The Colburn School

College Majors Music Major
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<p>I came across an ad in the International Musician this month for the Colburn School. It listed faculty by instrument but didn't mention where they were located! Guess I was supposed to know it is in LA.</p>

<p>The website is
*</a> The Colburn School *</p>

<p>They offer full monetary support for all accepted (tuition, room and board).
I'm sure the competition is high level for admission.
Apparently a large, well established performing arts school of 50 yrs. The college conservatory is only 3 years old. Brand new facilities just opened this past summer.
They offer undergraduate and also 'artists certificates'.</p>

<p>Any first hand info? I'm a mom always looking for affordable opportunities for a musicson.</p>

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<p>Along with Curtis, Colburn is so highly competitive and selective that it's a stretch for even the most gifted musician. It's a small school and so they may only admit one or two of a certain instrument or voice type each year (or maybe even none in any given year). If I'm not mistaken, they cover even more of the expenses than Curtis does (Curtis does not cover housing). Colburn has a close relationship with USC Thornton School of Music as well. Some of the faculty also teaches at USC, i.e. Lipsett and John Perry.</p>

<p>Wasn't there a member of CC (tuba player?) who was accepted to Colburn last year?</p>

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<p>one of my friends goes to colburn for bass. it's really competitive - they only take one bass per year. it's basically considered the curtis of the west coast.</p>

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<p>as violinmom says, it is highly competitive, and like Curtis offers full tuition to all accepted students.</p>

<p>NewtoMusic's son is a freshman tuba performance student at Colburn; you might want to PM her.</p>

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<p>I believe that Curtis has age restrictions for applicants, but I'm not so sure that Colburn does. That means at Colburn, you might be competing with students who already have a bachelor's degree. Maybe someone else knows for sure.</p>

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<p>They are definitely targeting the Curtis/Juilliard/etc crowd. Their program offerings seem very similar to Curtis's, and they one-upped them by offering a completely free ride. </p>

<p>I'm not sure they're quite there yet, in terms of competing with the others. As usual, the teacher matters most, and IMHO, based on what I've heard, they haven't been able to snag the cream of the crop teachers for every instrument yet. (Of course, I don't know all the teachers, or who is tops in each field, so I'm only referring to those I might know something about). Since the school is only a few years old, it's hard to follow up on "where they are now" in terms of student success.</p>

<p>That said, I believe that it is positioned to become an excellent option for kids seeking a conservatory environment. By offering everything free, they are naturally going to attract top students, so their program quality should increase as they get better known. If your kid gets in, and likes the teacher, I'd go for it! </p>

<p>I do like the page that lists how many openings they have for each instrument. I haven't seen that on Curtis's or Juilliard's pages. </p>

<p>One negative: I don't see anything for voice listed, so I guess they don't have an opera program? They do have drama and dance, which Curtis does not have, but Juilliard does.</p>

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<p>Actually, they do not have drama or dance at the conservatory. They offer voice, drama, and dance at the school (non-degree), but the conservatory (BM, diploma, and certificates) is for instrumentalists only.</p>

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<p>Okay - I see my mistake: since the Performing Arts drop-down box still appears on the conservatory page, I thought it was part of the conservatory.</p>

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<p>I knew I'd get some good info from this group!</p>

<p>So, even though it's only been ongoing for about 3 years, Colburn is highly selective and probably highly competitive (that free tuition, R&B thing). Curtis on the west coast.
But I do think that it differs by offering some grad options. I think Curtis has a top age limit of 21 or 22.</p>

<p>Binx, thanks for mentioning that page of openings by instrument.
Our musicson plays tuba......0-1 openings expected for 2008!</p>

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<p>The new dorms are supposed to be nice -- every room has a flat screen TV...the location is right in downtown LA, near the LA musical halls (the Disney Symphony building and Dorothy Chandler Pavilion), but that also means it is a fairly isolated location -- without a car, it would be a tough place for a student (unless the student was practicing all the time).</p>

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<p>Curtis's age limit changes based upon instrument. Brass, woodwinds, piano, cello, violins, percussion are 21, harp, harpsichord, organ, viola, and bass are 23. Composition and conducting students must be under 28. Vocal studies have their own ranges. They need musicians who are still maleable, and they are targeting the "virtuosic" musicians.</p>

