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<p>Have you talked to your son’s school (not the receptionist, but the principal or counselor)? My kids’ school had the same rule, but we soon found out that the school did allow more visits…especially if the student was a decent student. </p>
<p>Also…try this…look at your child’s school calendar, there are often days when HS is closed (or has a minimum day), and colleges are open.</p>
<p>Yes, visits can be deadly. We had some bad visits at some great schools and some great visits at schools that were not good fits. When it’s pouring down rain, or the weather is nasty with slush all around, it does affect the visit. When the guide is not very good, or the campus is empty, it hurts too. My oldest picked his school after narrowing it down to 3, from a visitor’s weekend that hit him just right. A school that was probably a better fit for him just was not as welcoming during the visit. </p>
<p>If some schools get cut that you feel are truly good fits that were axed because of a bad visit, try to pick a second visit for a time when the school can shine a bit. We did urge our kids to keep a few schools on the list that they were not that thrilled about, and some did make it to the finals because of factors such as nice merit packages that mitigated some of the negative impressions that were initially what the kids had. </p>
<p>But sometimes it just isn’t in the cards. A shame, when you know that a school dumped for superficial reasons.</p>
<p>In my opinion visits are very important - but done as post #12 describes. You can’t get a feel for the campus unless it’s populated - going when school is not in session only shows the physical aspects. The other thing I liked to do was read the bulletin boards and the white boards the kids have on they’re dorm doors. It really does help to get a feeling of the “aura” on campus - like when you look at a new neighborhood in a new town. My guess is you’d take some time to drive or walk around, attend an event and get a feel for the community.</p>
<p>One of my kids visited Hampshire - on paper it was a perfect fit, when there, all of the Doug Henning (remember him? - this was a few years ago) look-a-likes changed his mind. He couldn’t see limiting his four years to that environment. Another kid spent a weekend at another, on paper, seemingly likely fit. She has since heard her impression to stay away was absolutely right.</p>
<p>Visits are by no means fool-proof, but they can give you a feel for the atmosphere on campus - is it diverse or do all of the kids look/dress alike, are different kinds of kids hanging out with each other or are there groups of “like” kids, are they friendly on campus, if there’s a sporting event going on is there school spirit, etc, etc.</p>
<p>Good luck and have fun!</p>
<p>The college itself is only one aspect of a visit and realistically much of what they show isn’t all that important - buildings the student will never go in or use (like the major Supercomputer facility at UCSD), the library with the huge number of books in it (i.e. top 10 library, etc.) that the UG will likely seldom use, etc. </p>
<p>The other, and for some a major, aspect is the environment including the area right around the college. They’ll generally live there for 4 years or so, so things like weather, off-campus apartment availability (and how affordable/nice they are), activities like a usable beach, mountains for skiing, city life, rural life, hiking/biking/running trails, workout facilities, availability of decent and cheap public transportation, availability/cost of parking, logistics/cost of visiting home, availability of off-campus eateries/nightlife, etc. can be important to some students. Other factors like the availability of on-campus and ready off-campus jobs can be important (or necessary) as well. </p>
<p>Unless one’s already familiar with the area or they truly don’t care about any of the above I think a visit to the college/area is useful and in many cases important (especially as we read the posts from students disillusioned with their choice of a location due to any of the above reasons).</p>
<p>Nightchef: My D also nixed school B for more or less the same reasons: Very ditzy info session leader. Plus it was raining cats which in school B’s case meant a lot of mud. </p>
<p>We are doing a few more visits in a couple weeks, and I’m petrified that something similar will happen because I’d really like her to find something she really likes.</p>
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<p>That’s as good a reason as any to eliminate or include a school on the college list.</p>
<p>DD had several campuses that we thought (including her) would be perfect. In two cases, she REFUSED to get out of the car when we drove in (in one case, we insisted she go on the tour anyway…the second time, we didn’t waste hers or our time).</p>
<p>The reality is that it’s better to cross the school OFF than it is to apply and attend and THEN realize you hate it. I know the reasons seem random…but believe me…most students have at least one school that they refuse to apply to for a reason their parents just can’t figure out.</p>
