@twoinanddone, maybe @mcr976 was not only speaking to the limited influence of a /14 partial scholarship on the decision, and maybe it was that in combination with the academic quality of the school. Our DD was recruited by lots of D1 and D2 schools that weren’t close academically to the NESCAC she decided on - given that she profiled at the NESCAC’s and scholarship money wasn’t part of our criteria, it made it much easier decision.
Thanks for starting this thread, Sam-I-Am. It was just what I was looking for because I need some advice from experienced runner parents. My D is a rising senior distance runner and she’s been on the fence about whether to pursue recruitment. She’s good enough to be of interest to some schools, but not the kind of athlete who is being bombarded with calls, etc. So far, we’ve had one coach at a D3 offer a pre-read and she’s getting that information to him. We also had a home visit recently from a D1 Coach at a school she likes. He said he would like to have her come for an OV in the fall, but didn’t mention a pre-read.
We’re trying to figure out what all of this might mean for us money-wise. We know D3 won’t give any scholarships, but my D will be competitive for academic scholarships and my D’s high school Coach keeps assuring us that, if the D3 Coach wants her, that will give her an edge in getting one of the academic scholarships. He told me the same thing about the D1 Coach - my D probably won’t get offered $ by the D1 school to run, but the D1 Coach will help to make sure that she gets academic scholarship $. The high school Coach says that’s why the D1 Coach likes my D - because he thinks she’ll contribute to the team and believes she can get academic $, meaning that he won’t have to use athletic $ to get her.
Does anyone know if that’s true? I don’t want my D to get her hopes up too much if the Coaches’ interest isn’t really going to give her an edge in the merit chase. Thanks for any advice!
I think the high school coach is twisting the reasoning. IF your daughter is qualified for an academic scholarship, she will get one, but the athletic department can’t get her one. She will be considered under the same criteria as all other applicants for merit awards.
Some people believe that athletes get secret merit money, that the schools are funneling academic money toward them. I don’t. I think the schools follow the ncaa rules. I do think that if there are merit awards or grants available, the athletic department makes sure the recruits qualify for them. For example, my daughter’s school has (had; no longer available) a $1000 grant for visiting the school before applying. The coaches made sure everyone knew about this grant, but it was a grant available to anyone applying to the school.
Okay - thanks for the response. I was afraid I was misunderstanding and didn’t think the coach would have influence over the academic awards. I think her Coach is just ultra confident that my D will qualify for an academic award, but because I read on here, I know they’re more competitive than he realizes. We’ll just see how it goes and I’ll let my D know the merit awards will be a long shot. Thanks again!
Emmycat, some schools follow a formula for academic scholarships. Such as half tuition for a set ACT score. But many scholarships are subjective with special essays required. Some applications go to academic committees within the school. You should be able to find more info on each school’s website or here on CC. Coach can’t help much other than increase your awareness of these so your kid can apply for them. Where there can appear to be overlap with athletic and academic money is where the scholarship is based in part on leadership since team captains have an advantage in money earmarked for leadership. However, athletes cannot receive merit money at a rate higher than the student population of it can be an NCAA violation. Good luck, and try to expand the search beyond just two options.
Agree, and remember that certain conferences such as D3 NESCAC don’t provide any merit scholarships; if merit scholarships are important some D3 Centennial and NCAC Conference schools provide them - my xc/track DD got them from several NCAC schools, but decided on a NESCAC.
Emmycat, I don’t want you to think she won’t get a merit scholarship. She might well be a top candidate for one, and if the coach at that school think she is, then go for it. I think the one who is misinterpreting the influence of the coach is the high school GC. The academic scholarships do not go to athletes because the coaches want to save money in the budget, but athletes may very well get a lot of those academic awards because athletes have the right leadership, scores, grades, recommendations. Many athletes are really good students.
Many coaches have been at their schools for years, have seen a lot of transcripts and know which of their previous athletes have received the academic awards. They have the experience to know the odds of ‘this’ type of student getting the awards, or ‘that’ kind of student needing a coach’s tip or slot.
So something I notice is that the early NLI signing period is Nov 8-15 this year but the early application deadline is Nov 1. Are NLI offers sometimes tied to an applicant first applying ED? A parallel question regarding the Ivy League, are likely letters sometimes tied to applying ED? The Ivies being outside the NLI regime because they cannot give athletic scholarships.
@Sam-I-Am my son was pushed to apply ED at an Ivy but he wasn’t done taking his OVs by the ED deadline. So the team held his spot, he took his other visits and then applied RD with the Ivy (after letting them know they were his top choice). He got his LL end of January
The NLI is separate from admission, early or regular. Students who haven’t been accepted can still sign an NLI in Nov if the school issues one. If the student is not later admitted, the NLI is void and the student can sign another one in the spring with another school.
Some coaches only want to give admissions support if the student applies ED. If the student wants support, he/she has to commit to ED.
I asked my daughter’s coach what the advantage was of signing early since she wasn’t getting a ‘tip’ or ‘slot’. She honestly said it makes the coach happy because she can figure out the team earlier, and the advantage to the athlete is it ends the roller coaster ride. Very true, says the mother of an indecisive kid.
My D18 has received no inquiries except through HS coach from elite D1 coach who attended the state meet. He suggested ED. Though this was very good, expected something more after July 1. Ran runner up at D1 state meet middle distance event. Surprised that the only he responded and no others, even lesser schools. We would like to investigate alternatives. Are girls track teams populated by in-state primarily, or are only the tip top runners treated to official visits, or is this too soon to tell?
