Let’s say I was a student at a T20 school like Vanderbilt, Notre Dame or WashU and was looking to transfer to a non-HYP ivy like Columbia, Penn or Brown. Would the latter schools consider the former schools to be academic peers of theirs, or at least peers relative to the schools most transfer applicants are applying from? And would I have a significant leg up over most community college and non-top school applicants, other things being equal? Also, just how much does not applying for financial aid help one’s prospects for transfer admission (especially at explicitly need-aware schools like Brown)? I’m trying to get a gauge of whether putting together transfer applications will be worth my time. Quick overview of stats: 4.0 College GPA, 3.7 UW GPA from prep school, 1540 SAT (780 CR, 760 M), applying as a history or anthropology major, good recs, decent EC’s, not many awards or APs being high school limited them (but am reporting 5/5/4), UMC white male.
To what extent does being at a peer school of your transfer target affect your chances of admission?
because high school limited them*
It depends on what the target college is looking for in transfer students.
For example, some may be looking more for non-traditional students (many of whom come from community colleges).
Ok how about Brown or Columbia in particular? They seem to make room for a non-trivial number of “traditional” students who they accept on the basis of their GPA, test scores, ECs, recs, essays, etc.
The pool is shallow at the top schools. Unless you have a great story. I.E. Military, single mom, business phenom or a cc transfer rock star it’s tough without the compelling reason.
One that gets noticed as a potential deterrent is what one may call prestige hunting. If there’s no academic reason or story mentioned above it’s just hard to do.
But to answer your question. Yes, your peer school hypothetical would alleviate that concern. So it may give your application in a slightly better reading.
Fair enough. My story is that I prematurely applied ED to my current school without exploring enough options in other cities, and that it turns out the location of the school (i.e. my hometown) has made for a college experience that is not fully stimulating or immersive overall. I’m not going to bash the academics at my current school in my essays, but long story short staying in my hometown just because the school was T20 and I could get into it was a mistake. I would like to explore a new city and be situated in a surrounding community that is entirely novel to me. That being said, I’m not going to transfer to an academic downgrade just to relocate, so I’m only applying to (rough) academic peers located in different cities. There are also some specific academic reasons I have for transferring to each individual school (like Penn’s PPE program, Columbia’s Core and Brown’s Open Curriculum) but I realize these are probably very commonly-given reasons so I think my best best is focusing on the location story.
Do you think it would be advisable that I make a point of stating that I am (more than) satisfied with the academics at my current institution and that my attempts to transfer are almost exclusively driven by the location factor, in order to avoid the appearance of prestige hunting?
I don’t think that will be an issue coming from wash u or Vanderbilt etc.
Simply put, if you are a crackerjack student, they have space (!!!) and think you will be a great addition, it can happen for you.
I personally think your truth is always the best. The most sincere and potentially compelling. And the premise you stated sounds pretty reasonable to me. It’s an honest rationale. Is it enough? Give it a try, only way to know.
So, your plan is to tell Brown that you are looking for a more open curriculum, Columbia that you really want the Core, and Penn that you really want PPE? I don’t want to know the answer, but do you know which one is actually real? IME, sparkly essays tend to have the ring of truth.
By any chance, is what you really, really want the Ivy label? b/c you are only mentioning 3 Ivies - the ones that students sometimes think of as ‘lower’ or ‘easier to get into’ Ivies. Why only those 3 - why not other ‘peer’ schools?
Changing schools is a big decision, and you don’t want to get it wrong twice. You are worrying about your story, but I think that is putting the cart before the horse: have you really thought through what you want/ need /would like from your next school? Are you clear on the negatives of each? Have you thought through the practicalities (for example, have you actually looked at the details of the core and how completing it in 3 years will affect your course options?) .
@collegemom3717
Thank you for your post.
First, there’s an argument to be made that there is a common theme to Brown’s Open Curriculum, Penn PPE, and Columbia’s Core, which is that, generally speaking, they all provide a unique, broad-based academic experience that fosters interdisciplinary thought and intellectual exploration.
Second, did you ignore all I had to say about location being a driving factor of my decision to transfer? Because that story is going to comprise the bulk of my “Why Transfer” statements.
Third, yes, I have considered practicalities such as completing Columbia’s Core plus a major in only 3 years, but to me the cost of working around such difficulties is well worth it. I don’t view transferring as a cost-free decision, but I do think for these institutions the pros would outweigh the cons for me.
Finally, I am also applying to Duke, Georgetown and Northwestern, so it’s not just about the Ivy League factor.
@privatebanker
Thanks for your input and encouragement.
