I guess we got very lucky. Private Catholic HS in northern CA.
“Feel free to shoot me down, but perhaps the OP shotgunned because of his/her unweighted GPA. If I felt my unweighted GPA was particularly low (but had high standardized testing scores), although I wouldn’t shotgun, some might because it seems that shotgunning for the most part results in acceptance into at least one reach school.”
But not THESE 9 reach schools, and that would make “some” foolish, not wise. It has been MANY YEARS since the following schools have felt inspired to admit anyone under a 3.8 UW gpa who is NOT one of the four Hooked Categories:
Amherst, Brown, Columbia, Harvard, Princeton, Stanford, U Penn, Williams, and Yale.
And that information could have been accessed with merely a little research. There is absolutely no rational reason or excuse for an unhooked student to apply to the above schools with a gpa that for those schools is considered subpar. Test scores do not compensate for subpar grades; rather, they EMPHASIZE subpar grades. When are people going to understand that? And awards don’t substitute or compensate for grades. And e.c.’s don’t substitute or compensate for grades. All of that merely shows that either the student prefers to do everything except schoolwork, or that the student is not competitive with other STUDENTS who get offers to those schools. The only factor that compensates for grades, for the above schools is being Hooked.
I think the OP touched a nerve of many who romanticize the college app process. Somehow, it is OK a research and fall in love with a college and apply ED, but it ruffles too many feathers if he picks some schools that are in the ballpark and do the research later and fall in love with the college that loves you back. How does one get the feeling of a “fit” etc after one day (sometimes not even that) of visit anyway…and why is this emotional feeling more rational?
While I agree that the admission process is not “completely” random, there is an element of randomness or uncertainty. Even if you have well thought out essays, there is no guarantee that you will get admitted (assuming you have the numbers) to a highly selective (<20% a.r) school. I got to defend the OP against the folks who attack his approach and equate him with wall street bankers who gave us CDO’s!
This approach is not for everybody. If the applicant has the capability and means to apply to 30 colleges, power to him. I applaud him for challenging conventional thinking and doing this on his own. It is unlikely that any parent would suggest this approach…and in these days where so many applicants are so coached and packaged by so many adults, I like this kids approach of doing it on his own, making his own mistakes and (hopefully) learning from the process.
Wish you all the best. I also like that you are opening up to the forum and defending yourself. Just a bit of advice - take the feedback (good or bad) with an open mind. Even those who attack your ideas may have a valid point, evaluate it in context and be willing to change your mind.
^^“I applaud him for challenging conventional thinking and doing this on his own.”
Yep.
And yes, he does seem interested in constructive advise.
The only thing that “ruffle my feathers” is foolishness that passes for “challenging conventional thinking.” It challenges the REALITY of the concrete world, not “conventional thinking.” I’m not about to validate laziness that can be cured with minimal research, such as visiting the Common Data Sets, the Admitted Student Profiles, and even examining one’s own transcript. (Whoops! I had no idea what my own gpa was because I randomly applied without examining my qualifications first.) Yeah, that works. It was entirely a waste of money and time to add the 9 schools that he had not a tiny chance of being considered for but ZERO chance of being considered for. Zero. Nine times whatever the app fees were to those 9 schools. And that includes financial aid “shotgunning.” The latter makes sense for schools with a history of accepting unhooked students with non-stellar grades, but that would not include the 9 schools I mentioned.
So, he’s giving it a go with the lottery schools. So what? Maybe he hits. I don’t see a problem with that. I know a lot of kids would like to the same but just don’t want to spend the time, get nervous about it, decide it’s not worth the effort, have monetary constraints. I don’t see a problem with him doing this.
The personal drawback is the lack of time, focus and growth in his apps that might cost him in some close cases at some selective schools where he is right on the edge of admissions. And the pain in the neck of the mistakes and things that can go wrong in the process. More apps, more chances of some mess ups on part of high school, college and applicant,
@epiphany I didn’t know my unweighted GPA because no one ever asks for it or uses it in my school. Most people here don’t know theirs. I do in fact have some modicum of explanation for my grades - like I said, I wrote a comprehensive explanation why my grades dropped in junior year, but I don’t know if admissions will buy it. Perhaps if I manage to improve my grades for the senior mid-year report it would help give the explanation some validity. I must say, however, that my school is notorious for being extremely difficult and according to historic data, top schools have accepted applicants around my (weighted) GPA. Why are you being so sardonic and bitter anyway?
@calipapa I think you summarized my general approach and philosophy very well there. Thanks for the advice btw.
Like I said, if this approach fails, I’ll have to take the consequences. But if it works as planned, I’ll have the opportunity to attend a high reach, to which I most likely would not otherwise have been admitted.
@cptofthehouse Yes. That is what I think about it terms of my own kids. Only through indepth exploration of some schools reveals all of the opportunities they offer. When you apply widely, you can’t focus deeply. Some of those opportunities are one time shots that aren’t available later on. I know with our youngest ds that his multiple scholarships and honors program would have been missed if commitment of time to individual schools had not been a priority.
