Smith College

Colleges and Universities A-Z Smith College
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<p>Ok a few comments, mainly on social life.</p>

<p>I applied to the Smith college with traditions and an emphasis on well...Smith College traditions! There have been very few in my eyes and have been replaced with things like "celebration" which celebrates gay/lesb/transgendered folk. Lovely. Now I have nothing against these people...but I dont see a day on the calendar that celebrates my straightness!! I want real tea, like they had in the past...that the upperclassmen had and raved about 'when they were first years." I want my house kitchen to be open for all meals so I actually get to know everyone in my house. Why doesnt Smith put money into things that Smith is known for like these traditions instead of appeasing a group of women (or so we think) who rant and rave about their sexuality. You all get the point.</p>

<p>Secondly, I think that Smith and the lesbian subject has to be addressed. They are a minority on campus, so you say. But here it feels like a majority. I've been involved in many ec's here and I'm by no means saying this happens in all of them. But, I have been asked "Why are you straight? Why don't you just turn lesbian or be bi for your fours years? Don't bother with boys..." and the like. A friend of mine has also been harassed about it--the upperclassmen in her hous ehave a bet on when she'll "come out" and have said things to her that are of this nature. Hell we have girls on campus that don't want to be called women but rather men, and sure do look like them. I'm no homophobe..but some of the things here make me downright uncomfortable. Smith just fuels the fire catoring to transgendered/lesbians etc on the campus because GOD forbid we hurt someones feelings. They just turned the Campus center bathrooms "gender neutral" a few days ago. Case in point.</p>

<p>In reference to someones previous comment on "girls who complain about lack of boys need to stop being lazy and get on the pvta" or something like that...oh PLEASE. I'm a first year and did that whole party thing the first few weeks here. It was a major no go. And I have been told by many that I'm very good looking. You mainly find drunk jocks that just want to put their hands on you and they think youre easy cuz you go to an all womens school. And when we do have parties here they are filled with the sketchiest of sketchy guys you can find. Example: we had to have pub safety throw a 29 year old drunk guy and his friend out of a party. Sure thats my idea of fun.</p>

<p>Academically this school is great! Great profs and the girls here are like sisters for the most part. But socially, dont be fooled. This is really harsh and by all means I suggest an overnight or two for you to get a feel of it for yourself, but its naive to think that going to amherst will land you guy friends or even a boyfriend, or a social life. Any more questions PM me or ask them here..</p>

42

<p>Sara, interesting reply! Sounds like you see a different version of Smithies that many of the other posts deny. All homophobia aside, we all want our "straight" daughters to feel comfortable at Smith. Gay/Lesbian culture has its place on all college campuses, but when we turn bathrooms into neutral gender rooms, that concerns me. This is the first post that I have read about any harassment of straight students by gay students, and that concerns me as well. Anytime some students are treated badly enough to be "uncomfortable" is downright wrong, and the administration should say something about it. Hey, if Smith justs wants to be a gay institution, that's fine; but they should be honest in their declaration of such and not paint the picture of it being different. On the other hand, this is "the first" time I have read such a post, and wonder if this is true of all houses, or just some? I wonder if some houses are more gay/lesbian orientated? As far as attending parties at Amherst, or other local colleges; boys will be boys, and our daughters are smart enough to see through that crap. I agree with Sara that they probably see Smith girls as boy hungry, and want to get their hands all over them when their drinking. Hopefully, Smithies realize this fact, as I'm sure most of them do! I read many more posts that describe Smithies as accepting all cultures, and being smart, assertive women. That is what we want to believe, and do believe is the norm at Smith. Unfortunately for Sara, she had some pretty poor experiences and feels like an outcast as a straight girl. I remain concerned about this fact as a potential dad of a Smithie in the near future, and would like to read more posts on the subject.</p>

43

<p>I live in one of the supposedly "gayest" houses on campus, and I have not been harrassed once for being straight. There is a theory that more students graduate as lesbians than those who enter, but I also know someone who after a few months of Smith decided that she might not have been as gay as she thought prior to coming. There are events that celebrate queerness, but I've never been excluded from attending for being straight.</p>

<p>(Also, only one bathroom in the campus center is now gender-neutral. It was a single-stall first floor men's facility that can now be locked from the inside, and all the other restrooms remain the same.)</p>

44

<p>Thanks Borgin...helps to hear the other side of the story.</p>

45

<p>Youre all right. I KNOW that Smith students would make me feel welcome, thats what encouraged me to apply in the first place. In my old school, I sat alone at every meal for about 3 weeks and nobody even said Hi to me. It took a long time to make even ONE friend. When I visited Smith, at the end of the tour, the tour guides said something like, "We hope you come to school here!" I thought that was nice of them to assume I would be accepted.</p>

