<p>Our baseball experience with “verballing” is you can do it anytime you want as long as the school and athlete/parents are on the same page. It is like an engagement…the baseball coach says they want you, you tell the baseball coach you want them. It is agreed that you will apply to the school, get accepted and get some level of athletic scholarship. In November, you sign the NLI to make it official. We saw “verballing” happen almost exclusively with D1 schools from their spring sophomore year to fall of senior year. We saw this process happen about 25 times as my son’s travel team had 25 D1 recruits from their baseball organization. A verbal is your word, and the coaches word, nothing more nothing less. We only saw a couple cases where verballs were rescinded. Both cases that come to mind were the result of bad performance in the classroom and bad performance on the baseball field.</p>
<p>Getting back to the orginal thought, I’m very, very surprised that Stanford would post something on their website about a verballed athlete. Usually you see information pass about verbally committed athletes blogs and high school baseball websites. In my experience, I’ve never seen a school post a verball committment from an athlete until they sign the NLI. Very interesting that someone would do it., and more surprising that it is Stanford.</p>
<p>I think I may have not been clear
the high school web site has a big post about the kid
and ow the kid verballed to Stanford…it does explain the verbal means the kid will sign the NLI in the fall.</p>
<p>I am just so surprised as our student (not baseball) has not even been able to get a phone call from coaches kiddo is emailing–and one coach wouldn’t even have a conversation on the day before kiddo competed in an international event–citing NCAA regs and saying , please come back the afternoon or day after you compete etc…</p>
<p>Kiddos prospective schools/coaches have all been very very careful–
we will meet with 4 coaches and kiddo will watch practices, visit facilities etc
however, kiddo is not allowed to stay on campus, dine with team, etc </p>
<p>one coach sent a very helpful clear recruiting package, and the thre others have been equally good via email.</p>
<p>I just am very surprised
–I tried to find the baseball regs on the ncaa clearinghouse site and to find the calendar or recruiting…I know with swimming for D1s, a very large # already have their verbals done by spring jr yr and that its done with a AdCom review of the transcript through Jan of jr yr…and I know there have been a few football players lined up early…</p>
<p>Our kiddo’s sport is very low profile compared to most --just didn’t realize that it could go this fast – and before the end of Jr yr…</p>
<p>The student recruited to Stanford has excellent grades, top 10%.
Don’t know what level of rigor, however he is heavily involved in vol service as well…a bit of a hot head/wild child…Still I think an all around good student-athlete so this is not just a recruit for sport, the kid can surely handle the academics.</p>
<p>fogfog, I’m confused about this area of recruiting as well. My D is also in a sport where the coaches were very cautious about obeying the rules. We had very friendly, open unofficial visits on campuses during Junior year, but these same coaches were very careful to caution us that if they were to see us at athletic events during the Junior year spring season, they would wave and smile, and that would be the extent of the conversation, because of the rules. These same coaches sent friendly, congratulatory emails during the season, but completely held back on offers until July 1st. </p>
<p>At the same time, the soccer girls were verballing all over the place, during junior year. Maybe we need to start a new thread about which sports have a timeline involving early verbal commitments, and which seem to hold back until July. This probably varies by division, as well. It’s a mystery to me…</p>
<p>fog, it’s a high school site or newspaper or something that said the kid gave Stanford a verbal commitment or Stanford verbally committed or something like that, right?</p>
<p>it’s all bs. Harvard, Stanford, Duke, etcetera can not and will not commit anything before ncaa dates in each respective sport, and even after those dates they’re going to say something like this: we’re committed to you, we’re supporting you, BUT admission has to accept you first (which happens ONLY during the athletes senior year). There’s no such thing as a real commitment offered by an NCAA school before the rule dates. And there’s no such thing as a coach promising an athlete admittance to an elite school, only admissions does that…it’s called acceptance!</p>
<p>there is such a thing as a high school student saying something that’s not true, like “I’ve got a verbal commitment from Stanford”. what he or she has is a verbal interest and nothing more.</p>
<p>the soccer girls getting verbals from non elite schools are hearing something like this, “when it’s time to give you an offer I can assure you we will make you an offer and that admissions will accept you”</p>
<p>from elite schools:</p>
<p>“when it’s allowable to make you an offer I can assure you we will do so, BUT admissions still has to accept you”</p>
<p>this is the best you’ll ever get in this murky thing called “VERBALLING”</p>
