Stick with the course availability story, or take online APs?

Applying to College
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It’s senior year, and I have already maxed out all my high school’s limited APs (calc and art) and honors courses (only2). I have straight As and the highest stats possible at my school.

But since the pandemic I’ve become aware of online AP classes, which I never heard of before. I and my father, after some heated argument with the HS, have convinced them to allow me to take online APs next year as my electives, which will cost us a few thousand bucks but that’s okay.

Here’s the admissions question:

In one strategy, I have the maximum challenge my hs offers. According to every admissions officer asked, every website of every college I’m applying to, my GC, and the other college forum who shall not be named, I will be considered based on what was available to me. According to some here, and my fears, if I don’t have 17 AP classes and a 4.9 out of 4.0 I’m screwed for merit aid (exaggerating, but you understand the point). Should I stick with the story of I chose the most challenging path available to me and I aced it all?

Or do I suddenly sign up for 3 online AP classes and upend that story? Why didn’t I start taking APs freshman or sophomore year? Why am I loaded up with APs with no grades yet during early action season? What’s this last ditch effort to show rigor? Why haven’t I been at this all along?

Should I just not take the APs now and stick with the first narrative, corroborated by my GC letter?

I’m hoping I can ask this question without writing an essay about so many other factors but I do acknowledge that it is useful to know that I am applying to LAC “safeties” and “targets” that are known to give large merit and need aid, such as Lawrence, Knox, Hendrix, Holyoke, Brynn Mawr and also some that I’m hoping I’ll buck the trend, such as Puget Sound and Hollins.

I’m also wondering if the first narrative, that I did all I could, is complicated by my twin brother who will be taking online APs for sure, thus showing that it can be done, but he has nothing to lose because he got two surprise Bs last year. And we will apply to some of the same small colleges, from the same hs.

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Take the online courses if you’d rather take them than what’s offered at your school, but not because you think it will help you get into a college. If you are interested in AP Euro History, take it because it interests you.

Colleges aren’t going to wonder why you didn’t take XXX as a freshman because many schools don’t allow freshmen to take AP classes. College admissions offices are going to see a lot of students who took online classes in the last 2-3 years, sometimes because of covid and sometimes because they’ve learned that they like online learning.

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Thanks. I’m not in a financial position to do what interests me or take what I would like to take. I know this is not everyone’s experience.

I’m solely interested in optimizing my application and this question is solely about that. Which strategy works better for getting money is the sole question.

I realize that maybe no one knows for sure but I’d like to hear some thoughts anyway. And people sure have those here!

Again, this is about optimizing chances for money, and the potential cost/benefit of each strategy. Do I stick with the first story, or could my application become stronger by suddenly adding online APs now?

I’m sorry I said “freshman” I have a tendency to exaggerate. I mean “why didn’t she take these APs all along then, if she had the choice?”

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My opinion is that no one will question why you didn’t take classes online or outside your school (community college, local college). Most hs students do not take classes outside their school.

I don’t think these online AP classes will help you get into college or improve your chances for merit aid either. They won’t be changing your GPA.

Some schools don’t offer a lot of AP classes. Some offer IB or lots of DE or better sports opportunities. Admissions offices know how to sort through it all.

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From a purely “admissions” point of view, I don’t think taking online APs will be beneficial. Generally, AOs want to see what you do outside of the classroom because that’s what makes you who you are. Taking online APs or, even worse, self studying for exams doesn’t read well because it’s looks like you are just trying to impress them.

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So that’s one vote for I stick to the story of “I did what I could” corroborated by my GC letter. Hopefully if I do that it won’t be undermined by my brother applying to the same small school, but suddenly showing it is possible to take AP classes.

I do want to note that I’m not wondering about competing with “most high school students” but competing with two different versions of my transcript, to get the maximum merit possible for me, which still might not be enough for me to attend college, which is something I want to do.

My GPA will go up from the AP classes. I wasn’t thinking that that would matter at a small LAC though. I was thinking of the rigor question. They’re not going to just glance at a weighted GPA. I was thinking, however, how disturbing and unfair it is that someone at my HS could through this method buy their way to the valedictorian spot (which is mine this year).

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This happened at my hs, in my class, but not through ‘buying’ her way in. A girl from the class behind us (who I’d known all through school) graduated a year early and ‘bumped’ the girl in my class from valedictorian. Nothing to be done about it.

Some high schools offer 30 AP classes. No one expects any student to take all of them, or even most of them.

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I just want to say that my son did not apply to schools that his friend applied to. He didn’t want to compete with him. Is it possible that you and your brother might apply to different schools? I can’t imagine the potential tension that could result if two of my kids applied to the same colleges.

Two of my kids took online AP classes because of scheduling issues. VHS.org. The reason you have- that you have maxed out on the AP’s offered, is reason enough not to take any. You are judged by what your school offers. Is your brother taking them just to raise his GPA?

You are applying to schools that have holistic admissions for the most part. Have you investigated what merit awards are awarded for? Have you done the NPC to see the predicted costs?

Some schools award for community service or art or music and other things.

If it weren’t for COVID, I would say get a job or do an activity that will enhance your application more than an extra AP or two.

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Then don’t spend “thousands” on online APs. The LACs you list are not going to accept enough AP credits to let you graduate early (which would at least ‘pay back’ the investment in the online APs), and you are not going to earn extra ‘thousands’ in merit aid based on having taken them.

For admissions & for merit you are fine (ie, another vote for sticking with the ‘true’ story). The fact that your father successfully browbeat the school into agreeing to this changes nothing,

As for your brother: 1) you have to run your own races; 2) very likely that suddenly adding an online AP course is not going to affect admissions or merit aid one iota.

