Strength of schedule - how much does it really matter?

It does matter, but clearly, your daughter meets the rigor and standardized test score requirements for just about any school, plus she’s got second semester of junior year to improve grades even further, and make relationships with faculty that will get her the letters that she needs. Now it’s all about the “holistic” elements - in other words, portraying herself as what the college is looking for. Does she have particularly high achievement in an EC that they want? Is it a school that would prefer a full-pay applicant, vs one who needs fin aid, and is there a way to convey that to her advantage? Does she want a boutique major that they have, with a past demonstrated interest in that field, or at least a good story for it (and of course she can major in whatever she wants, once she’s in). Or do you anticipate that she will need to chase merit money, at a second or third tier college? Her stats could get her merit money at less competitive schools looking to improve their statistics.

None of the schools that you mentioned are out of her range, if she can make a good case for them. The best way to make a case for Tufts is to apply ED (they’re very concerned about their yield figures, don’t want to be seen as a safety school for the Ivies).

I think it’s too early to be compiling and narrowing, unless you’re planning on going on an April 2022 “Grand Tour” of the colleges, and hence want to narrow your list so that you can plan visits. Our approach has been to have our kids make applications based upon interests, finances, academics, geography, what info we could glean online, and then if they had multiple acceptable options after acceptances, go tour then. But I know that is SO 1970’s. I’ve been on ridiculous college tour trips with friends where they were taking their kids to tour schools that they were NEVER going to get into, and even if they did, there was no way that the family would qualify for enough aid, or had enough resources for the kid to attend, even if they did get in. I watched their intelligent but naive 17 yr old kid asking questions like, “Is there a curfew?”, when everyone knows that the only place you’re going to find that is a fundamentalist religious college, certainly not at a T20 school! Honestly, it was a total waste of time, and raised unrealistic expectations. Of course kid wound up at the State U (and was happy there). If your family falls into the middle to upper middle class demographic, even with your daughter’s lovely record, the most likely combination of affordability and good education is going to be your flagship state U (or a nearby one with a reciprocal tuition agreement), so please don’t forget to take a close look at those options.

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If she’s a national merit, you can go for cheap or free - may have to be open location wise - but you can save a boatload.

Can you confirm - is she national merit?

Some schools give a few thousand. Some give tuition and room - looking at you Alabama. And they have Honors, Research programs and more. That puts your cost at food - so $30K for 4 years!!! A lot cheaper than $360K at Tufts!!

If you’re in TN, what’s one more state?

Can you confirm tho- as you made that statement.

What kind of “grad school”?

PhD programs worth attending should be funded (tuition waiver and living expense stipend, often based on being a teaching or research assistant)… although some students at some programs find the living expense stipend to be a bit short of actual expenses.

However, professional programs (e.g. MD, DO, JD, MBA, etc.) are often very expensive.

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With those stats and the ability to pay, about 95% of schools will be easy ins. If you want a truly elite school then I am afraid, it is basically a crap shoot. Do what most tryhard students do, shogun to T20/T30 and something will stick. Merit $ and prestige are inversely proportional. If you want to save for grad school, then choosing merit (and name recognition) vs prestige is IMO the smart path forward.

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She is a junior now. Definitely not positive about national merit but her score is 2 points higher than any previous year cut offs for our state so hoping it’s high enough for consideration. She’s still figuring things out and may change several times but graduate school would likely be in the medical field. Geographically Vanderbilt and Wake are on the list but may drop off based partially on location. It’s a comfort level for her and I respect that. Trying to put together a reasonable list for visits this year, but also because with IB her summer and senior year fall are very busy with the extended essay and service projects.

She’s a good student but not the tip top 4.0 one - they’ll be a couple of Bs here and there particularly freshman year. If a school wants an all A student then it’s probably not worth the application effort so that’s why the question about strength of schedule. Does admissions, especially at those top stat schools, look kindly on those grades given her schedule?

Given some of the schools you mentioned earlier, and if cost is not a problem, you might want to look at College of William & Mary; and as a larger school possibility, UVA or UNC-Chapel Hill (although they can be difficult for OOS applicants).

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Did u mention which state you are from ? I assume in the northeast ?

Are you sure they are need aware for domestic students?

All great schools but I don’t think close enough to a city. Thinking maybe Pitt, Maryland or George Mason.

Great question - they school won’t say - other than they meet 100%. I suppose a call to the admissions or aid office can answer.

But various publications say need aware - such as their student newspaper.

Given that 2088 of 6008 students - per CDS - were awarded any need based scholarship/grants or less than 35% - I’d assume it to be true as well.

Look at a similar school (I think) that are need blind - Harvard is 55%.

I put a second source - and yes, it’s 3rd party - but lists all 105 need blind admissions schools - Tufts isn’t on it. But again, it’s 3rd party. But to the best of my knowledge, Tufts can use aid to pick and choose. It was actually a big topic on a previous thread related to yield - this came up a lot.

Let me know if I have something wrong (I know you will) :slight_smile:

Funding Our Future: Need-blind admissions - The Tufts Daily

All 105 Need-Blind Colleges in the US: A Complete Guide (prepscholar.com)

For top schools, rigor of schedule compared to peers/in the context of what the HS offers is definitely important. Every tour we did(precovid) for D21 emphasized it over and over(we saw several Top25 schools, but even slightly lower schools said it too).

IS she taking the hardest course load possible at her school?

