<p>A really large percentage of middle to upper middle class families (incomes of $75,000 - $175,000 combined) tell their children: We will budget and pay for prestigious State U. If you want to go to prestigious Private U, the monetary difference is on your dime.</p>
<p>that’s just real life. When did anyone get the idea that a private university is anyone’s right, or any parent’s test of true love?</p>
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<p>With regards to your second point, we can say that love is the willingness for parents to do things that are in the child’s interests. I’m sure everyone can agree this to be a reasonable definition. Well, wouldn’t the parent’s actions that leads to the child’s BEST interests be a maximization of love?</p>
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<p>Yes - but, as others in this thread have argued, the jump from “Parents ought to do the best for their children” to “Parents ought to pay exorbitant amounts for their child’s education” is not as simple as you assume.</p>
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<p>It is simple. Because I can use definitions to argue it logically. By definition, if parents have to, and can, pay exorbitant amounts of money for a child’s education,and if the education offers the child a better future than other less expensive options, they should if they want to express maximum love for their child. Note that I didn’t use the term love by itself. Many people don’t pay for their child’s education when capable and still love him/her. But the question is whether they express maximum love, which I think I addressed amply. </p>
<p>Maybe you should point out “others” arguments so I can analyze their logical structures. I haven’t read the whole thread.</p>
<p>Money=love. Not logical at all. Often withholding money shows more love in the long run by teaching self -reliance, independence, etc.</p>
<p>^^^ </p>
<p>Sounds like cognitive dissonance to me. You haven’t severed the linkage in my reasoning yet. Why? Because, if that were true, then we can disregard the fact that most people that are well off are exactly the ones that has been “pampered”.</p>
<p>Also, I’ve never said money=love. Reread my post.</p>
<p>The point of the matter is that the parent must be helping student get through their education by paying most of the fees incorporated in their education. They are only diminishing the students ability to learn at their peak when they are focusing on trivial things like paying for college tuition.</p>
<p>The issue is somewhat different for families who live in states without excellent public universities, like New York State. The difference between Berkeley and Stanford might not justify a large outlay of additional dollars but the difference between SUNY and Columbia might justify it.</p>
<p>Some parents seem to love their money more than their kids. As I’ve tried to show, it doesn’t take a huge boost in the child’s income to justify extra cost in the long run. And, that is without considering the intangible benefits of a more desireable college experience.</p>
<p>There are numerous cases of students getting much more out of college when they pay for it themselves. Far too many students who are there on their parents dime hardly take school seriously and treat it as a four year sleep away camp.</p>
<p>“As I’ve tried to show, it doesn’t take a huge boost in the child’s income to justify extra cost in the long run. And, that is without considering the intangible benefits of a more desireable (sic) college experience.”</p>
<p>The jury is out on whether attending an elite university provides any boost to income, when earnings of comparable students are measured.</p>
<p>What constitutes a desirable college experience varies quite a bit from student to student. Not every student wants to the most selective university they might enter. That’s a common (and to my mind, very narrow) way of looking at the choice. </p>
<p>I wouldn’t presume to leap to any conclusions about how much parents love their children based on their financial decisions about college. Have you considered that parents who plan sensibly for their own retirement, in balance with the concerns of the rest of the family, are less likely to saddle their beloved children with costs of their care in age and infirmity?</p>
<p>Ideally, parents should plan for both retirement and college education.</p>
<p>Parents shouldn’t leave themselves destitute but should be willing to pay for the most advantageous and beneficial college education possible for their children. If that means a lower standard of living in retirement, so be it.</p>
<p>I don’t fault parents who sacrifice dearly and still can’t afford the ideal college for their kid. I fault selfish parents who won’t give up their boat for the sake of their child’s education (and there are plenty of them).</p>
<p>How much do you need in retirement to supplement social security? Opinions would vary greatly. If you overspent on luxuries, it may seem like you need a lot more than you really do need. Materialistic parents would have trouble giving up the yearly cruise. </p>
<p>Those who are rich, have nothing extra. Those who are poor, have no need. (To paraphrase the Bible.)</p>
<p>Why would kids ever have to pay for the care of their elderly parents? Buy long-term care insurance. Give your money to your children as early as possible and let medicaid/medicare pay for the care.</p>
<p>Collegehelp,</p>
<p>“How much do you need in retirement to supplement social security?”</p>
<p>“Why would kids ever have to pay for the care of their elderly parents? Buy long-term care insurance. Give your money to your children as early as possible and let medicaid/medicare pay for the care.”</p>
<p>My dear child, it is blindingly clear that you have not yet had to do any serious homework on this topic.</p>