Hello, glad I found this thread–I am not a fan of CC because I think it’s a lot of people looking for affirmation or touting their credentials, but I need advice and perspective. That said–my S’18 is interested in running XC/track in college. His times are solid D3 range; D1 could be a stretch depending on the school. So far 2 D3 coaches have expressed interest in him–one a NESCAC, the other not NESCAC but comparable in most ways. The NESCAC coach told him he will only support athletes who apply ED. I am very wary of ED for a lot of reasons (this is my 3rd time around for college apps so I am not new to the process, only the role of athletics). Meanwhile, we visited a lot of schools his junior year, and neither of these schools were on his radar until the coaches expressed interest in him. These may be great schools for him in the end, but I’m not so confident that I am ready to go the ED route. He has been in touch with the coaches at the schools he is more interested in (D1 and D3) but they have shown only polite interest to this point. So here are my questions–For D1–if he gets in on his own, will a coach let him try out for/work out with the team? For a D3–any suggestions for getting a coach more interested in him? What time frame are we looking at for that to happen? I know this isn’t football/baseball/basketball–do XC/track coaches continue to evaluate and recruit through the fall?
You really have to do the work and research on your own. Very few offers are received out of the air and even then, the schools might not be the ones you were thinking of or match academically. Now’s the time to send a bunch of emails saying “I ran in XXX and placed second. Some of my other times are xyz.” Include times, academic stats, why she’d fit with the school, and why she’d like to attend the school.
My daughter was contacted by a lot of schools after the summer showcases, but they were hit or miss schools. Most were LACs because she was a good student and a good player but not big enough for most D1 teams. She would have been good for them, but they weren’t right for her.
@eastcoast101, it’s the coach’s team, so he can set the rules about supporting only ED applicants. ED is all the D3 coaches have as leverage. How to get a D1 coach more interested? Run faster, get better grades, show continued interest in the school and team. Make sure the coach has your latest stats academically and athletically.
@eastcoast101, only polite interest during Junior Year Summer usually means that DD isn’t on their recruit list and so it’s unlikely that pr-reads or overnights will be offered. That said a breakout XC season can definitely change a D3 coach’s mind and cause them to push for ED2 or even support through RD - it’s not inconceivable for even a D1 xc/track recruit to wait until Winter of Senior Year to commit.
@eastcoast101 to answer your D1 question…yes it’s a possibility to try out and walk on for the XC/Track team once matriculated. As long as there’s a spot on the roster and times are in the range the team is looking for it’s definitely an option. There is usually no money offered but depending on the school and budget, money could be available for subsequent seasons.
@mimisdad don’t fret yet about the D1 coach. Just keep communication open and express interest. Sometimes OVs aren’t offered until late August to mid-September. It’s always a good idea to continue reaching out to other programs that are a fit academically and team-wise. If a top/elite D1 coach approached your D at the state meet that is a very good sign of strong interest. Keep in mind that top/elite D1 coaches are scouting the best athletes for their programs and many times they are competing against other coaches for the same athletes, that’s why if your D really likes this school she should definitely express her interest. Sometimes D2, D3 coaches won’t bother with an elite (top 3 in state) runner because they assume he/she is leaning toward D1 and has other D1 coaches after them.
Thanks–@twoinanddone I’m not really looking for a D1 coach to recruit him or offer him money; I know his times aren’t quite there to be recruited. I’m more asking about whether he would be able to simply try to compete. I realize the ED may be all the D3 coaches have as leverage but it’s more important to me that he go to a school that’s the best fit, so I don’t want to go that route unless it’s his first choice regardless of running. (Grades are not an issue.) Out of his top 4 schools at this point, 2 are D1 and 2 are D3. and we had hoped that at least the D3 schools would be interested.
Curious about D3 walk ons–is this uncommon? Spouse walked on to NESCAC team eons ago, as did most of his teammates. I get the impression this is rare now? S18 would like to consider running D3 XC. He has contacted a few schools and got mostly polite interest, maybe a little more? But nothing like an OV offer. Guess he just keeps plugging
ED should only be used for a first choice school, athletics and academics. It’s great when it works out that that’s the school the student wants and the coach is offering support, but if it isn’t a first choice, don’t do it.
Some teams do not have try outs, some do. My daughter’s coach would give a try out to someone who asked, but she doesn’t hold formal try outs at the beginning of the year. We need players, but the player would have to have the skills to make the team, not just get to play because we have room. At another school in our conference, the coach has 15+ recruits some years and 36 players on the roster, while our team has 4 recruits and 22 on the team this year. That coach does not hold try outs or allow walk ons. Both teams are nationally ranked in the top 10 so similar in talent, just different coaching recruiting styles, plus our school is a harder academic admit, and higher COA, so recruiting is harder.
My daughter’s coach couldn’t handle a roster of 36 because she only has one part time assistant coach. The bigger the team, the more paperwork, the more drama, the more parents to deal with. There is an additional cost for uniforms, cleats, travel, food, trainers, equipment, etc. so it’s not just a matter of letting one or two more on the team.
@eastcoast101 I assume your kid’s sport is T&F? If so, it isn’t uncommon to have D1 walk-ons on a team, the marks and/or times have to be there though