<p>I think it’s also hard not to “project” on the kids. I like to think I’m pretty good at “knowing” my kids, their differences, likes, dislikes etc. That said, they all have a good sense of themselves and where they want to be, how hard they can push themselves, or not, and frankly I decided I’d rather they land somewhere and stay for four years than influence the decision too much and get it thrown back at me. So if the kids say “no” to a particular school, I’ll put up alittle bit of a fight, but only enough to sense if they are firm in their convictions. The two schools nighchef speaks of are, in my opinion, very self selecting schools. The kids that go there go there for exactlly what those places are, the kids at those places and the culture of those schools. I sometimes think that some kids have an innate radar for the “fit” concept. It’s a tiny bit aspirational and a tiny bit inspirational.</p>
<p>Bard’s info session is horrible. It’s just an admissions officer sitting there asking if anyone has any questions. We liked our tour guide, though. </p>
<p>It’s interesting how some admissions officers and presentations are just so much more impressive than others. To me, Carleton wins hands down on the basis of the admissions department than any other school so far. </p>
<p>By and large, the information sessions themselves haven’t had too much sway either way (although they will have definite impressions about what they felt the emphasis was), but there are definitely just some “vibe” things that influence them.</p>
<p>And, that’s the way it was with me lo those many years ago. I didn’t base my college decision on anything about the school’s programs, professors, etc. etc., but simply on the feeling I got immediately at the campus. And, yes, the keg party on the freshman quad was a big factor… especially compared to its rival which we visited the next day on a foggy morning when the only person we saw walking around the campus wouldn’t even look us in the eye when we asked him a question… I basically made my decisions in about five minutes time on each campus…</p>
<p>Sigh, Thumper and other parents, my kids drove me nuts about how they evaluated some schools. Two of our kids turned down state subsidized Cornell because they did not like the atmosphere there. It still make my husband’s temple veins bulge when he thinks about it. In fact, he isn’t going on visits with the kids after a disasterous roadtrip with my oldest who dissed every single school H like, and was attracted to the very features that H did not like.</p>
<p>We left the house at 5AM to spend the day at Cornell. I had not even checked into the hotel, when my son came back from the first class he was visiting and wanted to go home. He didn’t like it. He really didn’t like it. And he had good personal reasons for not wanting to go there, but, man, did it hurt me like crazy. Good thing I don’t have a weak heart.</p>
<p>My H hated Brown. His visit experience was absolutely the pits. The bathroom he visited reeked from urine, feces and vomit. The person who gave the presentation from admissions was the exact personality type giving the exact type of presentation H hates. He felt that the loose curriculum was a bad, bad match for our son. Everything struck him the wrong way. But S loved it. Loved the kids, the freedom, the atmosphere. So what can one say? H was very impressed with the info session and the way things were run at Tufts. Son thought they were “anal”.</p>
<p>I’ve made a couple stabs at commenting on this string and I can’t seem to get it right … here are a few general comments</p>
<p>1) I am a BIG fan of visits … schools are much more than median stats and profile listings.</p>
<p>2) Kids (and parents) might respond to seemingly unimportant things … when my oldest and I visited schools they included 2 schools we never got out of the car (and they terrific fits on paper) … however in hindsight my daughter was very consistent and was developing a feel for the attributes she liked best</p>
<p>3) Interesting some of things she found appealing many folks (and I would guess more parents than kids) would dislike.</p>
<p>4) As a parent I found it challenging to not let my preferences influence my helping her develop her preferences</p>
<p>5) What is a big deal about a school is a VERY individual thing. For some the size of the school does not matter … for others it’s huge. For some the location is huge … for others not … I’m one of the ones for whom it is huge … the description by the OP of the school being a couple miles from a town (?) to me is a pretty defining characteristic while the OP seemed to consider it less important than the navariance fit. To me that is question for the student and the student only</p>
<p>I am a bit unsure how parents can decide that a school is such a perfect fit for their child. “Fit”, unlike academics, is subjective.</p>
<p>With that said, I think the OP’s point is very well made. All my pre-application visits are just to get a feel for different kinds of schools, not necessarily those on my list. My thought is that the actual touchy-feely visits can happen after I’m admitted. Applications should be based on hard facts.</p>
<p>If a kid doesn’t like a school because the tour guide didn’t strike a good chord, and this happens more times than I like to even think about it, it is not a good indicator of school fit. Also some folks really get stuck on things that really are not indicative or important in evaluating a setting. A bad visit that is bad because of factors that just happened on a given day should not spoil a school for a kid. But it can. If the kid is paired up with a student that makes him feel welcome and shows him a side of the school that the kid likes and gives him a visit that is wonderful but not at all indicative of the school experience, it is misleading. Some folks are gullible that way. For high school kids who are just learning to make these evaluations, it is easy for them to make some mistakes. </p>
