Theater/Drama Colleges Part 1

xiggi · November 3, 2008, 4:38pm

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Sunday, May 02, 2004 - 09:36 pm: Edit *

Theatre/Drama Colleges

Welcome to those who are interested in Colleges and Universities that have a major or concentration in the Theatre. Most schools in this thread will offer a BFA or BA degree in Acting and Drama for the Stage.

Discussions will include other areas of the theatre for the stage as well. Its
Majors in Playwriting, Directing, Lighting; Stage Management, Production and Scenic Design. The thread will also support Performance and Theatre Studies for those looking for education/teaching degrees.

Also included, will be Colleges that have a heavy concentration in their theaters through clubs, organizations and other studies.

For those looking for information on Film and TV, there is another thread titled Deciding Which Film School To Go To

All those interested in Musical Theater and its various components; Dance, Voice, Choreography and such should key over to the thread tilted Colleges for Musical Theater. There, one will find a wealth of information that has been gathered by parents and students honed by their past and recent experiences.

Because it is the Theatre there are lots of topics and references that overlap the disciplines in Acting and Performances. For instances: although a Musical Broadway is music voice based with an orchestra and often includes dance, it is still acted out on the stage. A Comedy too. TV with a studio audience - acted out on the stage. Ballet, Opera.
Books and stories need to be adapted for the stage as well as for film and TV.

However, this thread will focus on Colleges for Drama/Acting for the stage. Information and conversations in other areas of theatre interests will have the opportunity for contributors to give reference to and direct elsewhere.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Sunday, May 02, 2004 - 10:07 pm: Edit *

A few Theatre/ Drama Acting Programs at Colleges to begin one's search:

University of Minnesota - Guthrie Theatre BFA Acting
NYU (New York University) at TISCH - BFA Acting
Northern Illinois - BFA Acting
USC (University of Southern California)
Julliard
CMU (Carneige Mellon University)
Royal Scottish Academy of Music and Drama
Glasgow, Scottland
LIPPA -Liverpool Institute of Performance Perparation Academy - Liverpool, England
Rutgers (New Jersey State University)
Boston University
Hartt School at the University of Hartford
University of Michigan - at Ann Arbor
University of Utah
SUNY State University New York at Purchase
Cal Arts (California Institute of Arts)
SMU (Southern Methodist University)
University of Oklahoma City
University of Texes at Austin
Cornish
Otterbein
University of Miami
UCLA
DePaul University
Emerson
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
Boston Conservatory
Yale

By Valerie (Valerie) on Sunday, May 02, 2004 - 10:23 pm: Edit

What's the difference between a BA and a BFA degree? Does it matter?

*By Wct (Wct) on Sunday, May 02, 2004 - 10:55 pm: Edit *

BA= Bachelor of Arts

BFA= Bachelor of Fine Arts

In simple terms, and correct me if I am wrong, the difference is that a BFA is a concentration. Meaning most of the course requirements for your major is in the major. I believe you have less gen ed classes to take. At least that is the case with my S. He is a BFA Acting Major at CMU.

I do know that several BFA programs require more gen ed courses than my S is required to take so there may not be a common thread among all the colleges in regards to this.

As to whether it matters or not, (BFA vs BA) I would say this. If you think that you may want to do something other than your major after graduation you may want to think about a more liberal arts education (BA). If acting is your passion and you know you either want to be a working actor or go on to grad school to teach acting at the university level a BFA is probably for you.

*By Wct (Wct) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 01:05 am: Edit *

Valerie-

Another school to add to your list.

RADA- Royal Academy of Dramatic Art in London, England.

Another interesting point when looking at programs. Some acting students want to be able to study overseas during their junior year. Some programs offer this, such as Boston University, but some do not.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 02:00 am: Edit *

Yes, I beleive the RADA is a graduate program much like Yale's is

*By Jimster0489 (Jimster0489) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 02:11 am: Edit *

Don't forget Northwestern!
Or the University of Illinois!

^ Two excellent schools with great programs in theatre!

*By Wct (Wct) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 03:10 am: Edit *

RADA has an undergraduate program.
Check the RADA web site at: RADA Acting and Theatre Performance - Stage Management - Technical Theatre - Directing courses
This was one of the colleges on my son's list last year. You only have to be 18 years of age to attend. They do not provide housing. The only place in the US you can audition is in NY during scheduled auditions (in March).

They grant a BA in Acting degree but I don't think it is the equivalent to our BA degree in the USA. I could be wrong.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 04:05 am: Edit *

Is it then

The London Royal Academy of Dramatic Arts

that I am thinking about?

Yes, the Conservatory Acting program at LIPPA - Liverpool Institute of Performings Arts has an Acting program that is two years only and I do not beleive they give any degrees. Maybe a certificate in Acting.

The Royal Scottish Music and Dramatic Arts in Scottland offers a 3 year study in Acting with a 4th year to complete a BA degree in Liberal Arts. I beleive they are the only performing higher education School that does so in the United Kingdom.

How were the auditions in N.Y.?

The Unified Auditions held in Chicago, N.Y and L.A. have LIPPA and Royal Scottish auditions for students. Is that the same audition in N.Y. you are talking about?

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 12:44 pm: Edit *

Every Winter several Colleges and Universities participate in the

National Unified Auditions for Undergraduate BFA programs in Theatre.

They are held in N.Y, Chicago, Seattle and L.A.

The 2005 year dates are:

New York - 1/30 thru 2/1

Chicago - 2/02 thru 2/4

Seattle - 2/07

L.A. - 2/08

Their auditions cover those schools that provide degrees in the following area:

Acting
Arts Administration
Drama
Design
Design - Scenic Lighting
Costume, Sound, Makeup
Musical Theatre
Musical Theatre Dance
Performance
Stage management
Technical Directing
Theatre management
Theatre Technology
Theatre Studies

One can receive more information on their auditions and who participates by contacting them at URTA - United Regional Theatre Association

*By Chemy (Chemy) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 01:31 pm: Edit *

yale has the world's most famous drama school.... far and away the best

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 01:50 pm: Edit *

I already posted this on another thread, but I'm looking for inside information on the University of Evansville and University of Utah BFA in Acting programs. I'm in the 11th grade and am really just getting serious about this process. Florida State and SMU are the only two for which I'm certain to audition at this time. Obviously, I need to come up with more.

Apologies if this is considered off-topic, but I've been told that a lot of schools tend to discriminate against qualified performing arts majors in favor of math and science types in awarding their biggest academic/merit/leadership scholarships. If anybody has already researched this, I'd like to know which schools with really good theatre departments don't. This is going to be a major issue for me in rounding out my top 10 list.

*By Wct (Wct) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 02:07 pm: Edit *

Valerie-

RADA is the Royal Academy of Dramatic Art. They do have a degree program. The degree is profiled at this site:
<a href="http://www.rada.org/acting5.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.rada.org/acting5.html</a>

As stated on the site: "The New York auditions usually take place during one week in March."
I don't know if they combine with other programs to audition. You would have to email them I suppose.

My son decided not to audition due to the cost issues. They provide no financial aid to international students. I was concerned about him being that far away and the housing issues also. He figured he could go on an exchange program in his junior year if that was available to him. Things will work out different now becuase he is at CMU and I don't know if he will want to study abroad during the school year.

*By Onstage (Onstage) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 03:13 pm: Edit *

a few more schools that I have heard about with good drama programs:

Muehlenberg College
Vassar
SUNY-Purchase

By Valerie (Valerie) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 03:17 pm: Edit

Thesbohemian.

You are in the right Thread and right "On Topic"

Schools who have BFA degrees generally DO NOT discriminate against awards such as those in merit for talent in favor of others.

However, most schools require a student apply to their College or Universitiy and also apply, then audition for, their BFA and some of their BA programs in their theatre/performing arts schools or programs.

Most finAid awards are based on your own financial needs that you fill out through the federal gov forms that are required by each school when you apply to their College or University for acceptance into their academic school. And not based on a performing arts speciality.

However, one can if need is shown, be awarded merit with finAid through the theatre major or department. But it is based on your application to the College or University itself.

There are awards, special scholarships given by some depts of performing arts or their schools for an exceptional talent based on one's talent when they which to have that student in their speciality program or school of the College or University they applied to.

Hope that explains. There are parents and students here that I am sure can share and relate further their personal experiences with the various schools they have applied to.

University fo Utah has a verg good BFA program. The Salt Lake City area is a very strong area for their summer theatre festivals and theatre regional disrict. I would suggest you look closely at the University as a whole and see if it is to your likely, to give you a better feeling as to whether this is a University you are interested in having in your top 10 for consideration.

This is how one goes about it in researching. Looking at the school as a whole, what resources are available both financially and of personal interest and then (in your case)the Theatre program you would be applying to. Universiy of Utah offers a Conservatory BFA Acting degree.

*By Dancersmom (Dancersmom) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 03:22 pm: Edit *

Thesbohemian

Regarding discrimination in awarding scholarships: I believe that at many schools the academic scholarships are larger than the talent scholarships. However, I believe that prospective arts majors with top grades and high college board scores are just as likely to receive those academic scholarships as the prospective math and science majors. They are also eligible for talent scholarships at the same schools. My D was awarded a Presidential scholarship at Point Park. She was judged on academics, college board scores, community service and leadership, and an interview. She had to win the school's top academic scholarship and their community service and leadership award to be considered for the Presidential scholarship. She was also awarded a talent scholarship. She actually received more money from the school than a science major could receive. My D received academic and talent scholarships at all of the schools that accepted her.

I think the problem a lot of arts students run into is that their grades and test scores are not as high as the science and math types. That makes them non-competitive when it comes to winning the academic scholarships. Many schools try to compensate by awarding talent/merit scholarships. Are the academic scholarships worth more money? Sometimes. However, my D's talent scholarship at Penn State was worth considerably more than her academic scholarship. My D received the top academic scholarship at Florida State but her awards from the School of Theatre were higher.

Some of the most lucrative academic awards go to the National Merit finalists. I believe that the math and science types are more likely to receive a National Merit Scholarship because there are quite a few N.M. scholarships sponsored by corporations that restrict the awards to students going into technological fields. If you want to talk discrimination, look at the awards offered to the athletes. But, that's a whole other conversation - I'm not going there.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 03:54 pm: Edit *

WcT
RADA in London does have a 2 yr. BA in Acting.

When my S was looking at Acting schools in the United Kingdom, I beleived he passed on this one to apply to because he orginally was looking at BFA programs or similar. I think he as your S is giving it considerable thought for study aboard over to investigate for Graduate study.

Like you and your S found, FinAid is not considered for any international student and one must pay ahead for schooling and show they can afford to also live in the United Kingdom, so that a student doen't go on the "dole" so to speak. One has to secure their own health care doctor and coverage, also. And, housing too as you say. Although, RSMDA does provide one building for their students that need housing.

Then, there is the matter of the student searching graduate programs here in U.S if they want to get college credit here for their study in U.K. That can be real iffy. We were strongly advised when S was considering LIPPA and RSMDA to make sure ahead of time that S's Graduate schools of interest here in the U.S. be ones that would accept his schooling from the U.K.'s. conservatory programs. London's school often has me turning their name around too. after dealing with three schools in UK that all go by similar acronym initials!

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 06:36 pm: Edit *

Valerie and Dancersmom,
That's interesting what you say, but there's a senior musician at my school who has a perfect SAT score, top grades in AP classes, and good extracurriculars. He auditioned at a couple of top conservatories and got in one with a small scholarship. He also applied and auditioned for a couple of state universities and was accepted, but the best they could come up with for him were partial academic scholarships and a pittance for talent. Knowing him and realizing that he doesn't have the most vibrant personality in the world, it's possible that he just didn't impress at his interviews. Meanwhile, another guy who's realized his artistic talent isn't great enough to pursue it as a career plans to major in architecture at one of the same state universities and got a full scholarship. He has excellent grades and good SATs, but they don't compare to the other. Something's wrong there. My scores, grades, etc. are up there, too; so it does concern me. Maybe the majority of places don't do that. Hopefully, I'll get in FSU. A family in my hometown offers an almost complete private memorial scholarship to students from my town that I've already been unofficially promised.

Dancersmom, I feel ya on the athletic scholarship thing. Before I came to this Ivory Tower for the Arts where there are no sports, I was an athlete myself and could have probably gotten a good cheerleading or soccer scholarship. It's kind of a joke around here, really. Sometimes things get intense and I'll break it up by yelling, "I gave up cheerleading for THIS???!!!"

*By Dramaqueen22 (Dramaqueen22) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 06:42 pm: Edit *

If you look up Dramatics magazine's website, they have a lot of information about the differences between a BA degree and a BFA degree, and talk about which degree may be right for different people. Here is a small quote desribing the two degrees....

"A BA program offers a general course of study in the subect of theatre. It is an academic program not unlike a major in biology or English. It offeres general exposure to the various elements of the subject, so that if you wish to, you can pursue a dpeer understanding of an area of theatre at the next level of your education...A BFA program offers intensive trainging in a particular area of theatre rather than a general exposure to the field. Students who are accepted into BFA programs rigorously study and develop their skills in selected areas such as design, stage management, or performance. For four years, they spend every day training in these areas, and those who graduate from the program will be prepared to pursue their art on a graduate level or in the profession. The education is focused and narrow rather than broad-based." (by Bruce Miller in an article on the website.)

I hope that helps anyone with questions about the different degrees. I would really look up the website. Their information on college preparation is very helpful!

