Some Reassurance

Colleges and Universities A-Z Massachusetts Institute of Technology
1

<p>Hello. I would appreciate any and all opinions on this problem of mine. I have two colleges that are tearing me apart because I can see how I would benefit from both. One of which is MIT and the other of which is Stanford. Therefore, though anyone can comment(if appropriate), I would prefer especially any type of representative of either Stanford or MIT.</p>

<p>Firstly, I'll tell you all a little about myself:</p>

<p>I am currently a junior in a Massachusetts high school. What I love most about life is representative in my passions which I have tried to have the opportunity to embrace as much as I possible so far. I have fought tooth and nail to really be able to love learning without limit. I have had nothing really set upon my lap; I have worked for everything, and I wish to have as much opportunity out there in where I go. I took upperclassmen classes as a freshman and took AP Calc BC, Physics, and US history last year with which I got all fives. This year I am continuing the dual enrollment I started the summer of my freshman year doing Abnormal Psychology, Statistics, Intro to Philosophy, and Multivariable Calc all this semester. Next semester I am planning to take Linear Algebra, Differential Equations, and Mathematical Physics. By the end of this year I will have taken six more AP tests, and next year I plan to take six more. As well, I am hoping this summer I can do Analysis, Complex Analysis, and Partial Differential Equations, and in the fall to do Abstract Algebra, Modern Physics, and Metaphysics, and in the spring to do Abstract Algebra II, Topology, and Quantum Mechanics.</p>

<p>I love this stuff. My interests are Mathematics, Physics, Philosophy, and Psychology. I think everything is a type of Philosophy, and I feel everything resonates with me in my passions. I want to go into Theoretical Mathematics, Theoretical(Partical theory, Quantum theory, string theory) Physics, and more of Metaphysics, and Cognitive Psychology. My aspiration is to be a researcher of Mathematics and Physics mostly, maybe guest lecture, and be a writer with which I will have the opportunity to contribute to Philosophy and Psychology and as well share my talent of Poetry.</p>

<p>I have thought for quite some time that I would want to go to MIT and become a researcher there and live there. I love Cambridge and after visiting the campus I can see that the environment is really so so perfect for me. I love to think deeply and almost obsessively about everything. Others find my intensity overwhelming and my passions enveloping. MIT was a place where I felt the curiosity and intellectual stimulation. I loved it, I loved Cambrige(again, I repeat), and I felt at home.</p>

<p>But, I want to get the absolute most out of my education. Because I want to really focus on learning and am sure I will love that and eat it all up and as well considering the possible college credit I may enter with, I would have liked to triple major. Now, I know some of you may tell me that is unreasonable, but it would probably be in Theoretical Math, Focus Physics, and Philosophy. I think I could possibly do that or at least push myself further into my insanity. Either way, great fun! ;)</p>

<p>If I were to double major, I would do it in Math and Physics and probably take a whole lot of Philosophy and Psychology classes. Also, if some of that credit were to be accepted, I would try hard to take graduate level classes in Math and Physics to get a head start. But, I also would like to get degrees in Philosophy and Psychology if I were to in fact have the requirements. I would like suggestions also here.</p>

<p>At Stanford, I would get as much as I put into it. I am not sure, but it seems more flexible in giving credit(and it should be in that some of those classes are EPGY). I haven't been there, but from what I can gather it seems less crazy but more well balanced(as I would like the latter too). I also know that I could do a Math/Physics double major more easily due to having a head start(possibly) and as well the requirements aren't too difficult(not too many relatively). If I had the time then, I might even have the opportunity to try to do the coterminal programs and get a Masters in Philosophy and/or Psychology as well. I looked into the requirements and it seems difficult but not impossible in my case. I would be doing classes all four quarters and for 20 units a quarter for maybe five years. That could possibly yield me( if I truly can get everything out of Stanford)a ba in Math and Physics and as well a ma in Philosophy and Psychology.</p>

<p>With that, I would probably see if I could go to MIT as a graduate for Math for a PhD. Then, later I would be interested in going further with my other degrees as I do research.</p>

<p>But, that is if I do Stanford....which is something I would have never went with a month ago considering MIT by far my dream school. I have always eyed Stanford, but now I am unsure of myself.</p>

