<p>Cpt, I have trouble understanding how SUNY recruiting kids from CT and PA helps balance – other than ratings. And I see no need need for schools to go into D1 and incur expenses for sports.</p>
<p>It’s not just the ratings. Yes, ratings go up when a school gets higher caliber students, but that is not where I am focused. It makes for a better school to have better students. With a larger pool of students, one can possibly get more diversity, skills, better students. It also gives the schools better reputations when they are known outside of their state and area. Even if none of this improves ratings, bolstering image has its benefits.</p>
<p>Though most people know U of MD, Penn State, Purdue, Ohio State, few are familiar with the SUNY schools. Until I came to NY, I did not. I wish there were more name recognition for our state schools. </p>
<p>I am not advocating that any schools go D1 and incur expenses for sports, so I am not sure what you mean by that comment. However, sports teams do give schools name recognition. That is something translatable in value. I am not a big sports school person, but many people are. I don’t ignore the benefits of having a well known sports program at a school, though for me, personally, it is not of interest. </p>
<p>I don’t think I advocate SUNY recruiting kids specifically from PA and CT. What I would really like is for the SUNYs to get more name recognition and appeal to more kids outside of NY and in outlying states, more so than neighboring ones. That SUNYs are so NY with so few out of state students has made people pause when considering them from OOS.</p>
<p>Cpt, I think that given the low OOS tuition for the SUNYs, in comparison to other states in the area, the value of OOS kids, if any, has to be balanced by the low ball tuition they are receiving. If SUNY were only accepting exceptional OOS kids, that might be worthwhile, but as they are not willing to be transparent about what their goals and results are, by college, they do not have my support.</p>
<p>*And I see no need need for schools to go into D1 and incur expenses for sports. *</p>
<p>You may not understand how D1 sports can bring money to a college that it wouldn’t otherwise by being televised and/or thru donors.</p>
<p>I agree that most/all female D1 sports are money losers, but there are male D1 sports that are supporting themselves, supporting other sports as well, and/or providing extra money for a school.</p>
<p>but I think it is time to throw the [college] rankings in the trash.</p>
<p>1) That’s never going to happen.</p>
<p>2) Since rankings will always exist, schools are going to work the system to their advantage.</p>
<p>Mom2, I really.really question the accounting for D1 sports, but even if they do bring money to a school, the negatives that big time football and basketball has brought to college far outweights it, imho.</p>
<p>Here is an interesting study.</p>
<p><a href=“CollegeLifeHelper.com”>CollegeLifeHelper.com;
<p>It seems to say that other than the well known big time sports schools, the cost of sports is high, and hits our poorest kids the worst</p>
<p>It really depends on the school and the sports as to how much they benefit the school. The high profile sports at some schools are an integral part of their image. Dartmouth, I’m sure would love to drop a lot of their sports programs but for the fact that they would no longer be in the Ivy League if they should do so. </p>
<p>SUNY has increased the OOS premium in the last few years so it isn’t the bargain it used to be. They really can’t charge much of a premium, given the schools are not so desirable for OOSers anyways. I know that SUNY at Buffalo has been trying to be more of a flagship school, but without more OOSers and more of a name recognition, it isn’t going to happen. It isn’t just a matter of rankings, but being recognized. There are a number of schools (Clemson, Auburn, Purdue) where the academic rankings are not way up there, but the name recognition makes them attractive on a national basis. I would really like to see a SUNY achieve that status.</p>
<p>*It really depends on the school and the sports as to how much they benefit the school. *</p>
<p>Sometimes it’s hard to quantify how much a sport brings in outside of the obvious of ticket sales and money from being televised. When money comes in from donors that wouldn’t normally donate or only during years that the school has winning teams, the school can guestimate how much of a financial positive their teams are. </p>
<p>the negatives that big time football and basketball has brought to college far outweights it,</p>
<p>Hardly. The amount of money that one school takes in from big time football (or BBall) is outweighed by any negatives that the same school may experience…especially when looked at over a several year period. </p>
<p>If you’re really concerned about the cost of sports, you should be against Title IX which requires schools to fund money-draining female sports. Schools should be able to pick and choose which sports they want to have on campus based on what’s good for the school.</p>
<p>This is sort of off topic, but in terms of Michigan universities does anyone know if MSU is recruiting out of state students hard, and if they are trying to get more tuition money due to the budget cuts? I see their point and its a decent idea, but I wonder the effect on Michigan residents going to college next year if MSU accepts much more out of state students and U of M keeps their tough admissions and also accepts more out of state students in order to get more money.</p>
<p>You can look and see if MSU is accepting increasing numbers of OOS kids. I know UMich accepts as many as the state of Michigan permits them to take. Compare OOS numbers from one year to the next.</p>