I am not familiar with IB, but often on CC people post that their child will have 8 APs by graduation and it sounds rigorous on the surface, but if you dig deeper the APs are APGeography, psych, world history, stats, language, Econ, gov,etc, and they have somehow avoided the hardest APs offered at their school, so a peer with 6APs at the same school who took APPhysC, AP BC calc, APUSH, APChem, and others will be in better shape for college admissions, assuming still 3.9+UW grades. I am making a rather dramatic comparison, but it does matter. I have numerous examples from our school where crazy-high gpa, 1500+ kids who took the easier path to As/A+ get “shut out” while kids who have only slightly lower grades(3.9 uw) and similar scores get “in”. So talk to the counselor if you can or maybe head teachers and make sure she has as much rigor as possible while avoiding Bs from now on if she can.

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Pitt came to mind immediately but only with scholarships. Honors would be a big bonus. I wouldn’t pay full tuition though. It’s a public school but not huge. U Delaware came to mind too.

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UDel definitely comes in lower that Pitt after merit, my daughter got into both in honors.

We are in state PA and cost of attendance for D with merit offers from Pitt and Udel are nearly identical. Both good options! May rank one over the other based on major….

Your kiddo will get into great schools with great options. Find a good balance of targets abs reaches since you have in state safeties. Avoid letting her fall in love with anything that you don’t want to pay for!

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So - I’m going to throw a lot out - I think as a Junior you start big and go smaller as you research (over weeks of course)

As a business traveler, I’m going to throw out one other thing. I don’t know where you’re from but I assume the Northeast. So if you’re traveling to, let’s say Charlotte by plane, what’s the difference if you fly to Atlanta or Miami, etc. I totally understand the restriction - but if you’re able to secure a great cost somewhere, it’s not as if the person is flying home every month, etc. - and an hour flight or hour and 40, there’s really no difference…at least to me.

Here may be some schools to look at - especially if you’re looking at grad school which is more cost. I’m only listing schools that offer merit - you already know the schools that don’t. Some have a religious bent - not sure where you are there. And tried, for the most part, to keep in city/suburban since that seems to be your desire. And nothing huge!! Maybe something will help you - maybe it won’t.

Don’t forget - a superstar is the norm at a Rochester, Case Western and especially a Tufts or Brown. So you want to, in some ways, be the tallest person in the room in order to get merit. Your grades and GRE or MCAT if you are seeking medical school will get you to the next level.

Also, at the bottom, just to start thinking about it, I put a link to NMF scholarships. Again, you might decide, to save $100K or $200K, we can get geographically flexible - that’s a personal call - and don’t forget, even the largest colleges (which I didn’t list) - but they have Honors colleges - so your Indiana, Rutgers, SUNY Buff, etc. Some of the scholarships may have changed - hopefully you will qualify.

American - DC
Binghamton - NY
Brandeis - Mass
Butler - IN
Chicago - IL
College of Charleston - SC - google the Charleston Fellows program
College of NJ - NJ
Dayton - OH
Delaware - DE
Duquense - PA
Elon - not near city but popular with NE. Lower tuition but also lower merit.
Emory and Oxford College of Emory - GA
Fairfield - - CT
Furman - SC
Holy Cross - Mass
Lafayette - PA
Lehigh - PA
Loyola - MD
Macalester - MN - a tad small but well regarded, good merit
Marquette - WI
Mercer - GA
Miami - FL - last year $25K merit was common but some get more.
Miami - OH - ok, exception it’s rural but near Cincy/Dayton, has Honors and great mreit!!
Pitt - PA - apply early to get merit
Quinnipiac - CT
Richmond - VA ( I left off W&M and UVA - based on cost)
Rice - Texas
Rochester - NY
SMU - Texas - has a freebie program
St. Joes - PA
Scranton - PA
Seton Hall - NJ - not huge merit
Syracuse - NY
UMBC - MD
UNC - NC - even full pay it’s high but not Tufts high
UNC Asheville - NC
UNH - New Hampshire
U of SC - SC - too big but top Honors College in the Country
UVM - Vermont
Wake Forest - NC - offers merit to less than 3% - so if want merit, highly unlikely
W&L - VA - this misses everything but check out the Johnson Scholarship (10% get) and they have other full tuition - small, gorgeous, and pricey - unless you win!!! They’ll send a free app too. To me, worth a flyer!!

Selective Colleges Offering National Merit Scholarships (■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■)

10 Best Full-Ride College Scholarships for National Merit Finalists • College Guidepost

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@LostInTheShuffle – Yes, 3 HL are required for the IDB. Several SL are interchangeable with AP.

OP: At the school DS attended, that GPA in the IBD program would be excellent. (But then again, nobody ever had a 4.0.) She should have a few SL scores this summer and that may help as well. I don’t think those schools are necessarily out of the question. But at the risk of stating the obvious, definitely make sure the list includes some that are less selective. The IDB generally checks the box for most rigorous.

My kids applied to many of these schools, I’d add UCONN and UMASS for merit.

I just didn’t based on size - but yes.

This is amazing - thank you! Definitely a lot to consider. Not Northeast but rather Mid-Atlantic. The geographical issue isn’t a plane ride (except maybe the West Coast) but rather where she feel she will be comfortable (fit/feel). There’s so many great schools this is just one way she narrowed it down.

Glad it will help - I focused on size (not too large) and merit - but if she does get NMF, then you have to figure out - do we go close to free - or still pay a ton. You can tell - I’m all about value.

And lots of schools have “competitions” - i.e. $ above the norm - such as Charleston Scholars, the Jefferson at UVA, W&L Johnson, SMU - and other endowed scholarships. Just remember, there’s really smart kids at most every school.

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