<p>Please help me out here. I know I am young and may not know what I am talking about, but please then pity me and help me out. I want to learn. I am just right now unsure of the school I have dreamed of regarding whether they can give me as much as what Stanford could. As for Stanford supporters, please help me understand the school more and what I could get out of that I haven't already said. I want to know all the factors.</p>

<p>To break it down again:</p>

<p>MIT vs Stanford(have loved MIT for so long)</p>

<p>MIT: love the environment and philosophy and openness and the research there
dislike the lack of opportunity to get the most out of my classes</p>

<p>Stanford: love the flexibility and chance to do truly more of what I want to do, also like the well roundedness and variety of interests/passions, also i love learning and sometimes work but I have heard that Stanford isn't as work overwhelming(good thing!)
dislike the seemingly "too chill" character, and really the not MIT part of it, ;)</p>

<p>Need help:</p>

<p>Pros and cons of each school regarding who I am as a student/person
Things that would compensate cons, make bigger the pros I could take advantage of
Any other things, like corrections of my foolishness but no harsh words or anything please</p>

<p>Thank you very much! :D</p>

2

<p>Apply to both and if you are admitted to both, then you can face this decision.</p>

3

<p>I plan to apply to both along with many other schools, but I would like to have some support because this may be of impact when I send out my application, as if I do early action for Stanford or not. I’ll still apply to both, but I would like some guidance here, and for MIT supporters some reassurance.</p>

4

<p>Since you’re from MA, I would just do MIT early next year. Applying early doesn’t really give you an advantage anyways, but Stanford is known to somewhat favor in-state students, so I would just apply regular. </p>

<p>As someone who has been down this path, I can tell you that your plans WILL change by this time next year, so I wouldn’t worry too much about the details. Put your absolute best into both applications. If you only get into one of them, then you won’t even have this dilemma. If you get into both, then visit both schools during preview weekend and check them out for yourselves. Don’t let some random CC people influence what you’ll be doing for the rest of your life.</p>

5

<p>Okay. Thank you iceui2. But, I would still like some general opinions and some exchange of information here. I still appreciate your reply though of course. :)</p>

6

<p>what calalum said. no sense stressing now.</p>

7

<p>Thank you Chris. :)</p>

8

<p>Just a few points.

I get the feeling that you think it’s problematic that you can’t triple-major at MIT, and that this is a con for you. Never fear: even though you can’t be awarded a triple-major officially, you are perfectly free to fulfill the degree requirements for three majors, and after freshman year, you can take as many classes per semester as you wish.</p>

<p>

If you’re serious about pursuing a career in physics, you will want to set aside time for research – students aiming for science PhD programs typically work in the lab full-time the summer after freshman, sophomore, and junior years. Overscheduling yourself in terms of classes would seriously impede your ability to get into a PhD program, as your undergraduate research record (and research mentor’s recommendation) will be much more important than having multiple majors and coterminal master’s degrees in unrelated fields. </p>

<p>

It is far too early for you to be thinking of potential grad schools. You will pick a grad school based on the specific professor(s) who will be your thesis advisor(s), not on the basis of a “school” or a “culture”. If you don’t know the specific subfield you want to study in grad school, you can’t pick a grad school.</p>

9

<p>Thank you Mollie. I appreciate you addressing this and providing some insight. :)</p>

<p>Okay. I understand. Thanks for the advice.</p>

10

<p>I can certainly empathize – I didn’t have any idea what factors were important for grad school admissions (and, more broadly, a career in science) when I was a senior in high school. It’s not something that most people know unless they have academic parents.</p>

11

<p>Don’t fall in love with any school before you get in. Getting into the top grad schools is fairly trivial for top students, but it’s not true for undergrad.</p>

<p>That said, as an MIT alum, my opinion is that you are exactly the type of student that MIT should seek to admit.</p>

12

<p>^ What sort of student do you mean?</p>

13

<p>@Mollie, well I certainly do not have academic parents at all. My father went to a technical/trade school and received a certificate and my mom dropped out and is now a teaching assistant in special education classes. So, therefore, I do not have that much of an idea of grad school admission factors. Can you give me some help on typically believed myths about what is true about grad school admissions?</p>