<p>Mom2, when I said the cost outweighted the benefits, I meant the social cost. Sorry if not clear. The cheating. The crime. All the things that bigtime college sports bring to a college. Add to that the way these young people are treated. And before you say not my kid – think about the film student at Notre Dame, who died taping the football team. He was sent up on some platform in terrible weather.</p>
<p>I live in Illinois. I will have 3 children in college next fall. They are all attending fine privates for a lot less than the total cost to send 3 to the University of Illinois. </p>
<p>When they were little, I didn’t worry about how I would send them to college because I figured we always had the U of I. Then we entered the college application years and I discovered collegeconfidential and got a real education into college costs really quick!! </p>
<p>Momof5</p>
<p>*Mom2, when I said the cost outweighted the benefits, I meant the social cost. *</p>
<p>I don’t think that’s true, either. </p>
<p>We don’t get rid of something that isn’t immoral or unethical just because some people who associated with the activity will sometimes behave in an immoral or unethical way. The majority of participants do not behave in an immoral or unethical way…nor do their fans.</p>
<p>Colleges are not going to get rid of college sports just because some people behave inappropriately in some way at various times.</p>
<p>This won’t make 1stcolldad feel any better, but our son has a slightly lower ACT and GPA than your son and he got money from SIU. This was his safety school and the only school that he got any money from. His OOS choice (Ball State) offered no money, though I’m still going to work on them to see if we can gt SOMETHING out of them to make the COA lower.</p>
<p>I do wish he liked SIU better than he does . . . it would make things financially easier, at least for the first year.</p>
<p>ptc, it dosn’t make me feel any better, but I don’t feel any worse either, But good for you. If you dont mind, could you answer a couple questions?</p>
<p>What state are you in?
when did you apply?
when did you know of the scholarship money?
And if possible how much?</p>
<p>There is a method to my madness, I would like to be able to help others as much as possible with financial aid, and help them get their hands on some of there own money, if you know what I mean.</p>
<p>We’re in Illinois; he applied around Xmas (plus/minus a couple of weeks). We found out the award a couple of weeks ago. One difference – some of the money is a music scholarship since he is a music major. He got $1500 from the school itself and $1500 from the music school, and a $500 music school tuition waiver.</p>
<p>Alot of times on here people post and then never answer any questions, Your answers and quick response are much appreciated. Thanks and again good for you.</p>
<p>*One difference – some of the money is a music scholarship since he is a music major. He got $1500 from the school itself and $1500 from the music school, and a $500 music school tuition waiver. *</p>
<p>Yes, it does seem that sometimes a student’s major can make a difference. Music majors at some schools can rack in some extra bucks. ( I know that at my kids’ school, talented music majors can get half/full tuition scholarships. ) I wonder if the music dept at SIU has some agreement with the university to both provide money?</p>
<p>I do think it’s odd that he got a 1500 tuition scholarship for music and a 500 scholarship for music. Is one or both an endowed (named) scholarship? </p>
<p>Dad…where is your son going to go to college next fall?</p>
<p>When my parents lived in Georgia many years ago, the college local to them, Statesboro (sp) College was one that was practically open admissions and very inexpensive even among colleges in a state where the college costs are relatively low. And a good student could get a full ride there. Now it is is Georgia Southern and with the Hope Program, is where many kids from all over the state go, and getting merit money is not a cinch.</p>
<p>As little as 12 years ago, to get a Chancellor’s Scholarship at Pitt, and entry to the Honor’s College was R/M SAT1 score of about 1350 or so, automatic. Now to even apply for entry, not to mention the awared the two part scores have to be in the 1400 area. Big change in the way things work. And this year, I was surprised at who was not getting into the school. </p>
<p>The same sort of thing is happening with many of the SUNYs. And at SUNY Buffalo, my BFA seeking son got a $3500 performing arts award while his brother with nearly perfect SAT scores got $2500 offered academically. So, there are departmental awards that can be more generous than others and even higher than academic scholarships.</p>
<p>mom2collegekids, We are still up in the air with his college choice, Iowa state sent us an award letter that put them on the map , so we went to visit last wednesday and where very impressed with Iowa State. Now we are good and confused. I really like Iowa state, He like Mississippi, Mom likes Kentucky. So we will sit down and have a heart to heart on this before May 1st to get housing strait. I will post his decision when he makes it. He needs a little push I think.</p>
<p>we live in Iowa (go Hawks not Cyclones) right across the river from Illinois (Quad Cities). My son got $13,000 academic scholarship to NIU, $2,000 from in-state school and so far nothing from u of North Texas. ACT 32 but GPA 3.2. Don’t know class rank but it would probably be close to even be in the top 25%. NIU has been on him like flies to flypaper since he applied, even offering more money last week. And yes, he is a music major. He got another $1000 from the music dept. So guess they want an Iowa resident on their campus…</p>