<p>The last time I visited, I complained to my boyfriend that it would be hard to adjust since I didnt make friends very quickly at my old school, and he said, "This is Smith. Im SURE someone will notice that you are new, and they wont let you sit alone at dinner". I believe that. Smith is one of the few schools that I know would at least TRY to make me feel comfortable. </p>

<p>I guess im just worried about being far from home and not having a car and doing the whole "adjusting to college" thing for the 3rd time. </p>

<p>So..the course load wont be THAT bad? I mean, in one class im taking now, we have to write 15 page research papers once a month. Will I be okay at smith?</p>

<p>PS...what do smith student do on the weekends? In my old school, I went home alot since I didnt have friends. At smith, I would obviously force myself to stay. will there be stuff to do?</p>

46

<p>It appears...(again, I am new to Smith and can only judge based on my lack of experience with the college), that Smith students spend weekends on campus, or in NOHO. It's so gorgeous, why would you want to leave? As far as the courseload, I think TheDad, RLT, Mini, and others can answer much better. You will be fine, as you seem to be a very conscientious student. Keep your head up and don't look back. I like the idea of a welcoming party...seems like you could use it. Also, just the fact that some parents on this site would be willing to do that for you speaks volumes of their family values, and the fact that their children love Smith and have adjusted very well.</p>

47

<p>I agree. What really drew me to smith was its sense of community and the fact that everyone seems to love it. Ive never been to a school that people liked. </p>

<p>those of you who dont like smith..or know people that dont, what is the reason? How did you know you didnt fit in? and clues I should be looking for?</p>

48

<p>theDad...why did your D end up chosing smith over barnard?</p>

49

<p>I'm thinking about transferring to Smith but I thought I'd share an experience I had.
I walked around the Smith campus once and it was at night. I was trying to find a building and so we asked a couple of random students. All were extremely nice and helpful. One of them even went out of her way to show me and then told me that she hopes I'll come to Smith. It made a very big impression on me.</p>

50

<p>Same kind of thing happened last time we visited. Our tour guide was a senior, and was telling us about her experiences at Smith. She started to cry when I asked her how she felt about leaving. This is not something you see at many schools.</p>

51

<p>Coffejunkie--the same thing happened to me when I visited, but it also occured at other campuses I have visited. People here are very nice in general. But, stay overnight instead of just going off of one or two nice people.</p>

<p>And supercow, in reference to "those who don't like Smith"--I feel like I fit in fine, I think anyone who comes here fits in since Smith is so ready to accept whatever and whoever you are. Honestly though, the community here is not all that its cracked up to be. To me, its a community of dissention, everyone has something to protest and be angry about whether its gay rights, hating george bush, abortion, various laws/ideas etc. Its great to have a politically active campus but I wouldnt call it a fabulous community, and it depends on who you ask in reference to "loving smith" It's interesting because in my house there are many who have told prospies that "they hate it here...don't apply" which is wrong, of course. But it seems often that many are unhappy, or came here because of good fin aid or family legacy. </p>

<p>But things vary, they always depend on who you talk to.</p>

<p>In my case, I'm just not happy with the "college experience" I'm getting. Which sounds lame, but I have to live here and I want some place I can call home and this doesnt fit as it. I want a place with college pride and a different overall environment. Smith is great academically and the connections you will make here are fantastic, but its not for everyone socially.</p>

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<p>sara306...what would you want to change about smith socially? thats pretty important to me since in my other school, EVERYONE went home on weekends and there was NOTHING to do. I also didnt get the college experience i was looking for, which is WHY i am transferring. Do you think Smith would not be able to give a student a "college experience"?</p>

53

<p>Well not too many people go home on weekends since many live far from the campus. Where do you currently go to school?</p>

<p>Well, what I'm looking for is a school with great school spirit, parties on the weekend (not having to take the pvta to get to them), guys to hang out with, football games to go to and just overall love for the school I'm going to (by the campus). So youre probably wondering why I came here, when thats what I wanted. I applied to about 12 schools, was rejected by one and wl-ed at all except wheaton and smith. I chose smith for obvious prestige reasons. I'm considering transferring.</p>

<p>Social life is what you make it here though, people are very independent and make a social life through an EC or friends at other campuses or having friends from home come on the weekends. Some just study or watch tv or knit...It all depends on your personality.</p>