*By Doctorjohn (Doctorjohn) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 06:46 pm: Edit *

Valerie:

Thanks for starting this thread. One small correction, however. The University/Resident Theatre Association (U/RTA) auditions are for graduate M.F.A. programs. The undergraduate auditions are known colloquially as "The Unifieds" and do cover many but not all of the programs you listed. All the schools offer B.F.A. (Bachelor of Fine Arts), pre-professional degrees.

We have not yet set the dates for 2005. We will certainly be in New York City, Chicago, and Los Angeles, very likely around the dates you listed. We are looking at Seattle; it has not yielded a large number of prospective students for us the last two years. We may return to San Francisco. We should have decisions about dates and sites within the next month.

The schools which are part of the unified national auditions, the degree programs they offer, and links to their websites, can be found at:

<a href="http://www.otterbein.edu/dept/thr/unified.htm%5B/url%5D">http://www.otterbein.edu/dept/thr/unified.htm</a>

Thanks!

doctorjohn

*By Jr86 (Jr86) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 08:17 pm: Edit *

how good is Bu's theatre program? is it better than Emerson? How are the productions at BU? I would assume there are more, but i mean quality is more important than quantity.. im just hoping I can get both at BU... I'm a little worried there isnt enough of a strong arts community there, not as much as Emerson anyway.. anyone have any input?

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 08:20 pm: Edit *

DoctorJohn,

Thanks for the clarification.

Can you relate more on the topic of "Unifieds" for Undergraduate Auditions and why they are often a neccassary part of application/acceptance into a College or University Theatre/Drama program or School.
BFA or BA.

URTA information for Graduate level MFA or Summer festival Acting employment see Audition info above and URTA's website at

University/Resident Theatre Association - Home

By Doctorjohn (Doctorjohn) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 11:16 pm: Edit ****

Valerie:

Thanks for the question. Attending the Unified Auditions is not necessary. But it is convenient because many schools congregate in one location at one time. Many families do not have the financial resources to take their students to half a dozen campus auditions all over the country, and the Unifieds can offer a real savings.

That said, I would recommend the following strategy:

DO THE RESEARCH

Read the postings on this thread and on "Colleges for Musical Theatre," look at cast and designer biographies in playbills, and talk to theatre professionals and to friends majoring in theatre. Look at ads in "Dramatics" and in "American Theatre." Look at the list of Unified schools in my earlier post. But don't limit yourself to those. Juilliard, NYU, North Carolina School of the Arts, among others, aren't listed--not because they're not good (on the contrary)--but because they hold their auditions separately. Usually in the same cities on the same days, however.

I highly recommend the "Directory of Theatre Training Programs", published by American Theatre Works in Dorset, Vermont. The 9th edition has just been issued, and it's very complete. Thankfully, it does not indulge in ratings; rather, it provides a state-by-state list of colleges with theatre programs of every conceivable kind. Much more useful than the ratings "guides", in my opinion.

From this research, make a list, a long one. Then go to the school websites, and identify a dozen you find attractive.

VISIT

Visit at least one during spring break of your junior year. Visit at least two in the summer. It's not ideal--school's not in session. But faculty can often be found, if you call Admissions at least a week in advance and let us know when you're coming and what you'd like to see. In the fall, visit one of the schools you'd most like to attend at a time when you can see a production, sit in on classes, talk to someone in a leadership position on the faculty, and spend a lot of time with theatre majors. You'll either love it or not, and that will tell you a great deal about what you want in a college theatre program.

ORGANIZE

Before you actually send in your audition requests, organize the schools into three categories:

A. Schools you really like where you think you have a decent chance to be admitted;

B. Dream schools where you think you haven't a prayer, but you want to try anyway;

C. Safety schools that have good theatre programs (just not the "name") where you think you could be happy, and have a very good chance of being admitted. (Include schools that do not hold auditions for admission.)

I'd suggest five schools in category A, two or three in category B, and five in category C. I see entirely too many students whose list consists of nothing but schools in category B. I don't care how many of them you audition for, your odds don't get any better. Even though tastes differ, they are going to offer admission to much the same top 10%. Auditioning for Carnegie Mellon, CCM, North Carolina School of the Arts, and Juilliard is like applying to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, and Swarthmore. Fine if you have the financial resources to do it, but even if you do, don't limit yourself to the theatre "Ivies". Apply across the board.

AUDITIONS

I would recommend that you schedule auditions on campus for the schools in category A, those which really appeal and where you think you have a decent chance to be admitted. If possible, try to go a day early so you can spend time on campus, perhaps see a class and a rehearsal, and visit with students. You'll be more relaxed for your audition, and in all likelihood you'll do better. And you'll be better prepared to make a decision if they offer you admission.

For schools in category B (the ones where you have only a prayer), I'd recommend the Unified auditions. Don't spend the money to go visit campus for nothing but a brief audition. Do these schools in NY or Chicago or LA. If you're really good, they'll want you no matter where they see you. If you're not the next Meryl Streep or Johnny Depp, you gave it a good shot and you're only out the cost of the application fees. I recommend auditioning for several schools at the Unifieds, including category B and category A schools. And if you can do a walk-in or two for nothing or a nominal fee, all the better.

While you're waiting for the decisions from the schools that hold auditions (most do not do rolling admissions, which means waiting until March if not April to hear), go and visit the schools in category C. Find at least one where you could be happy, so that if you're not admitted to a school in category A or B, you have a backup. It will make the waiting much, much easier, both for you and your parents.

THE LAST VISIT

If you're admitted to the school you want, and if you've been on campus and know it's a place you could be happy, you're done. (Well, except for financial aid and housing, but those will have to wait for later.) But if by chance you're admitted to a school you haven't visited, now is the time. Although we often ask for decisions before May 1 (so that we can go down the waiting list if you turn us down), we cannot demand a decision before the first of May. It's not a law, but it is a national understanding among Directors of Admission. Say you get a letter in late March or early April offering you admission to CCM, and you auditioned for them in LA. Congratulations! Now go visit! Reputation is meaningless if the "fit" between you and the school is wrong. You won't be happy, you won't do well, you won't feel like you're learning, and you may be asked to leave the program. Put money in your budget to visit one or two schools in April, as you move towards your final choice. You'll be happier if you do.

Hope this was helpful. Sorry for the length.

doctorjohn

*By Bookiemom (Bookiemom) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 11:31 pm: Edit *

What a great audition plan, doctorjohn! We are all happy to read any long posts you care to send. Excellent advice for prospective theatre majors. (from a mom whose D auditioned for Otterbein!)

*By Wct (Wct) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 01:22 am: Edit *

We had limited finances to be able to visit colleges on the East Coast where my son decided he wanted to be, (we are on the West Coast). This is what we did-

The summer prior to his senior year, we went very late summer so schools would be in session or just starting. We went to NYC because my son wanted more than anything to visit Juilliard, NYU and AADA. He was also interested in Hartt and Boston University so we included those two schools in the trip, (we rented a car). It was good we visited NYU because it turned out that once he visited he wasn't sure he wanted to go there, (but applied anyway). He loved Juilliard. He did not like AADA. We did not actually visit Hartt (the campus) but we drove through town, (too short of time and not high on my son's list. He liked Boston University. The trip was pretty costly, (we are still paying it off and it is almost two years later!)

He applied to 9 conservatory programs (BFA) and 1 BA program, (Cal State Fullerton) . We visited Cal Arts and USC. Both are within an hour to an hour and a half drive. My son did an alumni interview with a CMU grad in Los Angeles. We did not visit CMU until he was accepted and then we went to accepted students weekend.

For auditions we took 6 days, if I remember correctly, and did the auditions in San Francisco (several locations but close enough to make it easy to do) and Los Angleles (Hilton Hotel). We stayed a couple days in San Francisco (we drove there from home) and then drove back to LA and stayed at the Hilton for two days. Juilliard, Rutgers and University of Minnesota Guthrie Program were in San Fran I believe. CMU, Suny Purchase, Boston U, Hartt, were at the Hilton. NYU was nearby in another hotel. Auditions for Cal Arts and USC were on their campus.

So anyway, all the money spent on a trip where my son decided not to go to school or wasn't accepted. The only real benefit was being able to see Broadway and Off Broadway shows which I do feel was worth every penny. I remember my parents doing this for me and as a performer it was an amazing learning experience watching the professionals at work. I know it did the same for my son.

My son was accepted to:
Cal State Fullerton
Hartt
University of Minnesota Guthrie Program
CMU
Cal Arts
Waitlisted: Rutgers
Not accepted at:
NYU Tisch (could be due to grade point average)
USC
Juilliard
Boston University

He was a NFAA finalist in Acting, (Level I Winner) and a Presidential Scholar in the Arts. He attends CMU and absolutely loves it. He said even if he were accepted to Juilliard now he would not go. He has had an amazing year at CMU.

*By Mtmomtok (Mtmomtok) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 08:27 am: Edit *

We are interested in MT, I do read/post on the other thread though they are excited and thrilled with their acceptances at this point. Posting here main objective are the regional auditions and monologues information. Really good information from DrJohn and Wct. We on the east coast and can only do regionals for most. We will do some on campus for the ones we are interested in on the east coast. Do schools audition (regional) on the same day at different locations? How are the times/days set? How do you handle this? Sorry for all the questions. Just trying to get a handle on the regionals.

*By Doctorjohn (Doctorjohn) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 08:28 am: Edit *

Wct:

Can you expand on "an amazing year" at CMU? I suspect many of us would love to hear about the first-year experiences of our students. I admit to a selfish motive--this website is turning out to be the best source of information about other programs, and how better to improve your own program than by reading about what other schools are doing right?

doctorjohn
**
By Bookiemom (Bookiemom) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 11:11 am: Edit **

Mtmomtok: The regional auditions don't overlap in different cities, if that is what you are asking. It's often the same few people from each college that are flying around the country doing the regional auditions.

There are some schools that are at a different location on the same day. For example, in the LA auditions, most were at one hotel near the airport, but NYU was at a different hotel because they aren't part of the regional auditions group. You had to get over to the other hotel for the NYU audition.

You have to schedule each audition with the individual college. They have info about how to do this on their websites. You have to schedule the NYU auditions far ahead of time, so be sure to check it out in early fall if your child wants to audition there.

Every theatre or MT dept. has an office and there is usually a very knowledgable person in that office who can answer questions. You just need to get in there and ask.

By Mtmomtok (Mtmomtok) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 12:04 pm: Edit

Bookiemom: We will (hopefully) be auditioning in NYC which are held at CAP 21. I know I have to apply to each college separately. Are there other college regional auditions that are not part of the CAP 21 site auditions? That's why I asked if different schools audition at different sites on the same day(s). For NYU we will audition on site (if we decide to do NYU, tuition is a factor, though my D is set on Steinhardt).

*By Bookiemom (Bookiemom) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 12:44 pm: Edit *

Mtmomtok: Sorry, I don't know the answer to this. My D auditioned in LA, so I'm not familiar with the NYC situation.

*By Wct (Wct) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 01:14 pm: Edit *

As you can imagine scheduling 9 auditions was not an easy task but it was doable. For actors this may be a little easier because for the most part the audition is not as long as it is for MT's considering they have no dance audition. I won't rule out having to sing because my son was asked to sing acapella for several of his acting auditions even though he was not told to prepare something. It is important to know that if I was in the room auditioning people I would ask actors to sing too because it shows versatility.

Anyway, having most of the schools in one place whether in San francisco or LA was a life saver. We originally were supposed to go to Las Vegas to audition for Hartt, but due to some circumstance that I can't remember I called them and they worked with me to arrange a time in LA.

I used a large calendar for the month of February when we were planning this out. I wrote all the schools that were auditioning on multiple days. It helped me to be able to see it on paper. When it was time to arrange audition day's and times I looked at the calendar and broke it up so it would be managable, chosing which days he would audition where. I think I gave a 2-3 hour block of time in between just in case one school was running late, (this was never the case with any of his auditions, they were very prompt). I made sure that he had a rest day between San Francisco and LA, (we drove) so he would be fresh for those auditions.

I want to mention here that some colleges' auditions were very warm and welcoming and some were very cold. My son knows he needs a nurturing environment in which to learn so I think the audition atmosphere did affect how he felt about a school.

*By Wct (Wct) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 02:00 pm: Edit *

I will try to the best of my ability tell you why my son had an "amazing" first year at CMU

I do want to stress that just because this has worked out well for my son it may not be the case for every kid. College choice must be a good fit for the INDIVIDUAL applying. It is important to know yourself and what you want.

My son is a very focused person. He is a wonderful student and what I mean by that is that he LOVES class time, (in his major, not necessarily in gen ed classes). The class time is what is important to him, not how often he gets to perform on stage. Getting to perform and stretch and take risks, being able to fail in CLASS is what is important to him. He was like this at the performing high school he attended and he is still that way. I expect that if he should become a working actor after graduation he will always look for a classroom to continue growing as an actor. Curriculum is VERY important to him. He knew from the beginning what he was looking for and checked out the curriculum page of every college prior to applying. Some he felt were stronger as far as his needs as others were. That is how he put the colleges in order as to where he wanted to attend. For example, I know of some kids who want to go to a particular school because of where it is located. My son feels, as do I, that you aren't attending the college for the surrounding area, you are attending for the TRAINING. He will also tell you that you will get out of a program what YOU put in. Not to say that you don't need to feel comfortable on the campus. Feeling comfortable in your IMMEDIATE surroundings is very important. Some people like a small campus some want a large one.

