<p>Dear Mr. FAFSA,
Thank you for such a logical and well-deserved choice of an EFC! $14,000 dollars when I have a twin brother who will be attending school the same time as me, giving us a total EFC between my brother and I of $28,000!</p>
<p>Let's see... my mom makes about $90,000 per year. Subtract 30% for taxes and we're down to $63,000. Now subtract $23,000 per year for the three mortgages that we have and we reach $40,000. $28,000 / $40,000 = 70%... So, Mr. FAFSA, you expect my mother to pay 70% of of the money she actually sees towards our college cost, leaving her with $12,000 per year to pay for heating, electricity, food, gas, etc.</p>
<p>Thanks again, Mr. FAFSA, for making my dreams come true!</p>
<p>Sincerely,
Jarn</p>
<p>Sorry, I'm just a bit angry right now... my first financial aid offer came in and I am... disappointed. I had imagined that I would be graduating with a hefty load of debt if I was accepted and matriculated at any of the upper-tier colleges that I applied to (so far I have been accepted to Northwestern and my brother to Cornell) but I had not counted on even my state school thinking that I should have to give them $14,000 per year. I had imagined that they, at least, would give me some decent merit aid.</p>
<p>Please remember something...FAFSA does NOT award financial aid. It is a form that collects financial information which is used to award need based federal aid only. </p>
<p>Both Northwestern and Cornell use the CSS Profile in addition to the FAFSA. The information on the Profile is used by the schools to award institutional aid...based on what the school determines is your need.</p>
<p>I'm not trying to diminish your disappointment at your aid offers. Many students are in the same situation as you are. The formulas used by the FAFSA and the colleges using Profile to determine aid make a LOT of people feel that they are being given much less aid than they can reasonably pay.</p>
<p>WHY don't people understand the EFC is not, was not, nor will ever be meant to be an amount you are expected to pay only out of current income. </p>
<p>and what is with the 3 mortgages??? </p>
<p>Any equity in those houses added to your EFC for schools that used CSS</p>
<p>Is there any way to delete a thread once people have already replied?</p>
<p>Thumper, thanks for reminding me that a lot of others out there are in a similar situation. It helps to put things into perspective.</p>
<p>Sue, it's a little rude to be condescending and tell me I don't understand when you have no clue what our family's finances are. Yes, I realize that EFC is meant to be for future income, too. Do I think that it seems reasonable to graduate with $50,000 in debt? No.</p>
<p>"WHY don't people understand the EFC is not, was not, nor will ever be meant to be an amount you are expected to pay only out of current income. "</p>
<p>This needs to be a sticky thread at the top of the forum.
It's harsh on those who have had sudden increases in income or other factors, but for most folks - you have had this kid for 18 years, you are expected to have thought about college costs before now. Savings, income, future payments. Kind of like Poseidon's trident.</p>
<p>Jarn, I really hope one of your schools comes through for you...and along with your parent contribution and any aid you get, it all works out for both you and your brother. </p>
<p>College costs are very high and I can say (from personal experience) it's NO FUN using a large portion of income, and savings...and loans to help fund a college education for two kids. </p>
<p>I'll keep my fingers crossed for you that maybe some merit aid will come your way too.</p>
<p>I have to say...I wish those running for president this year were considering the high costs of college in their platforms. For some families, an education at their flagship U is just not financially possible anymore.</p>
<p>Out of all of my friends with now college age kids, only one family had a solid plan and savings for their only child's college education.... it was created out of a family business buy out of the father's share of the business.</p>
<p>most of us didn't have the means to save like we " should have " to cover the expenses of our kid's educations.
It can be a deceiving process..what you think you are expected to pay, is seldom reflective of the bill that comes in</p>
<p>The FAFSA and EFC are well documented. you could have run the numbers a few years ago to have an idea of your number.</p>
<p>Your expenses aren't part of the equation. If there are extraordinary circumstances (caring for invalid grandparent), appeal to the school.</p>
<p>if you didn't want home equity to factor in, go to a FAFSA only school.</p>
<p>Free Application for Federal Student Aid. It doesn't award money. And pretty much if you are not Pell grant eligible, the only federal aid is a max 3500 stafford in freshman year and 4000 in perkins. And a school may not even offer the full Perkins loan. That's IT. Besides the Pell grant (and honestly even though recipients seem like they are getting more free $$ than you, they are living on 1/3 your income or less so be happy you aren't at that income level).</p>
<p>ALL other aid, whether it be grants or scholarships, you know, the free money is given out by schools at their own discretion. Some schools have more $$ than others. Some won't award $$ above the EFC</p>
<p>Let me ask this, what number do you think would be 'fair' for your parent(s) to pay per year for you and your brother.</p>
<p>I should start a new thread. Tell me your EFC and then tell me what you think is a fair number (based on what you can afford) </p>
<p>from barack obama's website. this won't solve the problems and I'm not sure how it's different from the current tax credit (no income restriction??)</p>
<p>:Higher Education</p>
<pre><code>* Create the American Opportunity Tax Credit: Obama will make college affordable for all Americans by creating a new American Opportunity Tax Credit. This universal and fully refundable credit will ensure that the first $4,000 of a college education is completely free for most Americans, and will cover two-thirds the cost of tuition at the average public college or university and make community college tuition completely free for most students. Obama will also ensure that the tax credit is available to families at the time of enrollment by using prior year's tax data to deliver the credit when tuition is due."