<p>Am I possibly more likely to get into MIT grad for mathematics or physics if I did well in MIT undergrad math and physics than if I did well in another school’s programs?</p>

<p>If I become an intern at MIT in math and/or physics research(which I plan to do very early on), will I have pretty favorable chances on grad admissions in those fields?</p>

<p>So, to clarify, I am a person that connects very well with others and bridges people and the opportunity they can realize personally and collaboratively with each other. In my freshman year, I became soon well connected and engaged with the faculty(by my own initiative and endeavoring) and knew the principle, superintendent, assistant principles, and all the department heads. This was because I challenged the mainstream path of students and advocated for my own personal freedom in taking complete, unlimited advantage of the opportunities of the school. I feel like I will be just so compelled to meet all the faculty and become engaged and interested in what they are involved with. I know that I will be an intern and go up the ladder from there, doing as much as I can do. I also feel like I will probably be one to especially take advantage of the opportunity to take graduate level mathematics and physics classes as an undergrad. With all of that, and as well as an understanding of what type of research and grad work I would love to be involved with(Theoretical Mathematics and pretty theoretical physics ie string, quantum, and particle theory), I hope that would be good grounds for grad admissions.</p>

<p>Although, I know I have plenty of time for that. I am just very excited and have questions and thoughts firing off rapidly in my head. Speaking of which, presuming I complete that background in mathematics and physics, how much of my baseline requirements could I possibly have covered(with placement and/or credit)? As well, with that in mind, how much of a start could I get in graduate level requirements in taking grad classes?</p>

<p>Also, for physics, is it required or recommended that one get his masters before going for a PhD? I know there is no masters degree for mathematics, so I would just go for a PhD, but in that there is one for physics, what do you guys say? Is it possible that if I finish the physics requirements for a masters as an undergrad, I could get a masters in physics at graduation?</p>

<p>And @Collegealum314, it is so hard not to fall in love with MIT! I have been hitting the grindstone of limitations after limitations in my life towards my pursuit of development and growth. I have been burdened with the realization that the things I have been so apart of thus far in my life have been unsuited for the full potential that I harbor within. But, looking into MIT and after having went to the open house, I sense that I will have all the opportunity I so desire and I will have a place to call my home as a sanctuary against the countless exhaustible resources of my past, if I do indeed get accepted. If happiness is satisfaction with what one has, love is the happiness derived from things infinitely giving. MIT is infinitely giving to me, and therefore I love it(but I do get your point: it is just difficult to heed it in my case).</p>

<p>And as well, collegealum, for your last response, :smiley: Really??? That makes me so happy being someone who lacks self confidence in himself to hear that you think that. I really appreciate that. Thank you, thank you, thank you!(I know, it is of no guarantee just because you said it, but I am really thankful because you have that opinion of me)</p>

14

<p>

Many science programs have a policy of not accepting their undergraduates for graduate school, so that students experience a wider variety of faculty members and departmental cultures. I’m not sure if math is the same way. </p>

<p>However, I would strongly discourage you from thinking of this as a pro or con for either MIT or Stanford – if you do well at either school in math or physics, you will be able to go to grad school anywhere you want. You cannot pick an undergraduate school based on where you currently think you want to go to graduate school.</p>

<p>

Yes, undergraduate research experience is one of the most (if not the most) important factors in PhD admissions. And both the math and physics departments at MIT have excellent student placement histories.</p>

<p>

It depends on the exact courses you’ve taken or that you want to receive credit for, but MIT in general is fairly generous with placement. There are exams you can take during orientation that will earn you credit for a wide variety of math and physics courses. There’s some information on the [physics</a> department page](<a href=“Prospective Undergrads » MIT Physics”>Prospective Undergrads » MIT Physics) and the [math</a> department page](<a href=“http://math.mit.edu/academics/undergrad/first/]math”>First Year Subjects) about first year subjects and obtaining credit for them. </p>

<p>

You’re free to take any graduate-level courses that pique your interest, as long as you’re prepared for them. (One of our CC posters a few years ago started out his first semester freshman year in all grad-level math courses, and did very well.) But those courses generally won’t be for graduate credit – you’ll get credit toward your undergraduate degree, of course, but those courses won’t transfer to your PhD program after you graduate, no matter where you go.</p>