My son had originally wanted to attend Juilliard. Even with that he was a little "afraid" of the program that it would be even too intense for him, (he wanted a very intense program so he must have felt in the back of his mind that he wasn't quite ready for JUilliard). CMU was clearly the next choice. He was not accepted at Juilliard but was at CMU so we went to visit and the campus felt "right". He sat in on classes and that too felt right. Even prior to auditioning, the alumni interview went very well and he says he will never forget walking into this person's home seeing a script for "ER" on the table. This CMU graduate has been a working actor since graduation in the early '80s. It also meant a GREAT deal to him that the people auditioning him would be his teachers in class. That has turned out to be true this year. CMU was very welcoming in their approach at the auditions. They really made you feel comfortable.

As to the year-
I will tell you that when he came home for holiday breaks he was beaming. I've never seen him so happy. He is like a sponge and he is soaking up everything. For the most part CMU CFA Acting majors take 54 units a semester. He has said that when you do what you love it does not feel like work. He likes that the teachers TALK to each other and plan teaching around what each other is doing in class so that there is a definate connection between what he is learning in each of his classes. He says the teaching staff really cares about you, not just surface stuff, really caring about you as a person and your needs,(thus a very nurturing environment is provided). He feels comfortable taking risks and failing, (thus he will grow). Students are given the opportunity to create outside of class, (thus allowing those that want to go above and beyond the ability to stretch themselves). For example my son and six other actors from his class decided they wanted to do a benefit to raise money for senior leagues. They did all the work themselves and it was a tremendous success. The staff watched the process evolve. They were there making suggestions, giving support, but allowing the students to do what they had invisioned. I don't know about you, but I like that.

There are many things that made this year "amazing" for my son. But the most important thing is that he has grown as an actor and a person. A friend of his who will be graduating HS this year saw him "work" a few weeks ago. This person said it was amazing to watch him now as compared to a year ago. She saw tremendous growth. And as far as I am concerned that is what it is all about.

As a closing thought. I remember in late August of last year my son saying that he still wanted to audition again for Juilliard. Within a short while he changed his mind. He said he felt he was getting as intense an education at CMU and he doubted that Juilliard students were walking around with a smile on their face all the time.
**
By Emilyp114 (Emilyp114) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 02:21 pm: Edit **

Just to echo some others' comments about auditioning on site for the schools you are most enamored with. I don't know if anyone has studied this in any depth but the anecdotal evidence is that the likelihood of acceptance is better if you audition on site rather than at regional auditions. I realize this isn't possible for everyone. In my experience, both, with my friends I went to an arts h/s with, and also with most of the people I know here at Tisch, everyone who auditioned at their top choices on site was accepted, but many of those who did it the regional route were not. I was scheduled to take part in the regionals in NYC the year I applied, for CMU and BU but fortunately, did not have to because I was accepted early to Tisch.

After auditioning at Tisch, I really don't know how people do several in one day. It was a long process at Tisch and we were all there for several hours, most of an afternoon. As Dr. John said, it's good to arrive the day before so that you're not rushed. Perhaps they just don't spend as much time with individuals (or parents) at the regionals? One other thing to keep in mind is that if you choose to apply early to your top choice, you will have to audition on site. For Tisch, this means scheduling your audition when the audition 'hotline' opens on October 1 for some time in November.

One last comment. As WCT said, it's really important to visit the schools you're interested in. The expense is worth it, especially when you consider the amount you'll be paying for the next four years. The schools and programs vary so much, and sometimes you realize that a particular school that you have always loved, isn't quite what you expected when you see it in person. Ask lots of questions. Be sure to look at the curriculum, for all four years. What is the breadth and depth of courses available? Are theatre studies courses required as well as practical studio classes? Who is on the faculty? Are there guest speakers? Master classes? What kinds of productions are done, and also what number? Does the school put everything into one big mainstage production for the year, and then nothing else? (As an aside, in the month of April, there were 28 different studio productions running at Tisch. Everything from Othello to The Rimers of Eldritch to Working to Zoo Story) Do students have the opportunity to produce plays? Are they funded? How about student written works? The best advice I can give prospective students is to inform yourself with as much knowledge as possible so that you end up at a school where you will be happy and where you will receive the best education and training for YOU.

*By Mtmomtok (Mtmomtok) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 03:10 pm: Edit *

Though I've read on posts that it is definitely better to audition on site, that is just something that for us is not possible, with the exception of some schools that are closer to us. I have been discouraged yet at the same time have been encouraged by other posts as well. All we can do is try our best and hope for the best. Whatever happens we will deal with the outcome. One never knows! My D will prepare as best as she can and we'll take it from there. In the meantime we are getting great information from this site.
**

By Wct (Wct) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 03:19 pm: Edit **

Mtmomtok-
Don't worry. Unless a school has rolling admissions I don't think it will matter for a talented student. I would agree that if a school has rolling admissions it would be good to audition on site early in the admission process. In regards to NYU Tisch. One of our students got the last audition on the last day,(on site)in April and was still accepted to CAP 21. Most of the kids I know did Los Angeles regional auditions and they were all admitted to schools, five of them to Tisch, one to CCM, and so on.

I do feel though, that is is probably better to do a Juilliard audition on site because you are seen by more of the faculty.

*By Mtmomtok (Mtmomtok) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 03:48 pm: Edit *

Wct: Thank you for your encouraging post. We are in the process of getting information from the schools my D is interested in. Some that she's interested in do not have regional audition and I feel that (since $$$ is the main factor) we can't spend that kind of money on plane fare, hotel, meals, etc. for just one audition. Rather we will invest it in singing, acting, and dancing lessons as well a college applications. There are a lot of expenses involved in this field. When you think of music sheets, cds, books, and unfortunately we like to own them so we don't get them from the library. We will do everything we can to try and succeed. We are even looking at local colleges for drama or opera studies (none have MT). We are considering all our options.

By Valerie (Valerie) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 07:38 pm: Edit

Why are auditions important?

Is it selectvity or is it a requirement of entrance into schools or their programs?

Why?

What if I can't afford to travel to the school or "Unifieds" to audition?

What if I don't think it is important or somehow think it's beyond needed.

What about those schools or programs that don't require an audition. Are they somehow less than or better than schools or programs majoring in Theatre/Drama, Acting?

By Mymom (Mymom) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 08:24 pm: Edit

North Carolina School of the Arts has not been listed I have understood that it has a very fine program. My son almost choose them but decided MT was his choice instead of acting. I would be interested in others opinions about thier program.

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 09:29 pm: Edit *

Valerie,
For an actor, auditions are just part of life. Gotta do 'em to get in the top schools ... Gonna have to do 'em later for work. I just wish there was a better way for students to turn it around and audition prospective schools. Since I first fell in love with acting, I'd always assumed it was going to be Florida State or the College of Charleston for me. Now my mentors are telling me I'm selling myself short by limiting myself and I'm getting very frustrated trying to sort through all these programs to find the ones that might be a good holistic fit. Even after that, I'll probably only get to meet members of the faculties of the ones that accept me once or twice before having to commit four years of my life. Mentors are all about chemistry and it's starting to feel like arranged marriages to me! How much can you learn from a weekend visit with master actors putting on their best face? Maybe that's an argument for the ones that don't require auditions. Just let 'em in and see who works out ... Then again, the "name" schools that don't have extremely high academic standards would be completely overrun. Imagine doing scene study in a class with 1000 people. LOL From the schools' perspectives, I guess it's the only way they have of telling if you have a spark they think they can work with. I too wish there were a better process. It's a pain in the butt, but I can't think of a better way. Maybe one day some motivated scientist will find a way to measure certain types of talent through the genetic code. After that, she'll need to find formulas for predicting the drive to develop it and compatability with certain mentors at certain schools ... Astrology charts maybe? Geez. Studying for these AP exams has me goin' froggy ... Sorry for the ramble.

*By Alejandro (Alejandro) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 09:31 pm: Edit *

what about Sarah Lawrence College in ny?

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 11:13 pm: Edit *

Jr86 has asked a very good question about the quality of "the Arts community" at Boston University vs Emerson

I am at a lose to give knowledge for comparison between the two.

I too would be interested in insight from others

*By Wct (Wct) on Wednesday, May 05, 2004 - 12:50 pm: Edit *

Is there anyone out there that knows anything beyond what is on the website regarding UCSB's acting program? I never hear anyone mention it. It would be great to know about UCSD for undergrad. I think UCSD is better for graduate work though.

I do want to put in a plug for Chapman. I know they give very good fin aid. I know a student who is finishing up her sophomore year and has recently auditioned to go into the BFA track there, (which you are allowed to do after your sophomore year). She is very happy with their program and is always willing to answer questions you may have.

xiggi · November 3, 2008, 6:36pm

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Wednesday, May 05, 2004 - 02:38 pm: Edit *

My S was very interested in several schools and their programs. With information and advice from his H.S. performing arts advisor and theatre director he, last summer researched many, made his selections and started the process. I am not sure when he started making appointments with each individual school to set up audition times, but he started writing his essays and making contact with each school's theatre department.

Since my S knew he was going to be attending the "Unifieds" in Chicago in February with his fellow senior H.S. theatre class; the anxiety and complicated matter of setting up on-site audition dates with individual schools was eliminated. He also knew that at the "Unifieds" there were going to be aprox 33 different schools and programs represented. It made it incredibly easier for him to set up audition dates for those individual schools he chose. He ended up doing 18 auditions over a 4 1/2 day time period while he attended the "Unifieds" in Chicago. Two of his auditions were "walk Ons". He and his classmates along with his theatre director and a few of his theatre teachers stayed at the Palmer House where the "Unifieds" took place. While there, as a group, the students had a chance to do some sight seeing, eat in different ethnic restaurants and mingle with other students that were there auditioning as a group from their schools and individual's who attended with their parents.

This is how it played out for my S:

These are the schools he applied to, auditioned for or he seriously considered:

Boston Conservatory

Cal Arts

Carnegie Mellon

Cornish

DePaul University

Emerson

Hartt School of University of Hartford

Liverpool Institute of Performing Arts, England

Julliard

Northern Illinois

NYU (New York University) Tisch Performing Arts School

Otterbein

Royal Scottish Academy of Music and Dramatic Arts, Glasgow, Scotland

Rutgers University

SMU (Southern Methodist University)

SUNY at Purchase

UCLA

USC

University of Miami

University of Michigan at Ann Arbor

University of Minnesota Guthrie Theatre BFA Acting

University of Oklahoma City

University of Utah

Comments: S although a MT H.S. major with lots of MT performances, also did a lot of theatre/Acting and felt for College that he would pursue the BFA in Acting vs. a BFA in MT or a BA in either concentration. However, he decided to apply to and audition for Emerson's and UCLA's BA programs because he liked the way their programs were structured and what the schools offered in other areas. btw Emerson also has a BFA program. S chose the University of Michigan at Ann Arbor as the only school he audtioned for in MT. He felt he owed it to himself to at least audition for one school in MT since he was a H.S. MT major. S felt his interview and audition with Mich. could of been stronger. It was the one school he was very dissappointed when he was not accepted. Mich also offers other degrees in Theatre.

He eliminated Julliard, Boston Conservatory, Cornish, SUNY at Purchase and DePaul University.

S turned down the University of Miami after he was notified that he was being seriously considered.

He is still waiting to hear from LIPA and Royal Scottish Academy. They do not make their final decisions until the middle of June although he is on both of their final lists

On College visits he decided against applying to Northwestern, University of Chicago and University of Texas at Austin; University of Nebraska at Lincoln and Arizona he considered but decided not to apply. These were a group of schools he was looking at for various reasons other than Theatre or in addition to their Theatre degree or concentration.

He did not apply to Yale'd BA undergraduate theatre. In hindsight he should have. He also did not apply to Boston University or North Carolina School of the Performing Arts at Chapel Hill although an excellent, excellent program.

The rest: he was either accepted, waitlisted or denied. Some Colleges accepted S into their school of general academics but not their school of Theatre and vice versa. One needs to apply and be accepted to both. Some felt his talent was not up to their expectation along with his SATs (1320) being too low compared to other applicants. Others felt he was just great and wanted him in their College/University and Theatre/Drama program. Some felt he was too talented and would eventually transfer out of their program. Still others felt he did not fit their ensemble.

His top seven schools of desire were University of Minnesota Guthrie Theatre BFA Acting; NYUs BFA Theatre/Drama Tisch school of Performing Arts; Northern Illinois BFA Acting; UCLAs TFT BA Drama; Carnegie Mellon BFA Acting; University of Michigan; Royal Scottish Academy of Music and Dramatic Arts for their Acting and LA degree.

He struggled with his final decision between the BA Drama at the TFT (Theater, Film, Television) professional school at UCLA and the BFA Theatre/Drama at NYUs Tisch School of the Performing Arts with Lee Strasburg Studio

He accepted UCLA

Thoughts: All of these schools listed have vg if not excellent programs. Some Colleges/Universities are stronger in their academics compared to others. Most have a Musical Theatre program or concentration too. Some dont. University of Minnesota Guthrie BFA Acting is the newest program of the group, being 4 years old. Their approach and intent is excellent with an exceptionally talented group of students who will be the first graduates of the program next month.

End the end the "Unifieds" offered my S a great opportunity that was under one roof and gave him a comprehensive experience and equal shot of being accepted to many schools

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Wednesday, May 05, 2004 - 03:15 pm: Edit *

In Regard to

"The Unifieds" or as some call it "Unifieds", it is worthy to note that each year the schools that participate various. Some schools are not members at all. For those schools or programs one must schedule auditions with them individualy on-site or inquire to where they are having group auditions for their schools. Some schools do all three.

One must inquire at each school they are making application. Often the information about their auditions (when and where) can be found on the individual school's website. "The Unifieds" post their list of membered schools attending each year once they have been informed and make a decision on dates.