54

<p>Sara, I don't mean to sound crass, but it appears that you did not look into "fit" very well, before saying yes to Smith. If you are interested in "a school with great school spirit, parties on the weekend (not having to take the pvta to get to them), guys to hang out with, football games to go to and just overall love for the school I'm going to (by the campus)", then I'm afraid you landed in the wrong place! Although, I don't think you can complain about the campus. Guys to hang out with and football games? Huh? Smith?</p>

55

<p>My D had two questions early on as Smith rose on her radar screen: was NoHo big enough--she's a city kid and was thinking hard about places like Columbia--and would she, as a straight girl, be accepted on the Smith campus. </p>

<p>The answers to both questions, obviously, were resolved in favor of going to Smith. </p>

<p>She has never once been made to feel uncomortable in any way because of being straight. Houses vary...hers is about 50/50. Then there's the old joke about Sessions, where "not even the walls are straight." </p>

<p>I think D would split two of the issues that Sara is bringing up: she loves it socially but her biggest complaint, if she were to have one, is about some strains of political correctness, including re LBGT issues, that manifest you never know where. Doesn't affect her daily life at all and usually she just rolls her eyes if she disagrees...as her Dad, I can attest that she does a great job of eye-rolling. She was upbraided once by a housemate for not using a PC nomenclature with respect to something or other...the housemate apologized the next day. (D isn't one to make waves but isn't one to back down, either.) She has put herself on the front lines of battling for more funding for a pretty traditional student group that had its activities budget cut while a couple of LBGT groups had their budgets left intact...welcome to real world politics, kid.</p>

<p>There are undoubtedly some unpleasant people on campus...with 2650 students it would be hard to be that perfectly selective...but the worst D has encountered are a couple of girls in an advanced dance class who are waaay snootier than they have any right to be in D's mind...as she says, "I've danced with better, they're not as great as they think they are." </p>

<p>D loves the diversity at Smith which extends far beyond any code-word categories. She loves her social matrix, whether her House, two music groups, or Catholic students group. For the first couple of semesters, I kept waiting for "the shoe to drop," for Smith to lose its first romantic lustre. It hasn't happened, save that sometimes D is so submerged in academics that she doesn't come for air for while. (Supercow, don't be scared...she's taking a very demanding schedule. I blanched when I first saw heard about it but I understood her reasoning, taking various factors into consideration. I think this may be her most difficult semester in four years. She generally is taking 20 units per semester; this semester only 18 but auditing one two unit class.) I'm not invalidating Sara's experience but D most emphatically doesn't experience anger and dissension.</p>

<p>Weekends: D has made trips to NYC or Boston about once a semester and made a couple of "field trips" with one or another of her EC groups. She studies a <em>lot</em> on weekends in general but there is always NoHo, whether for a movie, a meal out with friends to take a break from campus food (particularly Friday nights)...Thai or Japanese is their favorite, I think, Herrell's for ice cream. She is religious about giving herself some R&R time every weekend so that she doesn't burn out and Friday nights are sacrosanct. She has no car, nor do I think having one is a big advantage, given the snow alerts, parking problems, etc.</p>

<p>Why not Barnard: never "clicked" with the students, in contrast to both prospect parties here in SoCal and on two overnights. Campus felt claustrophobic in comparison. Very little sense of community...different when Columbia is across the street and everyone diffuses out into NYC for their spare time. Of the three--Wellesley, Smith, Barnard--it felt as if Barnard's academics were noticeably not-quite-as-demanding. Not sure that that's true but that's how she experienced it. Relatively speaking, the Barnard dorms were the pits...don't say that in a Barnard thread or they'll leap to it's defense, "Hey, for NYC they're pretty nice."</p>

<p>Academics: Supercow, D has had several short papers in her classes but not more than one big paper or project per class, plus one or two mid-terms and a final. Lots of reading and a ton of problem sets for her math classes. What are your interests for major?</p>

56

<p>Sara, I'm sorry...it sounds as if Smith was a bad fit but the better of two choices. A school like Boston College or Northwestern sounds more like what you're looking for. </p>

<p>D's application profile was a little unusual, I suspect: HYS, three womens colleges, a safety. Got rejected by all three HYS, Skidmore was pitched overboard a nanosecond after the "Likely" letter was received from Wellesley, and her three non-safety acceptances were all from womens collges...Smith, Wellesley, Barnard. I would have never bet that she'd go to a womens college but there it was.</p>

57

<p>[There is a theory that more students graduate as lesbians than those who enter,]</p>