</code></pre>
<p>Way back I started a thread that is tacked to the top of this forum entitled "Preparing for Financial Aid". The first thing in there, is to have a frank discussion with your family regarding what they can contribute to your college education. I want to reiterate, this is VERY important (Juniors..and families...take notice). Families need to be very above board regarding what they can and will contribute for college expenses. This information can help students as they craft their college lists. It's important that the finances be considered if that is important to your family. Unfortunately this discussion doesn't take place with everyone, and every year, there are students who are surprised, disappointed, whatever, when they find that there is a big difference between what the school thinks their family will contribute and what they actually WILL contribute. </p>
<p>Also (and when I amend my thread for the upcoming year), there are financial aid calculators that can give you decent estimates for both federal and institutional aid based on the numbers you would plug into the FAFSA and Profile. BUT those estimates are only going to be as accurate as the numbers you put into those calculators. That is why I advise folks to keep their pay stubs. Parents of juniors...start keeping them now.</p>
<p>Frankly young people, many colleges cost more than $5000 a year when I went in 1974 so please, please young people talk to your parents before you fill out college applications. In 1988 financial planners were telling adults to plan on $40,000 to $60,000 per year to educate their children which seemed so improbable to me at that time, and fortunately we for the most part at the bottom of that target....none of this should be shocking to parents so talk to your parents. There are colleges at all ends of the cost spectrum, parents here are not pulling your leg when they tell students to have a financial safety. Many states with large flagship schools have satellite campuses that are considerably less expensive than the flagship location. Many states have strong community college systems with guarantee transfers. Many states have small "liberal arts" campuses that are less expensive than private LACs. If you are a student make sure you know what your options are - do not mistakenly think that colleges or the govenment is going to "pay you" to attend college even if you are the "best and the brightest" your high school has to offer.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>so far I have been accepted to Northwestern and my brother to Cornell>></p>
</blockquote>
<br>
<p>Jarn...these are the two schools you mentioned as places of acceptance for you and your brother in your original post. Both use the Profile..and the cost of attendance at both is at least 8 X $5000.</p>
<p>I think your concern is that the calculated EFC is higher than $5000. I wish I could give you better news...these schools have formulas they use to distribute financial aid. They are not changed for each applicant based on what their families WILL contribute. </p>
<p>State schools do not have large sums of endowment funds in general (there are a few with huge endowments...and institutional aid too). Most give smaller amounts of financial aid, because your tax dollars in your state are ALREADY subsidizing your education at those schools. If you are an out of stater applying at a public university, you usually have to be a very high stat student to receive any kind of substantial merit aid.</p>
<p>I don't think Jarn would have been happy if his FA package had been 100 % grants excluding the EFC. I get the impression that paying any more than 10K total for 2 kids is all they can do. Completely unrealistic for 99% of colleges and unless you are in the top applicant pool and get major merit aid (regardless of need).</p>
<p>My son's super safety state school would have been about 14K for the COA. They gave him no scholarship and only the stafford loan. My out of pocket would have been over 10K (and my EFC was 12K). The cheapest state school would have been only a few thousand less than what I am paying to NYU because of a large scholarship.</p>
<p>That's reality. If I only wanted to spend 5K, my son would be at community college or maybe a Penn State satellite campus and living at home (like both my neighbors kids are doing).</p>
<p>
[quote]
Jarn...these are the two schools you mentioned as places of acceptance for you and your brother in your original post. Both use the Profile..and the cost of attendance at both is at least 8 X $5000.
[/quote]
I realize that. I said in my original post that I would consider and had expected the need to take out outrageous loans for those schools. I would not have applied if I was completely unwilling. I am, in fact, considering it - as I said in my original post. It's the state school that bothers me, though. I had not expected that I would need to go massively in debt to pay for a state school, not as a National Merit Finalist with a 34 on the ACT.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I don't think Jarn would have been happy if his FA package had been 100 % grants excluding the EFC.
[/quote]
You're right, not for the state school. I will be overjoyed if that is the result from Northwestern, though. You seem to think that I'm just some greedy kid who wants more than his fair share. You said yourself that your son got a large scholarship to NYU. Is it wrong for me to hope for a decent scholarship from a state school, to be a bit disappointed when I don't get one?</p>
<p>I completely realize what reality is. I didn't say I would only be willing to spend $5k, I said that I believe that is what would be fair from a state school given my high test scores, GPA, and good extracurriculars. I am not expecting to pay $5k at Northwestern - heck, at Northwestern I would consider paying $30k. Does this mean that I would graduate $120k in debt? Yes. But it's something I will need to consider in the days ahead. At the University of Minnesota... I had not expected the need to pay $14k per year (leaving me with $56,000 in debt come graduation). I had hoped for some decent merit aid. I got some, yes, but not as much as I hoped or as much as (I feel that) I deserve. A number that I could swing would be closer to $10k. A number that I could swing without taking out loans would be about $5-6k.</p>
<p>Again, I am NOT saying that I think I should have to pay $5k to go to Northwestern. You have entirely the wrong impression if you think that.</p>
<p>But your EFC is the same no matter how much the college costs. They may not want to give a scholarship to someone (regardless of how worthy you are) because they see that your EFC is nearly equal to the COA.</p>
<p>Did you look into schools that give big awards to NMF?</p>
<p>If your parent didn't save $$ all along and you didn't run the EFC calculation a year ago, that is the problem.</p>
<p>Yes, my son did get a large scholarship from NYU, my EFC is 12K and I am paying every penny of that and a bit more. I have all 4 years saved (which still won't be enough because costs will go up every year). And I have never made more than 65K and was making less than 40K 8 years ago.</p>
<p>Based on the very limited data points I have (two FA packages from top 15 private U), I could say these:</p>
<p>1) the expected family contribution is ~10% higher than the EFC estimated by FASFA.
2) loans is part of the "aid"
3) these schools will meet your demonstrated needs</p>
<p>If you live way below your means like we do, you should be able to afford these schools with just current income.</p>