For instances in my S's case he had audition appointments set up at individual schools that were represented at "The Unifieds" and did not make audition appointments on-site or audition appointments at other areas where other schools of his choice would be represented. For him, because of his particular schooling and time aloted he auditioned only at the "Unifieds" and felt very satisfied with his selection. It also helped, for him, to narrow his list of schools.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Wednesday, May 05, 2004 - 06:14 pm: Edit *

There is a excellent thread of about 10 posts that was started 4/30 titled

BFA in Acting University of Evansville and University of Utah

By Wct (Wct) on Thursday, May 06, 2004 - 01:35 am: Edit

Valerie-

I think your son made a wise choice. Especially if he is interested in film acting.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Thursday, May 06, 2004 - 02:43 am: Edit *

Thanks Wct!

Yes he is very interested in film acting! However, his love is the stage and the opportunity at UCLA will also give him classes and interest in other areas of Directing, Production, Creative writing for Playwriting interests; Theatre Studies, History,languages and Comparative Religion and cultures. And, all his Science Fiction and Mythology interests. All really great subjects for theatre! And then design and tech! H and I are very excited for him and S is at 150 paces and going, planning, creating and anticipating all the good things that will come from his studies and classmates. He can't get enough info and ideas from others!!

I think UCLA is going to be a good fit for him.

This college like so many others are really great for theater! I hope lots of schools will be profiled here along with the experiences and perspectives of students and parents and others "in the know"!!!

*By Mtmommy (Mtmommy) on Thursday, May 06, 2004 - 12:51 pm: Edit *

Wct--

I didn't even know UCSD had a theatre department. I always think of that school as being a science campus. For example, my field is English and even though they have a literature/creative writing department at UCSD, I've never heard of anyone going there or recommending it to others. I do know someone who has an MFA from the Musical theatre program at SDSU. She is adamant that undergrad students really get shortchanged if they go to a school wiht a strong grad program so I assume that opinion is the result of her experience at SDSU.

About Chapman: I am not coming from any position of being "in the know" here, but again from the position of "English," Chapman is considered to be a 'diploma mill," so it's interesting to hear positive comments about the school's drama program. Part of Chapman's academics is, in fact, a diploma mill, so this might be an unfair blot on the reputation of the regular programs. But becuase of the view of chapman from English departments in the southland, I could never recommend sending one of my students to Chapman. Please tell us more about Chapman's drama--quality and reputation--if it helps to offset this view. Thanks!

*By Wct (Wct) on Thursday, May 06, 2004 - 01:47 pm: Edit *

Mtmommy,

Can't say I know anything about the reputation of the English department.

I know they have a fine film school and that students who are majoring in film are very happy with the program. I think at one time Chapman's drama program was not thought of very highly. I think that is starting to change, (that kind of thing takes time). The students I know there have come from a performing arts HS back ground and so they had a lot of prior training before entering college. It must be challenging to them or they would say something I believe. I did not ask them about the academics, only the classes within their major.

In case anyone is interested, below is the web address for UCSD's Theater and Dance department, (graduate and undergrad):

UCSD</a> Theatre & Dance: Home Page

By My2cents (My2cents) on Thursday, May 06, 2004 - 01:54 pm: Edit

I'm surprised that there isn't more mention of Fordham College at Lincoln Center on these posts. They do very little musical theatre (in fact they state right up front that if that is your main interest, do not attend)but their performance track for acting is highly competitive. This year they auditioned 440 people for 20 spots. They also have playwriting, directing and technical theatre programs.

Fordham has a core curriculum which all students are required to complete, so the theatre major is a B.A.--there is also no graduate program in theatre, so undergrads get all the stage time. Last but not least, it's located at 60th and Columbus Circle--right next to Lincoln Center!

My D will be starting there in the fall--she looked at a lot of programs, but theirs fit exactly what she was looking for--I'd be intersted to know if anyone else on this thread considered it.

*By Matth (Matth) on Thursday, May 06, 2004 - 03:29 pm: Edit *

I went to see a production of The Wild Party at Fordham this year. About half the theatre left at intermission. Hopefully, most of their productions are better than that one. A friend of mine who worked tech on it said that the entire process was a disaster from start to finish. I'm not sure whose fault it was but it was really bad.

*By Norcalmom (Norcalmom) on Thursday, May 06, 2004 - 04:22 pm: Edit *

I have to make a comment about Chapman being a "diploma mill." I think what you are referring to is the Chapman program for adults who want to return to college and get a diploma with some credits being given for "life experience." I have no vested interest in Chapman, but I think we need to be fair. Other colleges have similar programs, including my alma mater, U. of Redlands.

I, too, am in California--grew up in So Cal and have lived the past 20 years in No Cal. There are other universities that have similar programs. These programs can be run out of an office in an area quite some distance from the actual university because they do not require class attendance. I don't know that I am in total agreement with such programs, but I don't have enough info about them to condemn them outright. I know that they award credits based on life experience, then additional credits for independent study and internship-type experience. They are usually very expensive and diplomas can be obtained in a year to two years. Though it doesn't seem quite fair to those of us who spent the requisite time earning our degrees, I do think there is some wiggle room for awarding credits in particular areas that an individual might have learned from several years on-the-job. They also usually offer limited programs, e.g., teaching credential program, so you don't need to worry that your doctor or lawyer came through one of these legitimate college programs.

That said, I have heard these programs referred to before as diploma mills though they are sponsored through reputable universities. To my thinking, a true diploma mill collects an exorbitant fee and sends a piece of paper. I do know of a woman who went through one of these programs after her kids were all through school. It took her one year to get her teaching credential, which included student teaching, but it just didn't set well with me. She had no previous job experience that would give her legit credits towards teaching, though she did hold a B.A. degree, had lived and studied in India for several years, and had extensive experience working with children from many years of Girl Scout Leader training and work. Still didn't set right with me...

I could compare the adult programs to many of the independent charter schools in California. I have worked with several of such schools as a teacher. I have also left most in disgust. You would be amazed how little some independent study high schoolers are required to do and still get the same credits and a diploma as those who attend regular public/private high school. I've seen some of these schools award high rank and valedictorian status to students who had done very little during their high school years. I can't support such programs. I don't know if the adult college programs are as relaxed about giving out credits--I certainly hope not--but they are comprised of lots of independent study.

What I actually think of when I hear "Chapman" is that they were the college that had the Floating Campus program that I was so interested in when I was looking at colleges. I guess they don't do that anymore. I also know that most folks in my area of NoCal have never heard of Chapman (or Redlands for that matter). A young lady from church attended there for one year, but did not continue there because she was homesick and wanted to attend closer to home.

*By Enzom (Enzom) on Thursday, May 06, 2004 - 04:23 pm: Edit *

Perhaps I missed its mention, but I am surprised that no one has considered Kenyon, alma mater of Paul Newman, Allison Janney(who stars in The West Wing and was cast in her first play at Kenyon by Newman)and Josh Radnor(starring in the Graduate on Broadway). Just another school to consider.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Friday, May 07, 2004 - 11:20 pm: Edit *

Can you share any info or insight about Kenyon and their Theatre opportunities or thier classes and Ec's?

*By Chemy (Chemy) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 12:40 am: Edit *

this is a funny websight and list of alumni.... i was trying to find out where ed norton whent 2scholl and came acros it...

AmIAnnoying.com</a> - I Attended Yale

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 10:13 am: Edit *

Okay. I got yelled at yesterday because I still haven't come up with ten schools that meet my criteria even though I'm in the middle of AP exams and haven't had a lot of time to put into it. What I'm looking for is as follows:
1. Very good to great theatre department (Duh!);
2. Part of a liberal arts college or university(No one-dimensional conservatory schools. This really annoys one of my teachers.);
3. Under $30,000 per year for out-of-state tuition and housing. (I've had to raise up to this.);
4. Potential to cover at least half of total cost through academic and talent scholarships. (Graduating with a BFA in Theatre with lots of debt is not a comfortable idea.);
5. Ability to cover most general education requirements through AP (This also really annoys one of my teachers.);
6. Happy and friendly student body;
7. Attractive campus located in the suburbs or a reasonably safe part of a city;
8. No forced tripling of freshmen in dorms; and
9. Decent film/media arts department with ability to participate in student film. (More of a tiebreaker than a requirement.)

Right now, my "definites" are FSU, DePaul, and SMU and I'm waiting for some answers to questions from Otterbein and Evansville. I'm still on the fence about Utah and intend to ask them some questions and read some archived newspaper articles. My fallback remains the College of Charleston where I'm practically shoe-in for a free ride if I don't mess up next year. Any suggestions? Am I being too picky?

*By Jrmom (Jrmom) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 10:27 am: Edit *

Doctorjohn,

Thanks as always for your contributions to the discussion.

You advised making the following list:
"A. Schools you really like where you think you have a decent chance to be admitted;

B. Dream schools where you think you haven't a prayer, but you want to try anyway;

C. Safety schools that have good theatre programs"

It's easy to assess one's chances academically - we've done that, and only have one "reach" school academically-all the rest are matches or safeties - but how do we determine if a school is in category A or B for talent? That's what stumps me. D has attended good programs (master classes, and summer) and gotten positive feedback/ratings, but sometimes one has the feeling they are trying to be nurturing, not critical.

I'd appreciate advice from ANYONE on this one!

jrmom

*By My2cents (My2cents) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 10:55 am: Edit *

Matth,

I looked all over the Fordham Theater website and there was no mention of a production of "The Wild Party" this year. Maybe you went to a student run production at the Rose Hill campus?? There is no theater major there, only at Lincoln Center.

Anybody else with any info about the Fordham program?

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 01:29 pm: Edit *

Thesbohemian

I feel for you. Finding colleges and programs is a lengthly process of defining and you are at the beginning. Don't feel too bad. From your description above I would look at LAC's (Liberal Arts Colleges) there are some excellent ones that can offer a lot of the criteria you are looking for. Carolyn who is a contributing advisor on these threads suggests looking at Whitman College.(check spelling) Also, Jamimom has a wealth of info about colleges. In the meantime, the list of schools mentioned above for BFA - a lot of them offer BA programs. Try looking at them again. I know it is a lot of work, but the list does provide a variety of experiences and atmosphere per college. It's a start for research. Also will help you narrow down schools with your wants and needs as you look at each college/university. Others will provide help here to specific schools when they read your request. Keep looking for those posts. It's an awkward time of the year for many and a busy one with distractions and other commitments. Give it a couple of more weeks too. More info should start coming in. You do have a little time. Can you share why you are feeling pressured right now? It might help - to help you more specifically.

*By Norcalmom (Norcalmom) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 03:57 pm: Edit *

A word about Whitman. My family visited the campus when my older daughter was college hunting. It is a small, beautiful campus in Walla Walla, Washington. The campus is well-groomed--reminded us of Disneyland. Walla Walla is out in the middle of nowhere--long, long, difficult drive to an airport or any city of size. The majority of people at the campus and in town were friendly (though they had no record of my daughter's interview appointment, refused to honor the confirmation letter, and refused to fit her into the day's schedule despite the fact that we were from NorCal--kind of a rude encounter there). There is a 7th Day Adventist College in town also.

Academically, Whitman is topnotch. We weren't impressed with their studio art or theatre programs though. The theatre facilities were not impressive, and we were told that they have a small, classical program. I don't believe film is offered there, so for an acting student looking for on-camera opportunities, this wouldn't be the place. Had either of my daughters been looking for a school strong in English, History, Political Science or Philosophy, Whitman would have been at the top of the list.

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 03:58 pm: Edit *

Valerie,
Thanks. I'll give those places a look. The reason I'm pressured is because I've really been kind of slack in the process of looking at schools and one of my teachers gave me the assignment to find ten as a kick in the butt. Like I said previously on this thread, I'd been assuming it would be FSU for me or the College of Charleston if I didn't get in there. I'd honestly be perfectly happy at either. I could go to both for next to nothing and really hadn't given other places much thought. I'd never even heard of most of the ones that don't have good football teams! The school I go to usually puts a few people in prestigious programs each year and I've been blessed to improve exponentially with the training I've received. I'm now considered one of the "star pupils" in my studio even though I never gave a second thought to acting until I was halfway through 9th grade. That certainly wasn't the case when I first got here last fall! Most of the people in my studio have been involved in theatre since they were little and came in with a lot of ideas about where they wanted to go. They don't pull punches much around here and a lot have been told they should consider reducing their expectations. On the other hand, I've been told I'm selling myself short. Sometimes I wonder how much this has to do with what's best for me or my school's reputation. I dunno ... I've really got all summer to figure it out for real. I hope I don't sound like I'm not serious about it because I definitely am. My place in the world is just turning out to be a little different than what I expected and I should be thankful for it. I just know I don't want to spend four years of my life at a pure conservatory with nobody but high-strung artists around and I don't care if it makes my teachers mad. No expensive ugly places with mean people, either! Gawd, I must seem arrogant. LOL Oh, well ... It's back to the AP Chemistry that I don't ever want to see again after Tuesday's exam ...

*By Actingstudent (Actingstudent) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 04:56 pm: Edit *

If you're really interesting in RADA, they do offer two summer courses: the eight-week Acting Shakespeare course (a graduate-level certificate course, which requires an audition), and the four-week RADA Summer School (which is more general and does not require an audition). From what I've read, both courses are top-notch.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 07:56 pm: Edit *

Thesbohemian

Ok, now I better understand. Yes, you need a few more schools in your application portfolio as advised. As stated in other posts here by Dr. John and others, a few safeties, a few in the ball park so to speak and then, a few reach schools. However, you do not need as many as my S applied to. He had a very large list because he was originally seeking a BFA program which is very selective in its acceptances. So, 8 to 10 schools is a good number and would cover all your bases for application and acceptance opportunities.

