<p>momma-three, you’re putting words in my mouth. I never said that there should be no need-based aid to help kids go to college. I’m all for it. In fact, I received need-based aid to attend college at a SUNY. </p>
<p>I object to your notion that my kids (or anyone else) should not be eligible for MERIT scholarships, solely because we can afford to pay for college. I think of it as a “50% off” coupon for tuition. Don’t you use 50% off coupons for items that you are otherwise able to pay full price?</p>
<p>Seeing Greta’s post and link, I believe that was the situation for us with D1. Through some algorithm/experience/guessing, the admissions people decided what amount of merit aid would lure D1 to Ursinus. It worked. Without the 16K merit scholarship, she would have headed to a school where we would be full-pay, no merit aid offered, COA = 28K/yr. Instead, she is at Ursinus and we pay 30K+/yr. </p>
<p>Being “able” to pay $45K+ per year for college and being willing to pay that much are two different things.</p>
<p>Maybe part of our 30K is subsidizing D1’s classmates who receive need-based aid. Not as much as if we were paying full sticker price, but then again without the merit aid D1 would have gone elsewhere.</p>
<p>mrsref - I really don’t understand why people make comments like those of momma-three. We went through college by taking out huge loans and worked hard to pay them off. We work hard to earn a comfortable living, give 10% to our church, anonymously pay the private HS tuition of a couple of kids, anonymously pay the athletic fees for those who cannot, and make alumni donations to our colleges. Yet still, we are classified by some as bad rich people.</p>
<p>Momma-three should be happy that the merit aid given to “rich” kids is enough incentive to attract full pay kids. Without them, there would be a heck of a lot less money to give out in financial aid. </p>
<p>Sorry to highjack the thread, I just had to get this off my chest.</p>
<p>^ agree totally Kj. I’ve found if you aren’t blatant about your giving/donations/ vol. time - whatever, then it doesn’t “count.” Behaving with grace is your reward.</p>
<p>Agreed. What I object to is the idea that students without need should not be considered for merit aid at colleges that offer it. In our case, Ursinus used OPM to award D1 merit aid, but they got to make that decision.</p>
<p>This is what got me irritated:</p>
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<p>We don’t qualify for need-based aid, but we are not “blessed” enough to fork over an extra $64K for someone else to attend Ursinus.</p>
<p>Some of us gave up a lot in order to make the money to allow our kids to go to any schools they want. I would consider some of my money as blood money. Yes, it irks me when people say money should only be given to kids (or really parents) who need the money. Well, my kids have also worked hard in HS, and if their marks could get them some merit money, then they are entitled to it as much as the next kid. K-12 is free education, but college education is a privilege, not an entitlement.</p>
<p>I think it is easy for FA stressed folks who see that a famiily that “has no financial need” to think that all such families are on easy street. In reality, with income/wealth distribution in this country, you are really talking about the top 1% - 2% who can “just write the check” without sacrifice/pain. For a FA family struggling with EFC, maybe it helps to consider that full-pay families can be just as stunned coping with their EFCs </p>
<p>It’s always hard to understand the shoes we don’t walk in ourselves.</p>
<p>The scandinavian countries with socialist structures are doing very well, with standards of living and public health that put the good ole USA to shame.</p>
<p>And lets recall that virtually all of the “top tier” colleges CCers salivate over apply exactly that philosophy, with NO merit aid.</p>
<p>Yeah, it works great if you want that much government control over your life and if you want to pay 25% tax on EVERYTHING to support such a system.</p>
<p>It IS a false offer when you are told in person by the director of admissions that all awards stack, including need and merit, additionally that multiple merit awards stack, then you get the acceptance letter saying to take the highest merit award. We’ve already gotten the FA package and I am discouraged. We targeted this school and others like it based on the perception that merit would be beneficial to a family in our financial situation.Shame on me for thinking we might pay less than our EFC that we can’t afford, but that is certainly the impression I came away with after talking to the admissions officer. Given the number of pages in this thread, this is certainly a confusing topic for many, and it would be helpful to the parents and students for better disclosure, but that would likely decrease the number of applicants at a school. I’ve been on CC for a year now, and it’s the first time I have come across a thread that explained this the way I needed it explained, although I am pretty slow.</p>
<p>Susanr, Fallen and Dingle will undoubtedly toss you to our growing stupid people reject pile. We have a nice party going on, with a bigger boat on order – come party with us!!!</p>
<p>Hat made a nice point about <em>issue spotting</em> earlier; it is awfully hard (for lesser mortals than Fallen or Dingle) to know what questions to ask when the colleges play so close to the vest on how these programs really work. It is my specific experience that, even armed with the detailed knowledge gained on this thread, I had to press FinAid reps for the true interaction. Colleges absolutely gloss over this aspect.</p>
<p>And Greta’s post above about how strategic colleges are in touting these merit awards for “enrollment management” seal my view: there is a bait and switch element luring families on the front end at application time, only to have them face constrained options after application deadlines have passed.</p>
<p>I don’t believe it is helpful to form sides, or invite others to party boats, or otherwise divide the posters on the Parents Forum. We are here, I believe, because we all are doing our best to help our kids get into the best school (for them) at the least cost to us. Let us all stumble along and help each other to the best of our ability.</p>
<p>And, I am especially thankful to the posters with more wisdom and experience than I that continue to participate in the Parents Forum and share what they know so all can benefit. If that is you, you have my gratitude.</p>
<p>I happen to agree with this about many if not most schools, BUT not all schools do this. Some schools will give you an early read regarding financial aid, so I do not think that they are all out to “trick” the consumer. Many have online calculators that can give you an idea about what their package will look like. When they cannot get an early estimate to you after the student and parent has completed all financial aid forms, and want to wait until March or April rather than providing an estimate NOW, I wonder why! Having a kid deposit and registering for classes, attending orientation type of events, prior to supplying the financial details when requested, sends up red flags for me!</p>
<p>The people dying everyday for lack of healthcare would probably take that deal; and I’ve found very astute Dutch businessmen generally to be quite pleased with the quality of life and freedoms they enjoy. You don’t think the Dutch know how to kick some ass in enterprise? </p>
<p>But just saying there are alternative options out there that do work – in the USA we tend to thnk there is only one workable option, that being crony capitalism.</p>
<p>^ Crew, but I don’t think your quotes are from Smith’s website touting STRIDE. They are from a Smith student newspaper reporting on STRIDE. Congrats to you for your due diligence, but that’s a pretty obscure source to clarify the STRIDE program limitations.</p>
<p>Smith is an awesome college, and it is fantastic that it can guarantee full-need and ofer STRIDES. But it would be nice if it put the clear language of that student paper news article onto its STRIDE web description.</p>