<p>^^although it’s a very heady and powerful thing to be 16 years old and have a head coach from a big brand name school say they like you! And those types of “verbals” often do workout in the end. Just think of the hundreds or thousands of high school athletes who would love to have “that college coach” know their name.</p>
<p>It’s a big deal to have your kid on the radar of college coaches.</p>
<p>Actually Pacheight in football if you verbal to somewere like Stanford or Duke in Feb. of your junior yr, most kids get their acceptances before the end of junior yr. if they have good grades and good stndardized score.</p>
<p>Theres no need to rush like this in sports like track/xc because the kids arent going anywhere…and if they do they’ll just take someone else with around the same time and grades. In big time D1 football the process starts earlier, thats just the nature of it and what you have to do to land the big recruits. You can’t wait till senior yr, because the kid would have been to junior days and been offered and shown love all summer.</p>
<p>There is no violation of rules, Verbals are pretty legit…atleast in football. Rarely does the schol pull away, you see kids changing their choices though. Lets be honest, theres no need to rush and pick up a kid in a smaller sport if you know they’ll be there in senior yr. Plus D1 athletes arent held to a high academic standard, so its easy to see if the kid will get accepted or not.</p>
<p>Many offers are contingent on various thing such as a certain standardized score or keeping your GPA above a certain level. And these verbals come after an offer is received on paper. This isn’t some I like you, you like me, alright Ill come sort of thing. Although its not official, the offer is still on paper from the university.</p>
<p>i don’t know the rules for football. but in the sports i know there’s nothing formal until after July 1st.</p>
<p>agree verbals often workout but verbals are not real commitments and so when you hear a kid in his sophomore or junior year say he’s verbally committed to so and so, it doesn’t really mean anything…although as you say most do work out because those are generally the elite athletes having conversations that early with schools…although I still don’t know how a sophomore can talk to an ncaa coach without breaking the rules, in any sport</p>
<p>as far football recruits being admitted to Stanford or Duke or Harvard or even Cal or USC, etc their Junior year, I don’t believe that. I’ve never heard of that but maybe I’m clueless to football and that they have different ncaa and admission rules and processes from the rest of sports.</p>
<p>“football player… has to get into Stanford just like any other student”</p>
<p>that’s what I thought. And i know the ivies d3 football payers are held to the same rules, I would imagine Duke as well. And I know Cal and USC do the same thing, I don’t believe there are any exceptions.</p>
<p>from paloaltoonline:</p>
<p>As a parent of a Stanford football player, I can assure you that “finishing the application part” is critical. The athlete has to get into Stanford just like any other student. That is why when you see early commits to Stanford that end up at Cal or UCLA it is usually because when the “application part” is finished, they didn’t get in. That is why it is so amazing that Stanford competes in the PAC 10 at all.</p>
<p>First of all sophomores dont talk to coaches, the sophmores coach talks to the coaches. I don’t know how long ago that quote was made, but since Harbaugh as been there 2 of my friends have commited junior yr. They send in all the stuff the coach asks for in spring time. And the admissions office tells coach Harbaugh if they’re going to accept the kid.</p>
<p>The admissions office takes this responsibility seriosuly and hold true to their words. The kids that this lady is talking about are the kids who verballed to an offer that was contigent on there standardized test score. An example of this would be Louis Young who verballed to Stanford under the knowledge that he needed to improve a score. He didn’t, the offer was pulled, and he went to Gtech.</p>
<p>I know several baseball players who verbally committed in their junior year. The offer from the school was made after an early read by admissions of mid year (jr) transcripts and 1st round test scores. Two kids I know were told they would be admitted if the test scores increased by a certain number and grades stayed above a number. The others were told if everything academically stayed the same, they would be admitted. These were DI public schools.</p>
<p>I think that coaches in certain sports are more cautious about following the rules, while others push it to the limit of acceptability. In sports where recruiting takes place early in the senior year, there is less chance of loosing an athlete to an early verbal so coaches can follow the rules more closely without fear of losing their top prospects.</p>
<p>My daughter has also had a couple of coaches remind her that they may not talk to her off campus until July 1st, even though they will be at the same event. But I know baseball players that had contact with coaches in their sophomore and junior years at showcase events. And I witnessed a rising junior pitching for a recruiter with a speed gun! So I think much depends on the sport in question.</p>
