would graduate in four years in Berkeley as opposed to someone from a state school like Pittsburgh or Maryland? It will be a generalization with no basis, but I want some number to work with so I know what the perception of 5 year graduates are.</p>
<p>bump
10char</p>
<p>I forgot to mention in my last post…Those statistics (50% 4-year graduate rate, 87% 6-year graduation rate) are a bit confusing. Berkeley automatically considers anyone who takes even one class over the summer to be a 5th year student if they graduate “on time” with the rest of their graduating class (i.e. not a semester early). That probably has a huge effect on the numbers, because very few students use summer classes to graduate early, electing instead to graduate with the rest of their class in May (often times simply for timing purposes - graduating in December isn’t as “exciting” because there are far fewer students with you).</p>