It sounds like you are very talented and academically advanced. So, I am picking up on the concern to satisfy your needs and interests along with the concerns about your educational future that your teacher is expressing. And yes, schools are always vying to keep their reputations and teaching experience in the classroom as best as they can. However, most teachers and advisors also take into consideration the genuine welfare of their students. Communication is vital.

So, give yourself and your teacher a fair chance by expressing your needs and wants and objective listening. Also, I'm sure there is more than one teacher in your school you can bounce things off of if you feel uncomfortable with any one teacher or advisor. Know that you will be alright in the long run. It's just the process that has instigated a level of anxiety. The feeling is not that unusual.

Your concern to keep tuition and room and board under $30,000 is an important one. Most private schools are hovering around the $30,000 fee AND counting. Therefore, your search would be better focused around In-State Universities and smaller LACs. All Universities outside of State equal in expectation for private tuition. However, once again in your search, dont automatically discount a school because of fees. Some out of state Universities have a reciprocal agreement with your In State Universities. And, there are LACs whose fees are under $30,0000. Also, some schools whether they are private or public, big or small, special in a program or not, are more generous with their ability to offer FinAid and scholarships.

In the meantime, my suggestion would be to focus on your studies these next few days and once you are finished with your tests/finals you can pick up the search and still satisfy you teacher/advisors concern that you are taking your college search seriously and not limiting yourself; which is where I believe the concern is coming from.

Too, others that have personal knowledge and information will have the chance to read your posts here today and in the short future and will be able to offer you some insight on particular schools. This will be helpful to you too in the long run as this is why you first contacted CC and this thread. Not to worry!

Stay posted and Good luck on your AP studies and Chemistry final, Tuesday.

Valerie

fyi: DePaul University is a city campus school

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Sunday, May 09, 2004 - 07:45 am: Edit *

YOU MOMS ROCK!!! HAPPY MOTHERS DAY!!! I can't believe how supportive some of you are to your kids who're taking this hard road. I love her to death, but mine still wants me to be a lawyer.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Wednesday, May 12, 2004 - 12:23 am: Edit *

What are your EC activities and Summer experiences that you believe help you toward entering a Theatre program in College?

*By Wct (Wct) on Wednesday, May 12, 2004 - 12:36 am: Edit *

We have a program at our arts HS called Camp OCHSA. It is a free program for students 4-6 graders (many of the kids in our area are underpriveledged and qualify for free and reduced priced lunch at school). The classes are offered once a week on Tuesday nights for 10 weeks I believe. Our HS students can sign up to team teach a subject, (art, voice, drama, dance) they also have staff supervision. My son chose to teach acting and I think this really was a great EC on his resume. He was also in Leadership and a group called Inter Departemental Delegation which was a group of students from all conservatories at our HS involved in community service.

Of course graduating from a performing arts HS meant he had a ton of conservatory classes to list and performances.

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Wednesday, May 12, 2004 - 01:45 pm: Edit *

Train, train, train ... This year, Im going to stay home, train privately with a voice and speech coach near my hometown, and take a scene study workshop. Im also going to work out with a Pilates/gyrotonics trainer. I think Ill be getting more bang for my buck doing that than I would at a summer drama camp. Ive had fun at the ones Ive attended the past couple of years, but they were too short to learn a lot and most people were really just trying to hook up. Beyond that, Im going to work on a skill most good actresses with a BFA are going to eventually need ... lunch waitressing! I need to get a drivers license, too, or mom's going to get really sick of driving me around.

*By Budcinco (Budcinco) on Wednesday, May 12, 2004 - 10:29 pm: Edit *

Hi, I'm a Freshman at the Guthrie program at the U of Minnesota and would like to give my opinion on the program. First of all I was highly recruited by most of the schools conversated. I was accepted into CMU, Boston, Depaul, SMU... When I stepped foot on the campus of U of M I knew I was home. I later saw the Juniors perform which did nothing but confirm this decision.(I saw Seniors from Julliard perform and there was no comparison to the noticeable ability that the Guthrie Students had over them) Not only is it taught by some of the world's finest, Yes world's finest, it also has the best guest artists including Andrew Wade (Royal Shakespeare Company's Voice Coach, Considered the best voice and speech coach and teacher in the world). Not to mention that I had narrowed down my decision to CMU and Boston U. I visited both before the U of M and can honestly say that I made the best decision, Hands down. Another good thing is that when they have their company they do not have a cut process which other schools do (Boston, Depaul, and North Carolina School of the Arts)Not to step on any toes but before making the decision that Julliard is the supreme being take a look at how many actors have had continuous work since Michael Kahn became artistic director and then take a look at the work that the to be graduate seniors from the Guthrie program have already received and have received for their near future. Trust me I really did my Home work before making my decision.

*By Wct (Wct) on Thursday, May 13, 2004 - 01:48 am: Edit *

Budcinco-

You stated:
"take a look at the work that the to be graduate seniors from the Guthrie program have already received and have received for their near future."

Is there some place where I can read what the graduates have been offered at this point and for their near future? I would be very interested in that information.

*By EmilyUk (EmilyUk) on Thursday, May 13, 2004 - 08:50 am: Edit *

For your ECs you could try taking some drama exams. In England for example, we have LAMDA, Trinity and RADA exams.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Friday, May 14, 2004 - 01:18 pm: Edit *

It's SUMMER

What are you planning on doing this Summer that you feel will help you achieve your theatre dreams in College?

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Friday, May 14, 2004 - 06:09 pm: Edit *

Norcalmom

still checking out colleges for you. Pepperdine being of great interest. Will report soon

Valerie

*By Onstage (Onstage) on Saturday, May 15, 2004 - 11:45 am: Edit *

Valerie -- Regarding summer plans -- my daughter is continuing an aggressive audition schedule -- going to any and all auditions, not only for the opportunity to be involved in a show, but also for the audition experience. Has already been cast in a production of "How to Succeed...". In the past she has attended a summer theater camp -- French Woods in Hancock, NY. It was a wonderful camp, and we have only good things to say about it. However, I feel that she gets just as much out of participating in community theaters or summer stock -- and it's FREE! She's also continuing her voice and dance lessons during the summer, and possibly some acting coaching as well.

*By Emilyp114 (Emilyp114) on Saturday, May 15, 2004 - 12:29 pm: Edit *

I'd like to put a word in here about summer for "drama" kids. My high school summers were spent, for the most part, in activities other than my love of drama. I did go to an arts camp for a couple of weeks but other than that, I spent my time doing other things. I've played soccer since I was 5 and continue to play on a rep/travelling team. I also worked each summer to save money for college, swam, read, worked on my writing, hung out with friends, etc. The school year, for me, in h/s was so full of productions, rehearsals, lessons, etc. that it was nice in the summer to take a break from it.

When I narrowed down my college list, and visited the schools prior to my senior year, in every interview I had, I was asked what I liked to do other than theatre, and when I talked about my other activities and my love of sports and books and writing, I got almost the same comment everytime. "How great that you have other interests, too!" When I auditioned E.D. for Tisch, during the interview part of the audition, Laura Levine told me that they specifically looked for 'well-rounded, multi-interested and multi-talented individuals'.

I've seen too many kids who narrow their focus to only theatre related activities and there's a possibility that it can work to their detriment. So, if you kids want to do something different during your summer break, go for it. Not because it will look good on your resume, but because you love it. Most good actors that I know are well-rounded individuals who enjoy other things in life in addition to acting.

*By Wct (Wct) on Saturday, May 15, 2004 - 12:36 pm: Edit *

EmilyP114-
Very good point and very well said. My son felt very much the same way after working so hard during the school year. For the most part he really wanted a break to do "other" things.

*By Doctorjohn (Doctorjohn) on Sunday, May 16, 2004 - 06:31 pm: Edit *

jrmom:

I've been thinking about your question for over a week. It's not an easy one. To remind everyone, she wrote, "It's easy to assess one's chances academically--we've done that, and only have one 'reach' school academically-all the rest are matches or safeties--but how do we determine if a school is in category A or B for talent? That's what stumps me. D has attended good programs (master classes, and summer) and gotten positive feedback/ratings, but sometimes one has the feeling they are trying to be nurturing, not critical."

I think your question has two parts. The first part, having to do with which colleges are difficult to get into (no matter what the talent level) is relatively simple. Using dancermom's list on the musical theatre thread, I reworked it by state, indicating with a + sign the schools which accept relatively few applicants on a percentage basis. I've done this based on what I've read on the MT thread as well as some personal knowledge. Students wishing to major in MT should make sure that at least some of the schools to which they're applying not the most selective ones. And that's probably the best strategy in any case. (You can see the list on the Colleges for Musical Theatre thread.)

The second part is harder. How do you know if your kid has talent? You're right, teachers are by instinct supportive rather than critical. We want to give students skills to improve. We generally don't want to make harsh judgements; and too often we have been wrong when we do. So how do you get a blunt answer out of us?

In the world of music, it's quite common for prospective students to take a lesson with a teacher they want to study with. It's not free, but it is instructive. (For example, my older son is a bassoonist. When he was preparing for auditions some years ago, we paid as much as $100 for an hour lesson; $30 was more common.) Teachers will encourage students they would like to hear audition for them later, and they can tell any student what they need to work on to prepare for auditions.

We don't do that very much in the theatre, and I almost hesitate to suggest it. (I can hear my colleagues across the country cursing me now.) But you might try calling a nearby department with a good theatre program and asking if someone can hear a prospective student sing and/or do a monologue and provide some feedback about what the student needs to work on to prepare for national-level auditions. Ask them to be as honest as they can be about the problems they see and hear, including the appropriateness of the material and any speech problems which need correction.

Don't be surprised if they say they've never done this. As I said, it's not common in the theatre. But if you indicate that you would be willing to pay a reasonable fee, either to the instructor or to the department, it might help.

(I hope I don't regret suggesting this...)

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Sunday, May 16, 2004 - 09:33 pm: Edit *

Can anyone give me some input on the programs at Rutgers and Northern Illinois? A couple of you moms have sons who were interested in both. Feel free to contact me off-list with what you remember about their impressions if you'd like. I'm getting close to having my top 10 ready.

xiggi · November 3, 2008, 6:39pm

*By Soozievt (Soozievt) on Sunday, May 16, 2004 - 10:23 pm: Edit *

Valerie asked me if I would share information about a summer theater program that my daughter attends (going on her seventh summer), Stagedoor Manor Performing Arts Training Center. Before I do, just a note to Onstage, I also have another daughter who spent four summers at French Woods Festival of the Performing Arts and loved it. She has always done a lot in the area of performing arts but is not going to be focusing on that in college beyond extracurriculars. The one who goes to Stagedoor Manor is going to be applying next fall to BFA programs in musical theater. Also, I see that Valerie posted above asking of summer programs that might help kids to achieve their theater dreams in college. I just want to say that choosing to send my daughter to Stagedoor was never with her future in mind, including college. She has always been passionate about theater since preschool and she wanted to go to a performing arts program overnight all summer when younger and we researched them and she chose Stagedoor. We do not send her there as preparation for college. I have since observed over the years, however, that many kids, particularly the more talented ones, have gone onto the top theater college programs in the country. My daughter has many older friends and now knows kids at many of these programs. So, I have no idea the correlation between Stagedoor and getting into a college program and that does not matter to me. But if your child is very passionate about theater and would love to be immersed in it with others who share that passion, with professional training, as well as production opportunities, I cannot recommend it highly enough. Here is my description of the program:

Stagedoor Manor is a summer theater immersion program for performers ages 8 -18 located in the Catskills of New York. Through a variety of classes in all aspects of theater, as well as performing in theatrical productions, each performer has many opportunities to pursue her passion in theater. The staff is made up of professional directors, actors, voice teachers, and choreographers. The summer is divided into three 3 - week sessions.

Each student selects her own personal program of classes. There are four 50 minute class periods per day and the student selects eight classes to take per 3-week session. The classes are varied and include several levels of appropriate instruction. Acting classes include such topics as: audition and cold reading, comedy, master class, scene study, Shakespeare, speech and diction, acting techniques and theater games. The musical department classes include singing technique, vocal coaching, musical theater, and auditioning for musicals. The dance department places students according to the appropriate dance level based on an audition. There are various levels of classes for ballet, pointe, jazz, tap, modern, hip hop, swing, modeling, period dance and choreography. There is also a television department that teaches classes in auditioning for the camera, TV acting, video production, and movie making. Behind the scene classes include costume design, directing, make-up, play writing, stage management, technical theater, and stage combat. There are topic specific master classes with working professionals as well.

Besides classes, each child is cast into a drama or musical production for each 3-week session. This is done by audition, though every child is cast in a show. The auditions include singing (if trying out for a musical) and a cold reading of a scene, plus a dance placement audition for experienced dancers. The program produces 36 full scale productions every summer, and thus approximately 12 shows go up every session. The shows range from basic Broadway hits to more advanced and challenging productions. Each show has its own professional director, music director, choreographer, stage manager, scenic designer, lighting designer, and costumer. The productions try to feature each camper, giving them their "special moment" on the stage, as casts average less than 25 actors. Stagedoor Manor has seven indoor and outdoor theaters, two scenic shops and an abundantly stocked costume shop. Each camper can choose between being cast in either a drama or a musical. I have watched countless productions at Stagedoor and find that the level of performance is higher than any I have seen for a youth production, and rivaling many professional productions.