<p>I also find the conversations regarding LUGs (lesbian until graduation) somewhat amusing. I call it the Anne Heche syndrome. But to be totally honest, there is some truth to the fact LUGs are an actual a small part of the student body.
My daughter has NEVER been harassed by a gay student. Hell, I eat with them and they’re more polite and fun than some of my stuffy, WASP friends</p>

<p>[They are a minority on campus, so you say. But here it feels like a majority.}</p>

<p>Sara is in fact voicing an opinion of many straight students
A small portion of the lesbian population is very vocal. I addressed this issue in another post. They had “women” taken out of the constitution. A great deal of money is also allocated to gay/trangendered clubs. One gay (and there are many) club received 10,000.00 (ten thousand dollars) Contrast that to the Republican club that received 800.00 (eight hundred) and you’ll understand why many straight or more conservative mainstream students are getting upset or won’t apply. </p>

<p>[I want real tea]</p>

<p>They still have “real tea” on Saturdays. You must be in a house that closed the kitchen. Move. Go talk to Randy in housing.</p>

<p>[Hell we have girls on campus that don't want to be called women but rather men, and sure do look like them. I'm no homophobe..but some of the things here make me downright uncomfortable]</p>

<p>Honest observation. If seeing a few women who act, look and dress like men make you uncomfortable, Smith isn’t for you. It certainly isn’t a Colgate where everyone looks like they model for JCrew or a Barbie Doll Wesleyan has some very interesting students also, if you’re into dyed hair and body piercing. :)
Northampton as a town is eclectic, very liberal and home to many gays. It is not Greenwich</p>

<p>Sara is <em>partially</em> correct about the parties at Amherst. Sure, guys are guys, but there are plenty of women who enjoy themselves despite a few (ok, more than a few) jerks. But you’ll find that type of behavior at any campus. I suggest an overnight at Dartmouth, et al colleges. The social scene is totally dominated by the fraternity parties, beer pong, and in general a great deal of drinking. There isn’t much (read zip) to do in Hanover.</p>

<p>Sara, if you thought the parties at Amherst were bad, go to one at a frat house at MIT or Dartmouth. :)</p>

<p>My daughter was also very concerned about not having the “college experience” e.g. football games, guys, school spirit, etc. For years, she listened to me talking about my (edited) “fun-filled college days” and through osmosis probably though she desired the same. </p>

<p>If I said she didn’t agonize over where to attend for a short period of time because she was afraid of missing the college experience, I would be dishonest. She was fortunate enough to be accepted to numerous top coed LACs ….As I told her, adopt the Amherst’s football team and you’re good to go. Amherst used to be all male and Smith/Holyoke women were counted on to add to the mix. To some degree this is still true.</p>

<p>She obviously chose Smith and has informed me now that she hears what people she knows are doing at Middlebury, Hamilton, Dartmouth, Colby, Colgate, etc, she’s positive she made the right choice. Because of the rural locations, drinking and partying are more or less the norm. Students attend those colleges because that’s what they’re looking for, (or don’t have an issue with a great deal of drinking) want a coed environment etc.--there’s nothing working with that. I’m an old frat boy and would be a hypocrite to disparage colleges with those environments. There is a college for everyone. It’s a matter of what’s important and what type of town you want to live in. There are always numerous students transferring out of Colgate, et al, because they can’t stand the isolation. Nothing is perfect.</p>

<p>If hanging out with guys after class or in the dorms is something that is important, again, Smith isn’t a good choice</p>

<p>My daughter loves Northampton--- she decided it’s her favorite college town replacing Saratoga Springs--- and finds numerous things to do off campus, or on other campuses thorough clubs to substitute for the lack of men at Smith. She couldn’t imagine not having Amherst/Northampton and all the other colleges have to offer at her disposal.</p>

<p>I’ve been married to and have been friends with Smithies well over a couple of decades-- and I was surrounded by women college alumnae from birth. Smith women are a different breed. They’re self-sufficient, secure in themselves and driven (in a good way) to succeed and make a positive difference in the world. They chose Smith because they don’t need men in the classroom and some consider them a diversion in their education. At Smith, women can be themselves in the classroom and not be intimated or worried about what the guy sitting next to them thinks. Smith is about learning and supporting women by women No Smithie I know will never be taken advantage of by a male, or anyone for that matter. That can be intimidating to some. I know for a fact most /sober/ Amherst or visiting Harvard, Williams etc., men DO NOT look at Smithies as women easily taken advantage of or anything less than their peers.
Any more than they believe the Wellesley women are there to be object of their immediate desires.</p>