<p>i agree with most of the above as well. i don’t agree that football or any other athlete was “in” their junior year. my daughter to was pre read in the spring by several schools and they say things like “you’ll be fine through admissions” or “admission likes what they see” even had more explicit language in an email from a top school that read like an acceptance, etc…but u still have to fill out an app in the fall and be accepted like all the other EA kids.</p>
<p>sure we knew she would get in to these schools in the spring but she still had to fill out an app at the one school she chose.</p>
<p>i will say that athletes like her only fill out 1 college application.</p>
<p>I guess the odd thing to me is the range of interpretation of exactly what constitutes “recruiting”. How in the world does a coach communicate to a junior that he’s made the team without “recruiting” him? My vague understanding, without going back to the rule book, is that unofficials are where students can express interest to a coach by making the visit, sharing athletic and academic stats, and generally talking about the team, how the coach handles athletes, see the facilities and so on. The athlete can ask what the coach is looking for in the next recruiting class, and maybe even how someone with his particular skills might fit in to those plans, but to take it much further than that is moving on to the slippery slope. The farewell speeches were something like, “we’re very interested in you, and you’ll be hearing from us in July.” I would never have characterized those conversations as a verbal commitment on either side. </p>
<p>I’ve always thought a verbal was like a pre LOI and that you only can verbal to one school. Further, as someone else has said on this thread, I always felt this only worked to the student’s disadvantage, because the coach can continue to go after higher ranking recruits, but the athlete may (often?) shut down communication to other schools, thinking they’ve made a commitment, and that it would look disingenuous to continue to put themselves out there to other coaches. This would be especially true if the verbal was announced in the paper, or on the nightly news.</p>
<p>I wonder what a coach has to do to inspire a sanction from the NCAA for recruiting violations in this area? I’d love to know, because I think we keep dancing around this question, and I’m sure lots of recruits are wondering the same thing…</p>
<p>I am also aware of many, many early verbals in junior year (and have heard of more in sophomore year though not as many).</p>
<p>More important though is getting through admissions, and that can be grueling even though all the test scores and gpas are fine. I am concerned about the expected timing of these applications. Are the applications completed in junior year as well? I was under the impression that that is what happens. </p>
<p>In addition, I suspect FAFSA has to be completed even though the athlete is not needy but is promised an athletic scholarship. Someone please correct me on this if I’m wrong. </p>
<p>I’m very grateful for this board. Learned a lot from all of you.</p>
<p>The kid I have the closest knowledge of verballed winter of junior year, to a flagship public D1 program. The offer was made during an unofficial visit. He had previously sent his mid year transcript, as well as SAT scores. The offer was contingent upon him keeping his GPA within a couple of tenths of were it was. There was no performance contingency. He was instructed to submit his application as soon as it was available and he received his acceptance letter the first of October. He signed his letter of intent in November. I know his parents filed a FAFSA because they had another child in college.</p>
<p>I agree with Pach-and stand by my previous comments. People who rely on verbal commitments can be screwed. People say they are verbally committed when they are hoping. The Ivies and the NESCACs don’t play any other way. Lots of people have been “led on”, but they’ll tell you-I changed my mind-or the money wasn’t as good as school B.</p>
<p>recruiting is like dating. there are phone calls, emails, and sometimes overnight stays:)</p>
<p>offers and verbals is when you fall in love. is it a good idea to tell more than one person you love them at the same time…generally not a good idea:)</p>
<p>and LL’s, NLI’s, and official acceptance to the college by amissions is the marriage ceremony.</p>
<p>and no one gets married before july 1.</p>
<p>and as old b will tell u, your not married until the ring is on and the marriage ceremony is over.</p>
<p>But the premise set up by NCAA is no sleeping together, no dating, and no talking until after junior year. So how is it that the engagement occurs?</p>
<p>You won’t really understand it until you son/daughter is being recruited for a big sport to a d1 non ivy. A verbal is more than, everything looks good… You’ll probably be accepted, and student saying cool I’m coming. Most of you are looking at it from a ivy/small sport outlook. There are ways to get around rules for major d1 sports. You can’t verbal to an ivy for track in junior yr because those coaches are on a different timeline. D1 football and ivy xc are really on totally different timelines. Even ivy football and other d1 football are on a different timeline.</p>