@epiphany - I think you are right that GPA trumps test scores, its 4 years, not 4 hours etc etc. However, absolute GPA bar is not necessarily set even in those 9 schools you mention. Some high schools have little or no grade inflation and they send a lot of kids to Ivies, etc and those 9 colleges know that. It will be difficult, that’s why they are reaches, but you can’t plug the GPA into a spreadsheet and decide that these colleges are not for me and move on. If you have an explanation, a counselor rec that explains the trends it is possible, may not be probable, to get into those 9 colleges without traditional hooks such as URM. There is wiggle room here, don’t be so certain of one approach.
You’re not going to get into HYPSM caliber schools with a UW GPA of 3.75 (unless seriously hooked), especially if your Junior year grades are the ones that are hurting. 0 times 5 is still 0.
Truthfully, I look forward to how this works out…my kid did 14 and i do think quantity will play an interesting role in increasing odds…especially considering the human factor behind the decision making…
This oldie-but-goldie article speaks well to that: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2009/01/09/dirty-secrets-of-college-admissions.html
@southernhope. Interesting that two different admissions officers, one at an elite LAC, and another at a state university in the NE, got food poisoning in Buffalo and denied the Buffalo applicants. Were they attending the same convention, is it an editing error, or is it an urban myth?
“You’re not going to get into HYPSM caliber schools with a UW GPA of 3.75 (unless seriously hooked), especially if your Junior year grades are the ones that are hurting. 0 times 5 is still 0.”
Precisely. Thank you for stating that obvious fact. It’s too bad such things do have to be restated, though.
“I think you are right that GPA trumps test scores, its 4 years, not 4 hours etc etc. However, absolute GPA bar is not necessarily set even in those 9 schools you mention. Some high schools have little or no grade inflation and they send a lot of kids to Ivies, etc.”
Only certain East Coast boarding schools, whose grading policies and academic product the Elites are well aware of. Did the OP go to one of those schools? #-o
It is not true for other high schools, including other kinds of privates.
And when you (or I) refer to “absolute” gpa, I’m not talking about a private absolute standard. I’m saying that it’s readily available information that the 9 named schools do not admit students below a certain gpa, not because they have some absolute rule (+ or -) but because they have not “needed” to admit such students given the application pools they have been receiving for a full decade, CONSISTENTLY. (Sorry, there’s no bolding opportunity any more.)
They cannot justify even to themselves admitting a 3.7 or 3.6 UW when they have a boatload of 3.999’s and 4.0’ UW’s who also have all the other requisite features in their applications. The quantitative factors are convenient reasons to reject, and boy, do they need handy reasons to reject. That’s why any such “strategy” is foolish and wasteful. There’s no “hope” in it, only denial.
^^Complete conjecture.
If I was an admissions officer, I wouldn’t buy your conflicting curricula excuse. It would have made more sense for your grades to go down your sophomore year, as you were in a foreign country. Instead, your GPA was highest when you were in a foreign country and lowest when you returned to a school that you previously attended for freshman year. I’m not trying to be rude; I just don’t understand how that happens. Wouldn’t you already know how the curricula works at a school that you previously attended? Also, I’m sure regardless of the difficulty of your school that some students probably pulled a 3.5 or better for junior year.
@epiphany - Is you issue with the OP’s approach that he chose those 9 schools that were out of range or is it just that shotgunning is bad? Sorry, I have not recorded the objections of all the posters in this fast growing thread.
If he is shooting outside his range, he will learn from this process. He will grow up to be an adult who will start being realistic and boring 
I would think that he would go through less “emotional” pain waiting for the results from these schools than from researching and falling in love with a “selective reach” school that “fit” him only to find out in 3 months that he did not get in. He has safeties and some match schools, he will be fine and hopefully take responsibility for his actions.
“^^Complete conjecture.”
Recent history is not even partial conjecture. It’s data that can be projected with reasonable certainty at least into the current and near future college admissions cycles.
Have a nice day.
“Is you issue with the OP’s approach that he chose those 9 schools that were out of range or is it just that shotgunning is bad?”
Both. But I add a third: Hey, it’s a free country. As long as CommonApp allows it, as long as colleges allow it, as long as high school guidance offices allow it, any student is free to waste his time, money, and energy. Just don’t come onto a discussion forum and look for sympathy or even validation from those who have been in this business and know what we’re talking about. Because, again, the data has been available, and CERTAINLY the data about one’s own gpa is available, and not to consider that data does not afford anyone special standing to be congratulated for foolishness.
“Sorry, I have not recorded the objections of all the posters in this fast growing thread.”
No problem. It’s hard to keep up with everybody’s rapid responses.
“If he is shooting outside his range, he will learn from this process. He will grow up to be an adult who will start being realistic and boring.”
So, to be clear, you applaud him for being foolish but at least “Exciting?”
“I would think that he would go through less “emotional” pain waiting for the results from these schools than from researching and falling in love with a “selective reach” school that “fit” him only to find out in 3 months that he did not get in.”
It doesn’t have to be an either/or. What you stated is a false dichotomy. Students fall in love with reasonable schools all the time, and I passionately hope such a result for him on April 1.
To surmise that AdComs are only familiar with HS GPA inflation/deflation at “select NE prep schools” is very short sighted.