<p>I’m sure I rambled, repeated myself and sound a bit disjointed. But hey, it’s Friday, I’m in a hurry, and I have a Smithie wandering around barking about something I forgot to do--again :)</p>

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<p>[Sara, I don't mean to sound crass, but it appears that you did not look into "fit" very well]</p>

<p>In Sara’s defense, she said “So youre probably wondering why I came here, when thats what I wanted. I applied to about 12 schools, was rejected by one and wl-ed at all except wheaton and smith.”</p>

<p>The poor kid never had the opportunity to decide on another college. She must have felt horrible not to be accepted to ten other (coed) colleges. She’s obviously intelligent.
She made the only decision she could. Smith is far superior to Wheaton.</p>

59

<p>Thanks roadlesstraveled. Smith was a last minute thing since I didnt get in ED to Bowdoin..I panicked as I think many a senior does. And it was one of the hardest things to deal with, I had graduated in the top of my class, taken 6 APs, debate champ, tons of community service--and well you know the rest of the story...</p>

<p>Smith has taught me so many things no doubt, and if I transfer it will have been a vehicle to get me into one of those schools I was waitlisted at that will be a better fit as well as leave me with more friends, connections and so many lessons learned. </p>

<p>[No Smithie I know will never be taken advantage of by a male, or anyone for that matter. That can be intimidating to some. I know for a fact most /sober/ Amherst or visiting Harvard, Williams etc., men DO NOT look at Smithies as women easily taken advantage of or anything less than their peers.] </p>

<p>THAT IS SO TRUE! A friend of mine at amherst (football player actually) informed me that thats why they never come to Smith parties or make that many smithie friends...they are intimidated and know they can't walk all over us! But Mount Holyoke girls....a whole other breed let me tell ya ;)</p>

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<p>I took the liberty of e-mailing a copy of sara's post to my daughter to see how she would respond and she e-mailed me back with the following:</p>

<p>Concerning "Celebration": She agrees it has gotten way out of hand and has become yet another occasion for exposing one's birthday clothes. As to a celebration for straightness, she suggests maybe Valentine's Day could serve the purpose.</p>

<p>Concerning tea: Her house (Lawrence) still does have tea and she says people really do come and sit down and socialize rather than grabbing and going. She says it IS a lovely tradition. She says Lawrence, particularly this year, has a real community feel to it. On another occasion, she remarked that it makes a difference who the house reps are (I've forgotten the term for them). The people who are doing it this year are doing an especially good job of creating occasions for house residents to get together and get to know each other. She does regret not having a dining room where they can all eat together but she says they all just eat at Tyler or Hubbard anyway, so it's not much different than if they had their own dining room.</p>

<p>Concerning amount of lesbianism: She agrees there is a lot on campus. She also sees a phenomenon wherein some women become "lesbian" while they're at Smith just because they want physical intimacy and girls are what's available for fulfilling that need. She has a friend at Bryn Mawr who sees the same thing happening there. My daughter to my knowledge has never been harassed for not being lesbian or pressured into being so. </p>

<p>Concerning the party scene: She agrees that Smith is not a good place if you want to party. She says it is a regular rite of passage for first-years to make the pilgrimage to Amherst the first few weeks of school and then be totally turned off by the scene they encounter (she didn't use those exact words!). She isn't a party person herself so the lack of that sort of social scene doesn't bother her in the least. She does all her socializing through her ECs and through group projects required for classes and through her house. She's also a member of an athletic team, which is especially close-knit as a group and has provided her with her closest friends. </p>

<p>Sara, it sounds as though you have been unlucky, first, in not having more choices among colleges to attend (UVM was one of my daughter's safeties along with Wheaton -- have you thought about that as a transfer possibility?), and second, in the house you were assigned to. I hope you can find some way of reconciling your desire for a social life with your desire for a good education.</p>

<p>Supercow, my daughter is leaning towards a psych/education double major because of her interest in working with children, and her workload for those courses doesn't seem difficult, especially compared to that of students involved in the sciences (she had time to e-mail me three times today!). So I guess the intensity of workload will depend on the field you want to get into. And concerning what Smith women do on the weekends: she is busy with practices and competitions for her team (which frequently involve travel to other campuses around New England), she does work for her classes, she hangs out with friends in her house, and she goes to a lot of events offered by Smith (concerts, poetry readings, movies, etc.) Last weekend she went to a local performance of The Nutcracker with a friend from her team. She likes being on campus so much that last year she headed back to school on January 3 after the winter break, rather than staying at home (and we live in spitting distance from Boston). </p>

<p>TheDad: I think my daughter might give your daughter a run for her money in the eye-rolling department!</p>