<p>

No, physics students go straight from undergrad to a PhD program. There’s no need to get a master’s prior to entering the PhD program. Some PhD programs will award a master’s degree along the route to the PhD, but others won’t.</p>

<p>

Students generally make the mistake of thinking that graduate school admissions is like undergrad admissions, and that PhD programs care about your well-roundedness and general academic background. They don’t; PhD programs in a given field only really care about your preparation for research in that field. So physics programs would be glad to see that you had a good background in physics and math, but they wouldn’t care about your background in philosophy, and if taking classes in philosophy interferes with your ability to do research or take more physics/math classes, that would very much be seen as a negative for physics or math grad programs.</p>

<p>Hope this is useful.</p>

15

<p>Graduate school admissions in a theoretical field is most dependent on grades, GRE score, and recs. Recs will depend a lot on your performance in class. Of course research is important, but you won’t be able to do anything in theory if you are not a top student, so it’s best not to even think about it for now. My point in saying this is that it would be pointless to “do research” in math/physics during the school year the first two years because it’s fairly impossible to accomplish anything at that point. I use the quotes on purpose. Go ahead and do it during the summers, but in theory fields I would concentrate on class the first three years. In chem or bio, my advice would be different.</p>

<p>So the good news is that it’s pretty simple. Try to be the top student in your classes. Also, getting in the 90+% on the physics GRE is a big deal and is hard to do (but not if you are top student.) You don’t have to be a supergenius to do it (like you might need to be for the Putnam.) </p>

<p>BTW, you should consider U. of Chicago too. It’s not as hard to get into, but it’s just as rigorous in physics and it has a little more of a philisophical feel. The only thing I think MIT does better in terms of physics is junior lab, but I think that is more relevant for an experimentalist than a theorist.</p>

16

<p>Thanks again, Mollie for the enlightening advice! :slight_smile: I wasn’t considering MIT because of grad school, but I would like to go to grad school at MIT because I hope to be a researcher there and spend my life in Cambridge. I would like that, but of course it isn’t set in stone. Also, I know where my focus is, so though I really do want to contribute to philosophy and other fields and study them, I will make sure I am solid on math and physics research and all of that first.</p>

<p>Thank you too, Collegealum for your pointers. And, I have considered U Chicago. I like the school and I will apply, but I have heard two bad things. Well, most importantly really, is that it is much more competitive there(though still really intellectual :slight_smile: ) and that the weather is bad(which is not a reason for not going but I do like the location and everything of MIT much better from what I could gather).</p>

<p>I have also considered UPenn, Columbia, and Caltech. Any other recommendations? Especially for a safe school?</p>

17

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</p>

<p>I don’t think it’s cutthroat at U. of Chicago at all. Is the weather in Chicago worse than in Boston? I wouldn’t think so, but I guess you can check the temperatures.</p>

18

<p>I have heard that the atmosphere in UChicago is quite competitive, that many are the “I got the best grades in my classes and I know it” people. As for weather, it is pretty trivial. Just concerned about the first part.</p>

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<p>First of all, for a safety school, Cornell is not a bad choice at all (the weather really isn’t worse than the rest of upstate NY and Boston-plus the town is big enough and nice enough to be entertaining but not distracting) and university of Michigan I’ve heard has a wonderful campus. But, one thing I must say, do what you want. MIT and Stanford are mostly identical in the quality of their programs, and if MIT has been your dream school and still is, then don’t forget about it. Mind you, despite your amazing level of coursework and obvious genius, you might not get into both. Make sure you don’t forget involvement in school in favor of a heavy course load. Good luck :)</p>

20

<p>Cornell I have seen is good for math but not the best for physics, or maybe I have it the other way around. Not too interested in University of Michigan, but I will look more into it.</p>

<p>As for my genius, thank you but I like to consider myself insane instead, just shows the intensity and passion, don’t you think? And, as for the involvement, I replied to a guy saying the same thing on the same original post on the Stanford forums(because this post was about Stanford too). Link here <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/stanford-university/1228447-some-reassurance.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/stanford-university/1228447-some-reassurance.html&lt;/a&gt; Read along guys if you are indeed interested.</p>