<p>My kids had good reason, though H and I did not feel the same way as they did, as to why they did not like some of their schools. On the other hand, there were some frivolous things that just hit them the wrong way and they were too immature to understand that at the time that did affect their judgment about some schools. </p>
<p>It’s a challenge for parents to separate out their own views and prejudices when discussing a school with their kids. </p>
<p>I agree that pre app visits should really be to get an idea about schools in general, not specifics. The final visits are those that go into “feel”, and hopefully by then, the parents and kids can understand the various external factors that can make a visit good or bad but not be indicative of which way the school falls in terms of fit. </p>
<p>The initial visits are also good in that as parents you can see how your child evaluates and you can try to show them what are hard facts and what are things that can vary from one visit to another. This is a new thing for our kids.</p>
<p>No visits for DS. They were too far apart, too far from NW, too expensive, too much time away. </p>
<p>The goal was to get accepted first, then to select amongst the candidates. Not to reject the prospective schools before any likely acceptance. Visitations are too random especially for a moody prospect or guide.</p>
<p>I think the OP’s candid post --and the many later fine posts–could teach colleges, parents and GCs some lessons:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Many GCs want kids to not focus on the college search until after junior year, so they enjoy HS as more than college prep; they have a point, but parents and kids should be advised to start their visits no later than Junior Spring Break (and Winter Break if they play Spring sports) because there is no substitute for seeing a school in session–and very few Northern schools look good in Winter even in session, with no leaves, flowers or kids hanging outside. I foolishly wrote off Columbia simply because the campu slooked so bleak in Winter.</p></li>
<li><p>High schools should make reasonable accommodations for kids to visit schools–parents and kids are making a potential 4 year/$200,000 decision–give them some slack.</p></li>
<li><p>GC’s should work harder to gather input from HS alumni about what their schools are like–many kids would not write off a college so quickly or for such superficial reasons if they knew kids from their HS thought highly of it.</p></li>
<li><p>Colleges should train and evaluate their tour guide guides carefully–all those expensive brochures and webs sites can be wasted if the tour guides are poor.</p></li>
<li><p>There is nothing more frustrating to a parent than thinking their child is making a foolish decision–either to like it or dislike it-- about a college on a trivial basis and it happens all the time.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>“Colleges should train and evaluate their tour guide guides carefully–all those expensive brochures and webs sites can be wasted if the tour guides are poor.”</p>
<p>I have thought of suggesting that my alma mater send ccasional “ringers” on tours and to info sessions in order to get a sense of what prospect families are experiencing.</p>
<p>Absolutely–many hotels, restaurant chains and retailers do just that.</p>
<p>At my company, I never called Customer Service on the VIP line I had access to, because I wanted to experience what the average customer would.</p>
<p>My Son isn’t old enough for the visiting stage yet, but I’d like to know how families decide how many schools to visit & how much time do you pull kids out of high school for the visits?</p>
<p>Seems like a lot of time out of high school</p>
<p>
noimagination, I agree. I was referring more to things like academic fit (does it have strong departments in the area(s) the student wants to major in?) and sociocultural fit in a rough, categorical sense (is it a jock/frat school or a hippie/indie school? Competitive or laid back? Liberal or conservative? and so forth). In these senses, we had a good idea what general kinds of schools would be a good fit for our son, and I think we were right. </p>
<p>But the “gestalt” side of fit–does this place feel like home, does it feel like a place where I could thrive?–is something we can only guess at. As parents our guesses will probably be better than other people’s, but still just guesses.</p>
<p>I have the impression, based on the scuttlebutt from my 2 kids’ college experiences, that the “coolest” kids do not become tour guides. Cool meaning kids with plenty of other attractive campus activities they are involved with. Tour guides at their schools are low on the social pecking order. Sort of like graduates from their high school’s marching bands. I’m sure this sounds nasty, but college students can be even more colorful in their descriptions.
I would suggest visiting when school is in session and spending the whole day. If you only have 3 or 4 hours, I would skip the info session and tour entirely. There is almost nothing in the info sessions that can’t be accessed in more detail elsewhere. And the tour is scripted and overly focused upon a student who may be idiosyncratic.
Of course full day visits in session are not always possible.</p>