<p>Ask your parents to show you their Social Security Statements (they should receive one each year), and then take a look at how much of their living costs would be covered by that amount of money. Ask your grandparents or elderly friends/neighbors to share their medicaid/medicare information with you and see how well their medical expenses are covered. Ask your parents and their friends just exactly how much they slip to their parents/grandparents/siblings/etc. each year to help those people cover their living costs. Ask your parents what long-term care insurance is costing them, and what exactly is covered. Ask them which of their friends/relatives have suffered a medical condition that has made it impossible for them to qualify for long-term care insurance. Look at your own next paycheck, and think long and hard about how much is taken out of it each pay period for Social Security (FICA) and Medicare, and ask yourself how many senior citizens you are already helping to support, and then ask yourself how many younger people are in the pipeline to keep supporting everyone who is your age or older. And, while you are at it, ask yourself what you are going to say to the love of your life when his/her family arrives on your doorstep in need of food and shelter, and possibly a good immigration lawyer.</p>
<p>You don’t know yet what life will throw at you. You don’t know yet whether you will be able to create the dream conditions for your own future children. I fully sympathize with your disgust with rich parents who won’t pay for their kids’ educations, but please stay off the case of the rest of the middle class.</p>
<p>collegehelp wrote: "Why would kids ever have to pay for the care of their elderly parents? "</p>
<p>OK, this explains why you have taken many of the positions you have. You really don’t know, do you?</p>
<p>Like happymomof1 said, you never know what life will throw at you.</p>
<ul>
<li>everything is going great, and the industry you’ve been in for 25 years is being slowly relocated to China.. earnings go down, and after a few years you’re out of a job, looking for a new career at 50 at half the earnings.</li>
<li>cannot afford LTC insurance, and an LTC hits </li>
<li>children need money</li>
<li>parents need money</li>
<li>you don’t make enough after taxes, mortgage, expenses, and auto/health insurance to save enough for both college and retirement</li>
</ul>
<p>The fact is, MOST people cannot afford to take a $200k after tax hit now, or ever, no matter how much planning they do.</p>
<p>The truth is, if a parent loves his/her child to the highest possible degree, they won’t make sensible decisions. They would rather pull all of their out of their retirement savings just to pay. There really is an inverse relation between rational self interest and love. Not that its a good thing. But thats how it is. </p>
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<p>@Barron. And isn’t it strange that usually only people that have to pay themselves agree to this counterintuitive hypothesis? </p>
<p>If your case is true, you would find it in your best interest to turn down a full scholarship to a university to only attend the same university paying out of your own pocket( by slaving away while attending school.). What do you think? Is this a good decision? </p>
<p>Also,define numerous. Is it a hundred? A thousand? Perhaps whats more important is is numerous defined as the majority of a sample size of self-independent students? Perhaps evidence is needed.</p>
<p>Here’s an interesting question related to barrons’ comment. Do you spoil a kid by giving too much or too little? Or by giving too much of the wrong things and too little of the right things? In which case, what are the right things?</p>
<p>Another thought: when you shortchange your child, you may shortchange your grandchildren and future generations too, consigning them to lesser lives. When you sacrifice to boost your child to the next level, you may elevate your grandchildren and future generations also.</p>
<p>If you can’t find the money to send your kid to the best school possible but you have found the money for the following, then you have made the Biggest Mistake:</p>
<p>(1) remodeled/sided your home
(2) bought a vacation home
(3) bought a boat
(4) bought new furniture/furnishings more than once in 20 years
(5) bought a wide-screen TV
(6) bought a camper/trailer
(7) spent more than $2000 each year on vacations
(8) had elective plastic surgery
(9) pay for lawn service
(10) spent more than $10K on a car
(11) spent more than $300 per year on clothes
(12) spent more than $50 per month on entertainment
(13) bought new appliances more than once in 20 years
(14) spent more than $50 per year on jewelry</p>
<p>I welcome contributions to Biggest Mistake list…</p>
<p>What a great idea; let’s make a list of “biggest mistakes” so it’s easier to figure out who to judge!</p>
<p>Can we also make a list of how much money parents could possibly spend on their children, so we can figure out whose parents love them and how much? I mean, I can’t really tell sometimes… if only they showed me their bank statements more often!</p>
<p>collegehelp –</p>
<p>you must have been napping when manufacturers started making appliances with projected 7 year lifespans.</p>
<p>Our Viking stovetop exhaust vent went out four months ago. It was originally bought in July 1999, and installed in November 1999. When the Sears applicance repair guy came out, he gave me an estimate of $650 to buy the new controller, and install it. He called back three days later to report that Viking only keeps parts in inventory for seven years. They don’t have the part anymore. After that time you simply cannot repair it. Now I have to spend $1450 to get a completely new unit and pay another $500 to have it installed.</p>
<p>You never know what life is going to throw your way.</p>
<p>collegehelp, i like your style. our modern society promotes so much consumption and indulgence, though, that it seems like parents willing to actually make those sacrifices for their kids are sadly in the minority. my friend lives in a $3 million house and attends a prep school costing $26k per year but did not attend USC because her parents said the financial aid wasn’t good enough.</p>
<p>Colleges are just another product trading on image. I have yet to see a shred of proof that similar quality students with similar interests are harmed by going to one school over another. All this guilt-tripping of parents if they don’t want to fork over $50K to elite U is just bcrap. Harmed for generations–oh please.</p>