Each day, the camper takes four classes, five hours of rehearsal (broken into two different periods of the day), and two blocks for recreation. Students are housed in what was once a Catskill resort hotel. Three to five children share a carpeted room with a private bathroom. Both the program and the setting are not camp-like in nature but rather are an intensive center for performing arts training.

The children who attend Stagedoor come from all over the country as well as from foreign countries and their background and experience in theater is varied. While some kids may have only performed in school productions at home, some have done community or regional theater, professional theater, all the way up to Broadway and television. Participants relish in being among a peer group of other young people who share their passion for theater. My observations are that the group of kids is made up of the most talented kids from each persons respective hometowns. Thus the peer group at Stagedoor is one that each child cannot find at home. The level and intensity of training, combined with the level of talent and motivation, goes beyond what most kids can find in their home communities.

Stagedoor Manor has many successful alumni including Natalie Portman,Jeanine Tesori, Zach Braff, Mandy Moore, Robert Downey, Jr., Michelle Federer, Yancy Arias, Alexander Chaplin, Jennifer Jason Leigh, Jon Cryer, Julia Murney, Josh Charles, Michael Ian Black, and Mary Stuart Masterson, among others. However, the camps goal is to create an enriching summer atmosphere where young people can learn and grow through the fun of theater and camp while developing new and lasting friendships.

To say that my child loves Stagedoor Manor would be an understatement. She would go there all year if it were possible! When she is there, she is in her element. The work from early in the morning until late at night is pure pleasure for her. The immersion in theater fuels her passion. This experience simply cannot be replicated at home, despite many performing arts classes and theatrical productions. At Stagedoor, every child has this common passion. The rehearsals are focused and the end result is amazing. Since she was nine, my daughter has also been in a selective cabaret troupe at Stagedoor that performs in resort nightclubs. This intensive group is the highlight of her experience at Stagedoor. The level of this cabaret production is quite professional. It is not just the training and shows, but the peer group that is the core of Stagedoors program. Throughout the winter, my daughter is in daily contact with her fellow Stagedoorians from all over. While my daughter has extensive stage credits elsewhere, the opportunities to play major roles in challenging productions at Stagedoor is simply different than the youth roles she can play in adult productions. She has been stretched as an actress, singer, and dancer at Stagedoor. Theater has been my childs calling since she was in preschool but the experiences at Stagedoor Manor have been the most major influence and have strengthened her drive to pursue this field as her lifes work. My daughter lives for Stagedoor Manor!

Hope that helps, Valerie!

Susan

*By Jrmom (Jrmom) on Monday, May 17, 2004 - 07:05 am: Edit *

Doctorjohn,
Thanks for that thoughtful answer. (Actually, thanks very much for all your thoughtful contributions!)

In the time since my original post, I've thought of another way to answer the "reach-match-safety" question, which is: attend a prestigious summer program (some of the ones mentioned here and in the MT thread), where it sounds like the students get real feedback. Unfortunately, too late for us, but might be good for others reading this.

Your idea is a good one. Thanks. Worth a try.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Monday, May 17, 2004 - 02:24 pm: Edit *

Hi Susan

THANKS ever so much!!!!

Your report on Stagedoor and your daughter's experience is just what we needed here. It will go a long way to help others pursue their theatre passion. Whether they do it year round through their schools and community or only during the summer months.

Stagedoor sounds like a WONDERFUL summer opportunity for Theatre preparation and interest for that 8-18 yr old that is hard to reproduce elsewhere if not impossible.

Like the summer theatre camp (Harand Camp of the Theatre Arts) my son attended for 5 yrs there are many opportunities that kids and college students can take advantage of during the summer months. From theatre academic programs offered through Universities, selective H.S. summer stock venus, to camp, private lessons, local theatre programs and schooling.

For the college age student. Many theatre camps hire college age counselors for their summer programs. Often the counselors are invested not only in the camper but also into what they can bring to the summer Theatre program in way of performance and further gain experience in the Theatre arts.

For others summer is a time off from Theatre especially if pursued during the school year at an intense pace. However, if the Theatre passion and interest is there in the individual, summer becomes the time of year where time and intent can be excercised without the added burden of regular academic courses. Often it can be a time to research and prepare monologues for the school year, prepare essays for college applications, take an added course that will help the student during the coming academic year; indulge in creative writing avenues and hone it on a speciality. A constructive time at a more leisurely pace or a time of Theatre intensity not persued during the school year. Often too, summer becomes a time to augment what one aspired too during the school year through EC activites. Others will use the opportunity to use their summer weeks and months to sleep, catching up on much needed rest and work in another area of interest other than theatre. Or, hold a job that gives them much needed money and too, experience in becoming a round rounded responsible adult.

Stagedoor sounds fabluous. What a wonderful opportunity! Again thanks Susan for your input and parental perspective. One can not get this kind of subjective experience from a marketing brochure or website portfolio. Your insight is much appreciated.

*By Cama (Cama) on Monday, May 17, 2004 - 02:33 pm: Edit *

Usdan Center for the fine and Performing Arts. Wonderful day camp on LI but kids commute from the city as well.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Monday, May 17, 2004 - 02:54 pm: Edit *

Thesbohemian

Rutgers and Northern Illinois are both BFA Theatre programs.

Rutgers has come a long way in recent years and vies for a large handful of schools one would want to include on their school list of interest.

Northern Illinois's program is a very good theatre traing BFA in and of itself. It too is one where it needs to be looked at closely. Most of it's teachers have come from Rutgers.
A lot of Chicago regional theatre actors are graduates of Northern Illinois's BFA Acting program and highly regarded.

It's campus though, is located in a remote area of the prairie plain in DeKalb Illinos. It is about 65 miles from the city of Chicago where the theatre district is happening. I would look closely at the University as a whole to see if it would hold your interest outside the theatre track and give you the selection of courses you would be interested in taking over the next few years. Also, I'm not sure how much academic selection is available for you to pursue other than their BFA training.

Northern is not known for their depth or breadth of knowledge. However, one can get an average eduction there and there are some tracks of study better than others. For instances, their music department is strong. Theatre studies for becoming a teacher is decent. So is education in general at the undergraduate level.

I would say that Northern Illinois is a safety school academically (ranked overall 59); a selective school for BFA Acting

Rutgers, a public state University. It's BFA Acting program is selective.

I am not familiar with it's campus that offers the BFA Acting track. Although, I would not discount it.

*By Soozievt (Soozievt) on Monday, May 17, 2004 - 09:04 pm: Edit *

I am glad you found my synopsis of Stagedoor useful, Valerie. I am happy to answer questions about either Stagedoor Manor or French Woods Festival of the Performing Arts. Older daughter went four summers for six weeks each to FWF and younger one goes for six weeks every summer (once went nine weeks) and is starting her seventh season there.

I want to add something I found out after I wrote my description above. I happened to write the director of productions at Stagedoor to ask if there was any chance for coaching help this summer to prepare for college auditions (monologues in particular, but also songs) this coming fall. She wrote me and said they have done this for many kids in the past to prepare for college auditions and they would be happy to line that up for my child this summer. So, I know others do get that at the pre-college theater programs but just wanted to add that that is also available to pre-college aged kids at Stagedoor Manor as well. As I mentioned before, though we never chose this program with college or the future in mind, the talented kids from there do seem to have a very positive track record with admissions at many of the best college theater programs. I cannot say if there is any correlation, however. I can say that Stagedoor is a recognized name in the field. I cannot tell you of how many times casting directors in NYC have commented to my D at an audition when they have seen Stagedoor productions and training on her resume. In fact, sometimes the casting folks will say, "I went there!" which entails a little chat at the audition!

Susan

PS, I also want to thank Dr.John for his invaluable posts and insights on these forums! Also for the newest list of schools that should be helpful to many.

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Monday, May 17, 2004 - 10:29 pm: Edit *

Thanks to all who gave me input on various schools on and off-list. I now have my top 10 list and my teachers cant bark at me about it anymore without me having the right to bark back. Obviously, its still very early and the order will probably change with schools moving up or down or even being replaced as I get more information. I realize the list is heavy on highly selective BFA programs. The way I see it is if I continue to progress at anywhere near the rate I have this school year, feel like my auditions go well, and dont get accepted to any of the top nine, maybe I should fan away the smoke my teachers have uncharacteristically blown up my skirt and reevaluate what Im doing with my life. Academically, I shouldnt have a problem being accepted to any of them short some kind of weird shift in the pecking order. My rankings are based on factors I mentioned in a previous post as much as on the BFA programs themselves. Im not totally comfortable with the locations and/or campus environments of a couple, but I decided to compromise a little on that because of other factors. The ones with an asterisk have full academic scholarships for which I may be in the running which would move them up the list if offered. Assuming acceptance into more than one, academic scholarships will probably carry more weight in my final decision than anything else since all of them have very good programs. The ones I already know very well and for which I have sentimental interest and an inside track on large local scholarships are marked with a plus sign. An ampersand denotes no auditions being required. I still need to pick two or three besides FSU for which Ill do my auditions on campus. Those plane tickets and class absences are going to add up if I do much more than that, though. The list is as follows:

FSU +
DePaul
Otterbein
Evansville
SMU *
Miami *
Rutgers
Minnesota
Northern Illinois
College of Charleston + &

If anybody has any comments or inside information on any of these programs, Id love to know and would appreciate reading them on or off-list. Im most interested in hearing the good and bad aspects of each from current students and recent graduates. Thanks again!

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Monday, May 17, 2004 - 11:58 pm: Edit *

Susan - Would you please share your Insight and experiences with

French Woods Festival of the Performing Arts

What experiences have others had during their various summer activities preparing for Theatre programs or colleges

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Tuesday, May 18, 2004 - 12:16 am: Edit *

Doctorjohn

In your resources, do you have a list of theatre schools similar to the list you recently made for MT? If so. It would be great to get your input of selection across the country

*By Doctorjohn (Doctorjohn) on Tuesday, May 18, 2004 - 07:34 am: Edit *

Valerie:

Yes, but it's too long to post here, and I'd simply be plagiarizing published information. The 9th edition of "The Directory of Theatre Training Programs" has just been issued by American Theatre Works in Dorset, VT. It is organized by state and has detailed entries on every school in each state which has a theatre program of some kind. (They claim 475+ entries.) The index in the back of the book lists all the schools alphabetically in the first column, and then adds columns representing Acting, Design, Management, Musical Theatre, and so on. If the school has a degree in a particular area, it is marked on the chart. So, rather quickly, you can find schools which offer BFA degrees in Design, for example.

At the risk of appearing to be a shill (I assure you I have no financial arrangement with them), here is the website: [dorsettheatrefestival.com[/url</a>]

It is available in CD as well as hard copy. You might want to consider recommending it to your local library and your high school counselling department, so that kids who don't have the financial resources to buy it will have access to it.

It's not perfect. Some of the information is hard to decipher. But just to have a list of schools with contact information is invaluable, and this directory provides considerably more.

*By Soozievt (Soozievt) on Tuesday, May 18, 2004 - 08:53 am: Edit *

I agree about the book that DoctorJohn recommends. Ironically it is created right here in Vermont.

I have seen past editions. When my child takes voice for 90 minutes, it is so far from home that I have to stay there and this book happens to be on the voice teacher's shelf and I am always perusing it. Back in February, I ordered the most recent edition (which he does not have) from Amazon and it has been backordered all this time. So, I hope it is coming now if it is out! Dr. John is right about the spreadsheet on programs at the back of the book!

Valerie, when I get a chance I will write up FWF. I am off to my kids' annual National Piano Auditions.

Susan

*By Norcalmom (Norcalmom) on Tuesday, May 18, 2004 - 03:14 pm: Edit *

Valerie, saw your note about still checking out Pepperdine. Thanks!

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Tuesday, May 18, 2004 - 06:49 pm: Edit *

Thanks Doctorjohn for the info. It will be very helpful to many!!!

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Tuesday, May 18, 2004 - 07:42 pm: Edit *

Thesbohemian

What State are you from?

Have you considered consolidating your auditions to the "Unifieds" in Chicago next February?

I would give serious consideration and intent to MN Gutherie BFA Acting. The way they have their program structured and the requirement to be well versed in academics within a four yr contract guarrantee of graduation is impressive. It is a fairly new program. but because of that you get the individual attention and passion of your teachers and directors. They are interested in the whole student and not just a BFA theatre training student. The directors and many of the teachers backgrounds are pretty established in the education and theatre circle as well!! Also, they work closely with their students and help them along as they make choices and give personal direction and aid (contacts, networking) when and where needed. The theatre dept also has more than one student run theatre where the students get the chhance to playwrite, direct, produce and act. The city itself has many opportunities for acting year long. Minn/St Paul is rich in all the Arts. MN also has a strong music dept. Yanni is a graduate of MN. It might be something that you are looking for based on your previous posts. MN is the largest public research University in the country with a well established reputation in many fields. Students have the opportunity to draw on the breath of what the University has to offer. From the average student to one who wants to be the best in their field. It's urban campus has many pluses and lots of opportunities in a safe conservative evironment that often feels like a surburban city local.
Clean shaven, non pierced facial, Short, clean cut hair on the guys; blue jeans, birkenstocks/gym shoes the dress, fresh fruit; starbucks and bottled water the beverage and backpacks everywhere. City/Campus buses & shuttles, Volkswagon/Totyota cars, bikes and lots of walking - the mode of transportation. Ivy league buildings, lots of them and the sports/work out complex will not the socks off of you! MN is one of ten schools who participate in the NFL. The University reciporcates tuition with other States in it's region

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Tuesday, May 18, 2004 - 11:46 pm: Edit *

Valerie,
Yeah. Minnesota looks like a really good program. I think it could be exciting to be part of an up-and-comer like that. My only real concern with the program itself is that, based on a quote on their website, I think I might sense a slight prejudice against screen acting which isn't my main focus at this point, but does interest me in the long run. That's something I intend to explore further with them to see if there's any real condescension, though. (Budcinco?) They also have a "strongly encouraged" callback weekend which would cost another $300 plane ticket if I were invited.