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Yeah we haven’t thought through our applying to the same schools, but there is no tension between us and he knows he isn’t as competitive a candidate as me and I know he is a boy applying to majority girls LAC and has an advantage there. My brother is trying to offset the two B’s he got last semester, and a B in freshman and sophomore years each. After the last 2 Bs, his NPC merit aid dropped substantially at several schools, to the tune of 20k over four years or more. I know that’s just a blind calculator.

In any case, there is no sense in me withdrawing my application for him when we don’t know what his chances are anyway.

It is the party line that you are judged by whats available but many people here on past threads have told me my chances are not as good as they could be because of my lack of APs and only 2yrs FL, and even they’ve suggested my only 3 years of HS math, ending in calculus, might be a problem (I don’t believe the latter though). They might know something, and it is certainly believable that I don’t compare to someone with 12 APs, or they might not know what they are talking about.

I’m very busy with a job and varsity volleyball (2hrs practice every day) and don’t see any new ECs, but you may be right that this is something to beef up.

We have investigated merits and npcs a lot.

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Were any of them admissions people? How many of them had successfully completed an admissions cycle themselves? All the posters here today are experienced posters, who have seen multiple admissions cycles and ALL of them are saying some variation of YOU WILL BE JUDGED RELATIVE TO YOUR SCHOOL.

It is not a ‘party line’. It is (as you noted) what every.single.college admissions team says. The top schools (eg, Stanford) emphasize that it is NOT an AP race. Some of the Boarding Schools that are considered “Ivy feeders” don’t offer any APs- ever. Top academic high schools frequently limit the number of APs students are allowed to take.

Truly, you have the wrong end of this stick. Spending thousands on online AP classes is extremely unlikely to pay itself back in additional merit aid.

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It’s not a large sample so far, but no, I don’t believe anyone here now or in past threads was an admissions officer. A majority of the posters on this forum are extremely opinionated parents who show no doubt about what they are saying, often express their opinion aggressively, leaving no room for doubt or further thought.

So the few people that have posted here so far seem exactly like the people here who have told me the opposite. I can’t tell them apart.

PS a couple thousand dollars is not really the issue and I regret mentioning that. I should know by now not to leave loose ends in my posts. But everything else I mentioned is the issue.

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I disagree that posters such as @compmom are being aggressive, or ruling out further thought.

Tbf, my posts are the most opinionated and assertive on this post! Indeed, they are uncharacteristically robust, so I apologize that my post is coming across that way.

I find it frustrating that you say you that you get the same answer from every official source- but you choose not to believe them, and when people here share their direct experience of admissions situations that demonstrate it’s not just words you dismiss them.

At least do the math: how much extra merit money would you have to get to repay the thousands you are planning to spend on the extra APs? Look at the info on merit aid for the schools you are looking at.

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No I was NOT suggesting you beef up your EC’s. You already have a job and a varsity sport. If you WANT to do something else fine but you don’t need to.

Calculus is enough. Honest. I know kids who got into top schools and they never got near precalc.

What about financial aid?

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This is my first go round with colleges so take my advice with a big old grain of salt, but I would reach out directly to the schools you are interested in and explain your situation in not too many words.

My D22 goes to a small school, too ,and ended up having a scheduling conflict with Chemistry last year (which was virtual anyway, but nobody knew that when they were making the schedules). Pre-COVID we had gone for a visit to one school (Appalachian State, which has since gotten knocked off her list) and we asked the admissions rep for our region if not taking Chemistry was a make or break for App State. (She said it was fine not to take it, btw.)

I am sure the AOs at many of the small schools would be happy to talk to you. It would probably count for “demonstrated interest” too. I don’t know that I would say something like “if I take online AP courses will you give me more money”, but you are a really good writer so I bet you can come up with a way to ask your question.

I can’t remember, do you know what majors you are considering? Did you do online classes last year? My D22 hates them, but is doing one AP class online this year because her school doesn’t offer it (AP Lang.) If you do decide to do online AP classes I would suggest to limit the number and only do a class that is related to what you want to study in college.

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My daughter did not have even calculus in high school, and she was accepted into an engineering school with large merit. When she took Calc I in college, more than half the class had had calc in high school and were repeating it for ‘depth.’ She got an A and many of them did not.

AP and IB courses are not the end all people think they are. Do not go into debt to take them. If you want to take a college class, take a college class. There are plenty online and you may live close enough to a community college or university to take one in person.

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@collegemom3717 When I saw your post I had to look back to check what I had written! :slight_smile:

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yes I misspoke @compmom was not doing those things.

I’m still aching from my many hours of painful experiences with aggressive adults here on cc.

and as I said I have a tendency to exaggerate (i.e. failing to say “some” posters are aggressive, etc.)

sorry again

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oh no I wasn’t saying I believe in AP classes!
heavens no (and you should see the blowback my father got here about his not believing in AP classes)

I’m only thinking of strategy. And again it’s not about what I want or don’t want (and also not about what I believe in)

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I was going to apply as a premed but I have no ap science (as of this moment). As you might guess, I’m totally open to any strategic major declaration at all. That’s for a new thread I guess.

I did not have online classes other than my 100% online HS classes last year. I also hate them, but this is not about what I like or enjoy.

I’m also not looking forward to the three periods of office work I have on my schedule now because my school only has 4 courses to give me and feels obligated to imprison me for a full day. The joys of in-person learning! But again, not about what I want or like.