…as does your current college, but perhaps you are too distracted by the lack of novelty in the local shops / eateries / local activities to be engaged by it? (or not loving 1st semester options? sometimes that happens with students from really strong prep schools- the 1st semester or 2 at university is underwhelming).
no- I just cut that bit from an originally longer response, and hoped it fit in under what you really need/want/would like from another school 
I am less concerned with the story you tell the colleges than with you being happy where you actually end up going.
b/c the first part is "I don’t want to be here- but the second part is just as important: I do want to be there. And to know that, you have to have done some hard thinking about the “there”, and how it fits you.
On a simplistic level, some of those locations are pretty different (though all are porous to the towns/cities that are adjacent, which I am guessing are bigger than the one you are in now). Have you visited any of them? There are people who would find Durham and Manhattan equally happy- but there are many who would not. Moreover, the schools are pretty different collegiate experiences. Duke and Brown are both schools with strong - but very different!- personalities: do you know enough about each to know which is likely to be happier for you?
You are obviously a smart, motivated student, so you are a credible candidate for, and can succeed academically at, any of these places. But you are moving because you want a place that will make your college years happier for you. You say your mistake the first time was grabbing the one that seemed easier without doing enough research into other options.
The schools you name all make sense from a ‘peer school’ perspective- but there are more layers to identifying fit. Are you a preppy sporty kind of person? have you always been the cat who walks by yourself? Would you be more likely to be part of the DC Snowball Fight Association, or participate in a Wikipedia Edit-a-thon on women STEM leaders? It’s not that you can’t ‘find your people’ at any of these places (I know a serious introvert who successfully navigated Dartmouth, but it was hard going, and a lot of study abroad was involved). But it is happier to be in a place that is a more natural fit for you.
@Collegemom3717 is on point when she States "the first part is "I don’t want to be here- but the second part is just as important: I do want to be there. "
I however suggest there is a much bigger question you have to answer beyond what do YOU get out of the move…
What is the benefit to the transfer school? Stating the obvious, but Columbia, Penn, and Brown all receive tens of thousands of applications from students just like you, whom have the capacity to academically succeed. You are undeniably impressive. None the less so are many of the 19 out of 20 applicants that get rejected during a normal admissions cycle.
You will need to stand out amongst a variety of extremely competitive groups. Just expressing that your rationale to move is justifiable and that you have the ability to thrive academically falls far short of what it will take.
What will you add to the campus community that others won’t? I don’t mean that rhetorically I am sure there is plenty. That however is what you need to “sell” otherwise there are plenty of qualified and unique candidates.
I don’t think you can afford the false premise that you will be choosing which school you decide to transfer to. You seem to be taking a pragmatic approach so I would be contemplating what does each school look for rather than what do I see in each school.
Good luck!
One of the most important factors with respect to transfer applications is whether or not you are seeking financial aid.
Next most important factor is why you want to transfer to the target school.
Third, your college grades.
Fourth, if you are coming from a 2 year program such as a community college.
Firth, might be current college attended if not a community college. This could hurt or help depending upon the answer to the first three questions.
@Publisher
Thanks for the information. By those factors I would reckon my chances are better than average, as I’m not applying for financial aid and have a 4.0 college GPA from a top private uni. So it really seems that my “why transfer” story is what will make or break my chances at this point.
@collegemom3717
@Nocreativity1
You are both right to point out the distinction between the “why not here” and “why there” sides of the equation. My plan is to write a general “why not here” statement that will be the first paragraph of my transfer essay, and then plan to delve into “why there” reasons for each school individually in the second paragraph.
@Nocreativity1 , I most definitely plan on talking about what I plan on contributing to their community, both in the classroom and extracurriculars-wise. And you’re right to bring up the fact that I’d be lucky to get into one of these, and hence my approach should not revolve around which ones I like the most (as I will most likely not be choosing between more than one, unless I get really lucky), but rather I should focus on why each of these schools presents an attractive alternative to my current school.
And @collegemom3717 , I definitely have an idea of which ones would be the best fit for me (Columbia and Brown, socially speaking, would be much better fits for me than Duke and Penn), but as they say, beggars can’t be choosers, and in many ways I would be happy to transfer to any of these. That being said, I’d also make due with staying at my current school and making the most of it. You’re right to say I need to put a lot of thought into whether transferring is the right choice, but that’s a bridge I’ll cross if I actually get into one of these schools.
I have no clue what my last comment got flagged for…?
With a 4.0 college GPA & no need for financial aid, you should expect good news from some of your target schools.
@Publisher
I’ll try not to get my hopes up too much but that is promising to hear.
Most top schools could care less about financial need. @Publisher I hate to see Misinformation being spread by people that haven’t done this. Brown is the only one of the top schools that isn’t need blind for transfers off the top of my head. It’s easy to look up with some google skills.
To op try your luck, but your attempt at drawing similarities between Brown’s open curriculum and Columbia’s core is misguided. These two schools operate in fundamentally different ways.