When I was applying my makeshift number rating system to what I've been able to find out about various aspects of the overall schools, I had them in a three-way tie with Miami and Rutgers with the edge going to the other two based mainly on something I read in The Insider's Guide to Colleges: 2004 which suggested the overall school has a not-so-great graduation rate and dorm life isn't very good. I'll have to admit that thinking of the winters there also played a small part in the tiebreaker. Brrrrrrr!!! Then again, it goes semi-arctic at several of the schools I'm looking at. I don't even own a heavy coat!

I'm from south of the Mason-Dixon line. I'm a little apprehensive about saying exactly which state I'm from because high schools like mine are few and far between in my region and I'd prefer not give myself away and possibly create a preconception with people who may be lurking for whom I may later audition. I want to approach my auditions with a completely clean slate and stay as incognito as possible during most of my information gathering in case I inadvertently apply my prodigious talent for saying the wrong thing. Everybody's not as understanding as Doctorjohn. I guess I'm a little paranoid online.

The serious seniors from my school do go to "the unifieds" every year but I'd like to audition on campus for a few schools because I've been told the chance of admission is greater at some when you do that. I'll just have to figure out which ones those are. Hopefully, I'll be able to schedule the auditions on the same dates as scholarship interviews.

*By Wct (Wct) on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 - 02:43 am: Edit *

Thesbohemian-

My son was accepted to the Minnesota Guthrie program without attending the call back weekend. We explained to them it just wasn't financially feasible for him to go. They told us that although it is encouraged, students are still accepted without attending, (as it did happen with my son).

This program was high on my son's list last year but he decided to go with his first choice which was CMU.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 - 04:13 pm: Edit *

Thesbohemian

Yes, I understand all of your concerns. However, don't give up on any one school as of yet or any one way of doing auditions. mmmmm. S was not able to attend the MN's callback weekend. He was and is in school where time allotment and travel was not conducive. When he was home on Spring Break, we drove to MN for a one on one interview, tour and audition with school and Guthrie personnel. Yes, it was an extra expense but an invaluble experience for all. Since S attended "Unifieds" the extra money spent to go to MN private audition was cost effective because there was not added fees for individual schools. If you can do it, I highly recommend it. Those schools that are looking at you seriously are the ones that ask you to audition again. So, not all schools have to be taken into consideration for extra money allocated for private callbacks.

I don't agree that Unifieds neutralize your chance to be accepted to Acting programs. Sometimes at Unifieds a student is asked to audition again with call backs there. If it wasn't a great opportunity for most then Unifieds would not be what it is today. May I encourage you to do what is best for you - both emotionally and financially.

MN's BFA acting program is the only one of it's kind that teaches with a renown Regional theatre - being Guthrie. Yes, the acting program like most Acting BFA conservatory programs are geared toward the regional stage for learning ones craft. If you are looking to film acting then a school like UCLA's BA program in their Theatre Film and Television school would be something you might want to seriously consider. They approach a lot of their acting from a film perspective. However, again. Ones craft is learned from the stage and UCLA requires this too for their highly selective program. USC is well known for their film and acting from a film perspective. It is a conservatory BFA program. Price needs to be taken into consideration for out of State private tuition fees. I beleive Miami and Emerson give you stage and film options and opportunities. check both schools BFA and BA programs for variety and selection

*By Crypticism (Crypticism) on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 - 05:17 pm: Edit *

I'm going to attend Northwestern's National High School Institute (theatre division) this summer.

I'm planning to apply to Northwestern ED.

Unfortunately, I'm having a hard time finding safeties that meet all my criteria (Some of which are: mix of arts and sciences, near or in a major city, great campus, diverse). If anyone has any suggestions, I'd love to hear them.

I'm from Hawaii, have great ECs, pretty good test scores, and will have great recs. I homeschool, take some classes by mail (get good grades), and will be taking a few community college courses this fall.

Thanks in advance.

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 - 08:01 pm: Edit *

Valerie,
Understood about most BFA programs emphasizing stage. Im actually a strong believer in stage first and would expect nothing less. What Im more concerned about is an attitude where the mentors frown on the other forms and try to instill a similar attitude in students who almost feel its their obligation to mutter sell out any time theyre mentioned. Ive never seen that with theatre people, but Ive heard it exists in some circles. Ive seen it more with classical musicians. I just looked at the Minnesota website again and found they do have a Level IV acting for the camera course, a media program project developer, and a career preparation person with SAG and AFTRA credentials so Im assuming its a non-issue. It's nice knowing the "strongly encouraged" doesn't mean "you'd better." I've looked at the major California schools and they don't seem like good fits for me for various reasons. Thanks, Wct, too.

BTW, I showed my list to my teacher today and he growled a little that some schools he likes arent on it, but he didnt bark. I may audition for one of those at the time of the Unifieds just to humor him.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Thursday, May 20, 2004 - 11:34 am: Edit *

Hi Thesbohemian

Hey, don't forget to look at Michigan at Ann Arbor. Now here's a school one would want to consider strongly. They have lots to offer. Performance, acting, theatre studies, MT etc. BFA and BA programs. Their academics is highly rated. One of the Top schools in the country. I am not sure about tuition out of State though. I would check with their Theatre dept to see if they give any scholorships, merit or FinAid over above what the school offers. Michigan also gives you an opportunity to integrate Liberal Arts major with their Theatre BFA. It's the whole student philosophy again and well worth it.

What schools does your teacher favor/like. There might be something there worth investigating.

About attitude: Yes, there are teachers and Theatre depts that frown on anything not stage learnt. Predjudice against film. That kind of attitude can be detrimental to a student's ego and ability. Some really really good BA programs and LAC's are better than some BFA conservatory programs for undergraduate studies. Again, what is your intent, how does the school implement what you re looking for. Is there enough challenge in those schools to meet and stretch you academically. What do you want to pursue after college undergraduate degree?

Maybe, you don't know for sure right now. Generally, a major is declared at the end of ones sophomore year of college. By that time one would have a better idea of what direction the student will want to take to graduate college. So, I guess, what I am trying to say is, unless you have a really strong desire to be on the stage and want to study it exclusively these next four years. And, you want to pursue an acting degree at the graduate level so that you can work on the stage as an adult - I would vote for a really strong academic program as my first line of intent. Then look at the school for it's BFA or BA in theatre. Then look at the EC activities in Theatre one can experience.

I guess my suggestions muddy the waters for you, but I am picking up a hesitation on your part about exclusive BFA programs and your need to be academically challenged and well rounded.

Cost becomes a factor after the fact. There are some really good BFA and BA colleges that offer EC theatre opportunities in State Universities and LAC's in Flordia and Lousianna. Also, Unversity of Nebraska at Lincoln is right up there in over all ranking with University of California at Berkley, Michigan at Ann Arbor and Un. of Illinois at Champaign. University of Missouri at Columbia for jouralism/creative writing. Indiana University at Bloomington for their over all college experience plus their performance dept. University of Indiana at Evansville too.

However, I am sensing that a smaller school- University or a LAC is right up your ally.
Prudue, Earlham, Grinnnell, Creighton, North Park University, North Central College, Marquette, University of Chicago, Northwestern, Tulane, Vanderbilt, just to name a few from 3500 colleges and Universities here in USA

To be a successful actor with diversity and longevity one needs to be academically sound and well rounded. A lot of these schools too offer study aboard programs where one sometimes get a lower cost in fees and college credits to study aboard while being a student at their USA school. This is a different program than one where students pay in addition to their University tuition to study aboard.

So, as you define and redefine your college list your intent should be number one priority. Everything else will fall into place.

The BFA's at MN and Michigan do give you the best of both worlds and academics. These two schools could meet your teacher's ideals and your wants and needs too. I am curious though, as to his favorites and why. There could be a valuable lesson in there over and above narrow mindedness.

*By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Thursday, May 20, 2004 - 07:05 pm: Edit *

Valerie,
Thanks for another thoughtful reply. I think youve misunderstood me, though. An intense BFA training program within a greater school is what I definitely want. Ive actually been working to set myself up to attend one with the ability to take very few classes outside my major. If all goes as planned with my AP and community college distance learning courses, the largest number of general education type courses Ill have to take at any of the schools Im looking at will be five over the entire four years. At some, Ill have to pick a fun little PE course or something like that just to stay a full-time student during some semesters if I follow the programs planned four-year training curriculum. I do want the outside courses to be interesting and taught by good professors, but I have no interest in them being a challenge. Basically, my goal in that sense is to be able to focus intensely on my craft with very little distraction from outside academic demands. No more math. No more lab sciences. No more Kings and Queens history that ignores the important stuff. No more silly little busy work essays about nothing ...

What I think youre really picking up on is my desire no, my NEED - to be in a situation where Ill be able to use my free time to unwind from the intense training demands and be around a variety of people who may have absolutely nothing to do with it. I need to recharge. I love my friends at the conservatory I attend, but I very much look forward to going home to see my normal friends again. Thats what I miss now and what I want back in college. I want to have a roommate who has nothing to do with the arts. I want to play pickup soccer and tennis with people who can challenge me that way. I want to learn golf and ride horses. Shoot, I might even join a sorority if it looks like Ill have time. My mom was a Tri-Delt so I guess that makes me a legacy. LOL I want to train hard for a professional career, but I want to have a life outside it, too.

I hope Im not making my teacher seem like an antagonist because I love the man and we wouldnt even be talking about me having a prayer of getting accepted to some of the programs Im looking at without the excellent training Ive been receiving. Some of the schools he favors for me that arent on my list are NCSA, Juilliard, and Purchase. He likes CMU a lot, but realizes its too expensive to even discuss. No offense to anybody affiliated with those schools because theyre all awesome. Graduates from my school attend all of them. I just dont see them being right for me as a whole person.

Michigan is too expensive and doesnt give big enough scholarships to make up for it as far as I can tell. Im in one of those weird, in-between places financially. My mom doesnt have enough money in trust to send me to a lot of out-of-state colleges, but too much for me to get any kind of meaningful financial aid other than loans, so Im going to need scholarships.

*By Crypticism (Crypticism) on Thursday, May 20, 2004 - 11:44 pm: Edit *

Does anyone have an opinion about theatre at Middlebury?

*By Laurenz (Laurenz) on Friday, May 21, 2004 - 10:47 am: Edit *

Thesbohemian,

Please don't not audition for a school just because you think it is too expensive. You may be surprised at what they offer in the form of scholarships, grants, loans, workstudy and such. It if seems like it might be a good fit, go for it. And visiting is a must or you won't know.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Saturday, May 22, 2004 - 03:18 pm: Edit *

Thesbohemian

I understand where you are coming from. I also understand why your teacher is dissappointed. You are in a pickle. Also, I feel you are comparing apples to oranges and that makes the whole process more difficult. Here's a couple of suggestions to maybe help you.

I like your list although I feel you need to add two reach schools that aren't there. I realize this will be more than 10 but two more won't hurt. How about a compromise with your teacher and add two that he would be delighted to see that you have included for your future opportunities? In selecting the two, I would look for the strength of the BFA program and not anything else about the school. Then I would go back to my list and take two schools off that you really don't like and select two schools for their BA programs in theatre and not look at anything else about the school. Then two schools that offer a general BA in Liberal Arts with EC's in a heavy Theatre oriented atsmophere that will give you the opportunity to apply for Theatre grad school. With the six school remaining, I would take your list and see where you think you can get the biggest bang for your money and varied interests. With 2 safeties; two right on the money and two reach. In those six you will be looking at their BFA with other academic opportunities and a healthy social atmosphere outside of theatre.

Now, you're wondering. Why? and where am I going with this? Here's why. One, you have a lot of interests over and above theatre. Two, you are not sure you believe that a straight course in theatre is the way to go. Three, you do not want a lot of unneccsarry academic courses, Four, you are worried about money and five, you want your freedom and independence. While I encourage you to seek out the best for you I also caution that what you want is not neccassrily available the way you want it. Thus the apples and oranges theory.

Most BFA programs are pretty narrowly defined and structured. The better ones are truly Theatre trained programs with little academic variety. This is because it is a very concetrated course of learning. Also, your time is devoted to it's theatre program. Thus, your down time (what little there is) is shared with those you are in theatre classes with you and on the stage with you. This is not unusual when one stops to think about their immediate environment they spend much of their time in. So, with theatre like many other special schools of learning and majors, your college experience and campus becomes the size and college of your concentration. You can be on a campus that offers a lot but if your world is mainly filled up with a concentrated track of learning, there are only so many hours in a day and week that allows you to be more well rounded. Same too, if you are in a sorority. The size of the campus plus your experience on campus is now much smaller and more inclusive in one area of thought and being. A general course of study and hours of freedom (which will be more)to do what you want in other areas of recreation and interests, is the true college experience as a whole. One can't be the other. No matter how much you want it or beleive in it's well roundedness.

When you apply to BFA programs you are applying to not only that University but also to that particular school of concentration. That means you need two acceptances from that one school. One for general admission and the other for that special school or track. When one is applying for a BA, it doesn't neccessarily mean you need two acceptances. Some do, most don't. If you are applying for general admission with a wish to concentrate your free time in EC theatre then you are free to make your own program over the next four years and put your free time into the University's opportunities offered to everyone over and above your academic courses.