<p>Curtis, being small, can be somewhat flexible if needed. My S's friend, who had finished her master's at Juilliard (and I'm sure she was over the age limit) was invited to get her AD at Curtis. I think it was an invitation to fulfill a specific instrumentation need, though. She did not audition for the spot.</p>

<p>One perk Curtis has is the ability to take courses at UPenn. I know of two people personally who have degrees from both schools, done simultaneously.</p>

<p>I'm sure I'm biased, but I just don't see Colburn on the same level yet. Curtis has:
- track record
- tippy top teachers
- vocal program (I think it's a disadvantage for a classical musician to not get opera experience)
- "Ivy connection"</p>

<p>If my kid had the choice between Juilliard, Curtis, and Colburn, I would have him take a long, hard look at the teacher, and the overall experience, before making the decision. (Of course, the chances of a kid being admitted to all three is somewhat .. shall we say .. unlikely.) The money would be hard to turn down, and that is what Colburn is betting. Therefore, I do think Colburn is up and coming. If I were starting a conservatory, that is exactly how I would want to enter the competition.</p>

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<p>Certainly, Curtis' track record places it way above Colburn, IMHO.</p>

<p>But Colburn is an interesting option to consider. I guess I was surprised to learn of a 'new' conservatory. Married to a musician and mother of soon to graduate student musician, I mistakenly thought I was pretty up on the choices in the US. Live and learn.</p>

<p>I sent link to son.....I'll be interested to hear his take, especially on the instrumental teachers. Perhaps it will spark him to investigate Colburn for grad program.</p>

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<p>There was a good background article on Colburn in the Aug/Sept issue of Strings magazine.</p>

<p>Colburn is going to be a force to be reckoned with for the few with the talent to make the cut. Young artists like Lindsay Deutsch Lindsay</a> Deutsch Bio will serve to draw more attention to the school.</p>

<p>Some of the faculty is exceptional... Paul Ellison for bass, Paul Coletti for viola and chamber music, and Bob Lipsett for violin are all top of the line.</p>

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<p>As is Ron Leonard for cello.</p>

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<p>On a bass online forum, a student at Colburn posted the following info on the school: "I go to Colburn. I'm in my third year of my bachelor's and I'd love to share some info about the school before people get any crazy misconceptions about the place. I don't want to get too long-winded here, so if anyone has any specific questions about the school, the teachers or life in L.A., just shoot me an e-mail. </p>

<p>What can I say, it's an incredible institution. It might be just what you're looking for, but make sure you know what you're getting yourself into before you apply. It's a conservatory, and the focus is very much on performance. There are some basic academics required but the workload is nothing compared to a regular university or college. Academic classes are canceled during the week leading up to an orchestral performance to allow us time to rehearse and practice. The academic faculty are all very aware that our no. 1 priority is to practice and make music, so they're pretty gracious when it comes to missed deadlines, projects, etc. </p>

<p>State of the art facilities, a ton of practice rooms, 3 beautiful recital halls and a massive rehearsal hall. (and yes, hi-def TVs come as part of the fully furnished dorms, haha.) The school has a lot of money and will take care of you financially in pretty much every way possible. If college tuition is as big a burden for you as it would have been for me, Colburn is worth considering for that fact alone. </p>

<p>First and foremost, David Moore is an incredible teacher. As the newest bassist in the L.A. Phil, he knows what it takes to win an orchestral job these days. His teaching is meticulous, thorough and well balanced between orchestral and solo rep. We have a studio class every Monday with him where we go through all the major orchestral rep, as well as a mock audition every semester where we play for half the L.A. Phil bass section. If there are any sentiments that Colburn won't make you a solid orchestral player, they certainly aren't shared by me, or the rest of the studio here.
Paul Ellison stops by at least once a month and it's always a treat. </p>

<p>L.A. is a big city and yes, public transit sucks. However, if you're willing to make an effort to explore, there's a ton of cool stuff to do, and plenty of options within walking distance of the school. Disney Hall, Museum of Contemporary Art, Little Tokyo, Grand Central Market, Central Library and a handful of hip cafes are all within a 5 - 10 minute walk away. </p>