So, if you want a professional BFA in Theatre then you are pretty much confining yourself to that school within the University and your free time is with those fellow students for recreation and interest and time allotted. Also, often the University has you living (dorm or floor)with your progessional school's students for common adaptability and interest vs general dorm life.

If you know all of this ahead of time, then when you are looking over your list for colleges you have a much better understanding of how to break it down and how to go about writing essays of interests and what expectations you are seeking from that College and vice verus. So, reason for my suggestion to go with 12 schools.

Here's one more thing to think of. Getting accepted into a BFA program is very difficult in and of itself. Often, one is rejected because they don't fit in with the ensemble the schoool is trying to create, another, you might be to strong for their program and they fear you will leave before 4 years, another they feel you don't have the vested interest to stay for four years. Another, they sense you want more of a general experience vs. a concentrted one. Notice, how I have not mentioned yet any reasons based on your GPA, SAT's or H.S. academic range of talent and interests. It's more on what they preceive to be your weaknesses or stenghts or where they feel they can challenge you and you will be receptive to their teaching based on the ensemble they are creating. And stage work is about ensembles.

If you know the above reasons, then when you are looking over your list you will have a better handle on why and where you want to put your intent. Hope this helps. If it makes you feel anyy better. what you are seeking and wanting is pretty normal. However, like everything else in life one has to make choices and compromise. Theatre itself is really defined at the graduate level. I am going to stick my neck out here and say that even though you are in a conservatory type of H.S. and you want to pursure theatre at the undergrauate level. Most successful actors with longevity and diversity are either graduate trained or are taking advanced acting courses after 4 yrs of college while they are pursuing their acting career. 99% of the students that apply to undergraduate level theatre schools or concentrations had a love of theatre in H.S., did a few plays , took alot of ECs in performance studies but have not had any real traning. Unergraduate gives them that. Then Graduate school or professonal acting schools give them the depth to interpete with the maturity they now have in ther early twenties that they did not and often times can not reach for at a younger age. Even those who after college want to go out and pursure their acting carreers will tell you that they are taking private or professional acting lessons to learn their craft.

So, i guess it comes down to what is it you really want to do with the next four years of your life. Also, knowing that when you graduate you are then expected to be in the real world of self responsibiliy and any schooling you want after college and any opportunities you want to pursue are excercised by you based on your circumstances at any given time and economic self responsibility, beside life's reality of getting in the way of your hopes and dreams.

I have said a lot. maybe too much. But, I sense your need for many things you want to pursue. I beleive you can have what you want, it is just a matter of planning it out in reasonable steps of goals to accomplish. One at a time.

Valerie

p.s. my S wanted to put reins and then expectations of what he wanted to do in college. He quickly learned he would have to do them in steps instead of all at once. He is happy now because he figured out how he was going to accomplish his dreams and now feels confidennt that he will without having to give anythin up. It's just a matter of putting it all into manageable goals to accomplish over the next 4 to 6 years.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Saturday, May 22, 2004 - 05:36 pm: Edit *

Thesbohemian

I should add that there are also a number of BFA Theatre schools/concentrations that require not only a truly professional theatre training but also an intense academic course of study. This is to make sure that when their students graduate that they are pretty well rounded. paticularity for those that do not go on to pursue graduate level learning (theatre or academics). So, ones time is taken up in theatre training and all it's responsibilities and requirments PLUS time in acaemic classes and free time studying - researching - writing papers etc. Pretty intense fours years. There's is not one way better than another. It's how one goes about it and what the schools their applying to offer and require.

<ol>
<li>Preprofessional Theatre training </li>
</ol>

ex: The American Academy of Dramatics Arts

<ol>
<li>" " " " " BFA with a limited course of liberal arts - often confined to fine arts history and interest etc. requirement. In other words one wouldn't be studying political science or say bio engineering with BFA Theatre </li>
</ol>

ex: NYU Tisch Performing Arts

<ol>
<li>" " " " " BFA with a BA or general liberal arts requiremnt </li>
</ol>

ex: University of Michigan
University of MN Guthrie

<ol>
<li>BA Theatre with a BA or general liberal arts requirement
ex: UCLA </li>
<li>BA or BS degree with EC's in Theatre performance and interest </li>
</ol>

These are just examples and within each school and particular concentration of the theatre, the program and requirements can vary. Point is there are difference in expectations and requirements.

*By Emilyp114 (Emilyp114) on Saturday, May 22, 2004 - 07:58 pm: Edit *

Valerie,

I've got to clarify your use of Tisch as an example of #2. "BFA with a limited course of liberal arts". Your description of limited isn't exactly accurate.

Tisch drama majors take general ed requirements plus electives each of the four years as part of the Tisch program. The liberal arts requirements may be chosen from any dept. in the College of Arts and Sciences, Tisch interdisciplinary seminars, or Cinema Studies. They actually may NOT be chosen if they are courses which are in any way related to the major. In your liberal arts requirements, you need a minimum of 8 pts. Humanities and 8 pts. Science, plus an additional 8 pts. in either. So although you wouldn't be studying engineering, you could very well be studying political science or biology in addition to drama. Keep in mind that many, if not most, drama majors at Tisch also double major in a subject in CAS. Sorry, but Tisch is not a good example for your description there.

*By Valerie (Valerie) on Saturday, May 22, 2004 - 11:24 pm: Edit *

Hi Emilyp114

Thanks for defining what Tisch allows and offers. Good to hear from you!

V

*By Soozievt (Soozievt) on Sunday, May 23, 2004 - 12:08 am: Edit *

Emily said it best but I was thinking the same thing. NYU/Tisch is likely an example of number three on your otherwise very helpful list.

PS...I know someone at Tisch who has a double major in Chemistry.

Susan

*By Wct (Wct) on Sunday, May 23, 2004 - 01:47 pm: Edit *

If anyone knows what college(s) would fit in catagory 2 from Valerie's list it could be very helpful to people checking out the list on this thread.

I looked at California Institute of the Arts thinking they might fit in catagory 2. They require a percentage of their requirements to come from the school of Critical Studies. I could not find a list of courses from the School of Critical Studies with descriptions at their site. It is only a general description:
<a href="http://calarts.edu/schools/critical_studies/index.html%5B/url%5D">http://calarts.edu/schools/critical_studies/index.html](<a href="http://dorsettheatrefestival.com%5Ddorsettheatrefestival.com%5B/url">http://dorsettheatrefestival.com)</a>

Juilliard's core liberal arts and elective curriculum seems to center around Language Arts:
The</a> Juilliard School - College Division - Interdivisional Liberal Arts Division - Course Descriptions: 2008-09
The</a> Juilliard School - College Division - Interdivisional Liberal Arts Division - Course Descriptions: 2008-09

In your opinion does Juilliard or Cal Arts fit in catagory 2?

*By Wct (Wct) on Sunday, May 23, 2004 - 01:54 pm: Edit *

At CMU actors ARE required to take gen ed courses from outside the BFA Acting major every semester. Students can choose from a wide variety of courses from all the colleges at CMU. This is not so with MT at CMU outside of taking an Interpretation and Argument course and World History during the freshman Year. Everyone has to take a one semester computer course that teaches the students how to use the computer network on campus.

xiggi · November 3, 2008, 6:41pm

By Thesbohemian (Thesbohemian) on Sunday, May 23, 2004 - 07:10 pm: Edit

Wow, Valerie! Thanks for taking the time to write all that! Your apples and oranges theory sounds familiar. What Ive been told here is that I want to "have my cake and eat it, too, without getting fat from it" and I really do think I can do that at some places. What students at some of these programs have told me is that the main source of burnout, head-banging, and failure which usually happens during the first two years to people who have adequate talent and arent on drugs comes not from the training itself, but from getting caught up in high-maintenance, time-consuming GE courses that leave you no time to recharge when combined with the intense training. In most of the schools Im looking at, those come to between ten and fifteen courses that must be taken. Thats why Im going ahead and getting most of them out of the way with AP, etc. while Im still in high school and specifically looking for programs that will accept the credit. Maybe Im missing something, but I think that time saved will allow me to have at least a little more time to smell the roses than the average BFA student. Most of the students Ive talked to seem to agree. For instance, heres the plan of study for the first semester at FSU:

Course: Credit Hours:
THE 4990 Seminar: 0
THE 2020 Intro to School of Theatre: 3
TPP 2110 Acting Techniques 1: 3
TPP 3710 Voice Techniques 1: 3
TPA 2201L Intro to Technical Theatre Lab: 2
Liberal Studies (English & Math): 6

Total Credit Hours 17

Ive been told by a current student that somebody outside the department might make me sign up for the full seventeen hours at orientation. Notice there are six hours (two classes) of English and math. I will have exempted the classes most people will be taking through AP and will likely be advised to take some upper level humanities courses instead. Once Ive initially signed up for them, however, there will be nothing stopping me from dropping both and taking any of the myriad one-hour elective PE courses they offer to keep myself up to the twelve hours required to remain a full-time student. Were talking bowling, golf, tennis, racquetball, soccer, flag football, swimming, martial arts, etc. Overall, FSU requires thirty-seven hours of liberal studies courses. Up to thirty hours of AP credit can be applied towards that and Ill most likely have that much to apply. Ill also have at least three hours of transfer credit from a community college. I think you can see where that leaves me as far as being able to really concentrate on my purpose for going there which will be the highly-rated acting program and still have some time to breathe. Now if I can just get accepted into the program Some of the schools Im looking at require slightly more, but they all seem to be within that range in their liberal studies demands. Believe me. Im paying my dues to put myself in that position.

Speaking of current students, I managed to track down an alumnus from my school who attends one of the other colleges on my list. I got lucky and caught him hanging out at his apartment with several other students from his studio. I was calling to ask some serious questions, but Im still laughing about the hour-and-a-half long madcap improv that ensued over the phone, voice chat, and webcam. Theyve now vowed to abduct me if I decide to go anywhere else. Cool people I could see myself having no problem hanging with a group like that outside of class. In discussing things with my teacher, what he thinks is really giving me pause about all this comes from the fact that I didnt have much exposure to artsy people before I came to my school and Im suffering from a skewed view. The teachers here are wonderful, but the administration keeps us on a very, very, VERY short leash. The legal term is In Loco Parentis. I call them my Loco Parents. Its almost like theyre trying to mold us into perfect little Stepford Kids and a lot of people get very high-strung from it. What I see is a lot of annoying, pretentious, affected behavior from a lot of people. I dunno Maybe when I make my visits, they should be unofficial so I can hang out with some students in their natural environment and see what things are really like instead of getting a well-rehearsed company line from carefully selected representatives. We have people starting at three of the schools on my list next fall. Maybe I can just fly out and visit them after I turn 18.

As for BA programs outside of theatre, if I were interested in doing that, Id be looking at seeing how much aid I could get at some of the Ivy League schools. Really, if I were going to go that route, The College of Charleston would be the best non-Ivy option I can think of. First off, its a good overall school and the theres a full scholarship available to me if I want it. Second, they have a huge arts festival in that city and there are some very, very, VERY good semi-retired actors who live in the area and teach outside the confines of academia who would make excellent mentors if I majored in something else and just maybe minored in theatre. I could even come out of that with a couple of cards. Atlanta has a pretty good professional theatre scene, too, so maybe some schools around there are worth a look. Ill see if I can find a few programs like youre talking about, but it seems like most of the BA theatre schools Ive seen also offer a BFA and Ive heard the BA students tend to be treated like red-headed stepchildren when it comes to casting. If you know of a few besides UCLA where that's not the case, I'd like to know. You did say one thing thats kind of scary. Rejected for being too strong for their program? That would suck! Which ones told your son that? In that case, maybe I do need to audition for a couple more of my teachers pet reach schools as a sort of forward fallback. Thanks again.

By Noccadad (Noccadad) on Monday, May 24, 2004 - 02:31 pm: Edit

WCT, hoping not to be to personal but could you tell us about the financial aid options you experienced at CMU

By Wct (Wct) on Monday, May 24, 2004 - 09:47 pm: Edit

Noccadad-

CMU gave my son the best package out of all the schools he was accepted. He was given scholarships at the other colleges but CMU gave a better "complete" package. He did not get a scholarship at CMU.

One thing that might set our situation apart from others is that my husband is on Social Security disability and I only work part time due to our circumstances, so our income is exremely low. We don't have assets either. That made it possible for federal grant money, CMU grant money and Stafford and Perkins loans, (interest free while in college). The total package made it possible to attend. My son is carrying the debt in his name. In addition to the Perkins and Stafford loans he has one small loan from CMU where the interest accrues from the onset of taking on the loan. The quarterly interest is very, very low and we pay the interest on a quarterly basis so it won't rack up while he is in college.

My son was very, very concerned about taking on the debt. We told him that he has a very special gift that many people see, (not just family) and that this is an investment in his future. He will always have a roof over his head, (as long as we do) and it was important to us that he pursue what we, and others, feel he was born to do.

Coranne · September 17, 2013, 9:52am

hello my name is kierra coranne rice, im new and im here to say hey.

EV14 · October 17, 2013, 3:11pm

Hi all,

Just a reminder that there are some great colleges with excellent programs and small marketing departments. We’ve been impressed by Wagner on Staten Island (and its a short ferry ride from Manattan). Pace in NYS is also excellent. Elon has a fantastic program and should be considered in addition to the other biggies such as MT at UM or CMU. Remember too that if you are applying as a theatre student (not MT through the School of Music) Northwestern’s decision is based on your academics, scores, and statements. No audition.

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