<p>I'm not trying to generate hype here; Colburn is not the place for everyone and a couple of students have transfered out. If you want a more well-rounded education as far as academics are concerned, or if you don't think you'd function well in a smaller, intimate environment I'd advise you look into a university such as Rice or IU. That being said, if you want to play a bunch of bass, study with some the best teachers of our time and not worry about paying for any of it, send in a tape."</p>

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<p>I am familiar with colburn, having a lot of friends there.</p>

<p>I would caution a parent with getting hung up on "reputation". This reputation that you're saying Colburn doesn't have compared to Curtis is not exactly the best way of thinking.</p>

<p>Outside of the music world, no one knows or cares about Curtis. The only music school the average person would know about is Juilliard. </p>

<p>Colburn's orchestra is probably the best student orchestra in the united states now. Curtis is having problems with some of its departments. They're just hiring old famous grads with no real record for teaching. What made it great was that it had some of the best pedagogues ever. Now, it has a lot of great players who teach. As a result it's not the same that it used to be.</p>

<p>To turn down Colburn, which I think is a better place to study (better city, better school environment etc...) because you think Curtis has a better reputation would be a mistake. Colburn will pay for everything. Curtis is a run down old house and frankly, the people are a bit scarry. I find colburn people less sheltered. The playing level is as high as Curtis. They're sending an impressive number of grads to top orchestras. If your kid is really into performance, there's really much better than that school.</p>

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<p>Ah...but for a musician, we ARE talking about the "music world". Both Colburn and Curtis are fine programs...as do Juilliard, MSM, NEC, Peabody, Northwestern U, Rice, etc. It all depends on what you are looking for, with whom you want to study, and where you want to be.</p>

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<p>I have no beef with Colburn, and am thrilled that there is another kid on the block. If possible, though, I'd love to see some documentation for your statements, Vieux. How do you know they have the best student orchestra? That seems to me like a subjective statement. I'm curious about the impressive number going into top orchestras, too. Since Colburn is a relatively new school, I'm surprised that they've had that many graduating classes already.</p>

<p>As Thumper says, we ARE talking about the music world. What school you graduate from does NOT give you an inch in a professional audition. But it might open doors for you for summer programs, or networking/contacts, or gigs, which in turn lead to experience and honed performance skills. </p>

<p>I am NOT saying Colburn doesn't have that - I have no info one way or another; it does seem like Colburn is establishing a good reputation quickly.</p>

<p>But I do think it makes a difference in some situations what school you go to. </p>

<p>If Colburn is offering great teachers, great education, and totally free college, it is definitely worth investigating. You aren't going to school for a name, you're going for an education. If a certain school, for example, is known to have a weak department in one instrument or another, that reputation can hurt. The teacher aspect is so important, I would hate for someone to jump on it - or Juilliard - or Curtis - or Podunk U. - if the teacher is not a "fit." It's all well and good to say one school has a bunch of big name performers who can't teach, and another school has big names who can. But how can any one person know how good the entire faculty teaches?</p>

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<p>Vieux, there is validity to your post, particularly the point of "not being hung up on reputation". The general population does not know Curtis, or Colburn (or NEC, Rice, and a host of others); when they think music, they think Juilliard.</p>

<p>Free is good. From a parent's perspective wonderful. But not if all does not mesh for the student.</p>

<p>For an undergrad with the talent and potential to consider Colburn, I would hope that they have examined all their musical options, and relied on parents, private instructors, ensemble directors to guide their searchs and recommend the best potential programs to examine.</p>

<p>There are many variables, foremost being the fit of student and teacher/mentor in choosing an undergrad experience. </p>

<p>It's important to realize that there are a limited number who can actually nail
a Colburn or Curtis audition given the level of competition for the programs. Those that don't will go to Juilliard, Indiana, Peabody, Eastman, NEC, Hartt, Manhattan, etc. A few more will end up at Podunk U, because of a great instructor. </p>

<p>And there will be graduates of all sitting in major orchestra both here and abroad.</p>

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<p>The New York Times just recently did a feature piece on Colburn in the Sunday Arts and Leisure section:
<a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/06/arts/music/06merm.html?ref=music%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/06/arts/music/06merm.html?ref=music&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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