Top 25 High Schools with highest SAT/ACT

Prep School Admissions
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<p>@Periwinkle: Of course the subject tests are not helpful in distinguishing the tippy top candidates, but it gets tricky when your score is in the bottom half of the test-taking pool if you come from a prestigious high school. Plus, why would kids who are not strong at the humanities and who have never taken the US History course sequence at Andover sign up for the US History subject test? Note two things: one, unlike SAT I, taking the test is entirely by choice; and two, the US History course sequence is a requirement for graduation at Andover (according to their website; Benley feel free to correct me on this). Unlike the AP, which has tricky essay formats that require some prepping, the SAT’s format is more straightforward (purely MCs–you either know something or you don’t). America is a new nation, so there are only so many ways to select which historical events to teach.</p>

<p>(again, I need Benley to confirm the way US History is taught at Andover)</p>

<p>Plus, the SAT USH test has a rather lenient curve (10 misses = 800, you probably need to miss half of the questions to get in the low 600s, and this simply doesn’t make sense for those bright Andover kids). </p>

<p>^I’m only taking US History as an example, but this line of thought might apply for other subjects as well–especially English Literature, which is mostly skills-based.</p>

<p>And I don’t know about your experience, but I don’t know of any colleges or departments that explicitly require the US History subject test–even for History majors because the major is generally in the Colleges of Arts and Sciences, which are extremely lenient about subject tests choice, unlike some engineering schools. And it’s not like the humanities kids who suck at math and sciences will apply to programs that require 1 math + 1/2 science subject tests. So you can’t say that kids who just suck at the humanities are forced to take it. </p>

<p>For the record, math and science are counted as two different disciplines. So are History and English or English and Language or History and Language</p>

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<p>Yes, I do agree that not everyone at Andover must be a test taking maniac. But we’re talking about a mean of mid 600s here (about half of the best of the best seems to have scored below that range)–and for a school that’s been so canonized on this board. And why wouldnt kids care at all about required standardized testing when they’re at Andover, college-bound?</p>

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<p>MBV, yes, US History is generally required to all students at Andover. The way it’s taught - I guess similarly as in your school - is very much NOT knowledge focused. It touches on the facts of course, but it’s not a survey class in any sense. The majority of tests and assignments are essay questions and papers. So, students do need to prepare for the SAT test since they are definitely not “test ready” coming out of that class. That said, while it’s not easy to get 800, I think with some prep work, it shouldn’t be too hard to get a score of low to mid 700’s. I don’t know why there are quite a few who got 600’s, which in my dictionary is not acceptable.</p>

<p>The average standardized test scores do vary from class to class. I’ve seen scores for UH ranging from about 650 to 690 for the past few years. Another thing interesting I’ve noticed is how the national mean of SAT II scores has increased while it’s relatively stable or fluctuating for Andover students in recent years. For example, for Class '09, the national mean for UH was 599 and Andover mean 682. For Class '12, they were 640 and 656 respectively.</p>

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<p>MBVLoveless, some parents (ahem) have been trying to point out that different students have different colleges in mind. Some colleges require SAT II subject tests, some don’t. Some require either the ACT, others require SAT, SAT II, or the ACT with writing. </p>

<p>Potentially, couldn’t a top student who has great grades and a really high ACT skip taking the subject tests? As I look at the number of students taking the SAT II tests at Andover, students take a variety of tests. (class of 2012: 279 students.) The largest number of students take Math II (205 students). So, about 70 students opted out of Math II. About 24 students opted not to take the SAT II Math tests.</p>

<p>It looks as if the students mostly skip the languages (just judging from the numbers of students taking the tests.) So, the typical PA student takes a math (I or II), then a science, then either Literature or World History, or US History. If they apply to Georgetown, they’ll need three subject tests. </p>

<p>Benley, I don’t think it’s that easy to get up to the low to mid 700s “with some prep work.” They’re competing against kids in public schools in which the entire curriculum, for months, is designed to prepare them for the SAT II exam. As you can see from the SAT scores of the top kids at Lexington High School, the PA kids can’t assume they’re brighter than the public school kids. In the pool of kids taking multiple SAT II tests, they aren’t brighter.</p>

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<p>@Benley: I guess it’s also a lot of essays and papers + a huge research project at the end of the year here, but to write the in-class essays you need to know your facts and understand trends/contingencies–both of which are tested by the SAT 2 exam. Of course, there are tricky questions about obscure details, but my guess is that they don’t make up half as much of the test as do the more general ones…I don’t know, I’ll find out in May.</p>

<p>For the record, Lawrenceville Precalculus doesn’t cover several topics on the SAT II (no 3D and polar coordinates, vectors, hyperbolas etc.) because we did a lot of random stuff on probability density last year…but my first diagnosis test, without any extra prep, was a solid 790, and I ended up with a 800 in the real thing. And I would never claim to be a Mathniac. This proves that just because a school doesn’t teach to the test, doesn’t mean the students can’t do reasonably well on it.</p>

<p>@Periwinkle: It really doesn’t matter whether or not some student chose to skip taking the tests. The mean scores are computed from the results of those who DID. My understanding is that you’re thinking the tippy top academic performers at Andover will opt not to take the subject tests; I don’t care how much you romanticize college admissions, but these very same top performers will MOST LIKELY also be aiming for the most selective colleges, all of which REQUIRE subject tests, and pull the average to the right. Plus, most other competitive colleges today at least RECOMMEND taking subject tests, and even at WashU, a top school where the subject tests are not required, most serious applicants take them anyway to stay competitive. </p>

<p>Georgetown is currently the only school that requires 3 subject tests. And scores of applicants to one school don’t really sway the means that much. You’re also assuming that kids are either math nerds or humanities types. But those cases where someone is great at Math (800) but dreadful at History (600) are extreme, and since my own experience, boarding school students are more or less better-rounded than that. I expect the subject test scores to stay at least within 80 points of one another. Three or four extreme cases can’t really dramatically impact a mean!</p>

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<p>If the course name is US History, there are bound to be substantial overlaps between the content selected by a school’s curriculum and the content tested by the SAT. The discrepancies really don’t warrant a score as low as 600. After all, it’s a simple test of whether or not you know your stuff.</p>

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<p>MBV, magnet schools’ admission selection is purely based on test scores, so naturally one can assume as a whole they are better at standardized tests. Also, I suspect they work harder on prepping for them outside classroom. And I agree Periwinkle’s point - “PA kids can’t assume they’re brighter than the public school kids”, which is why I suggested they should work harder during the breaks to get better at standardized tests now that it’s not the case in their school that “the entire curriculum, for months, is designed to prepare them for the SAT II exam” (which is a good thing btw), IF they do believe better test scores will get them even better college admission outcomes. </p>

<p>By the way, MBV, I think it’s indeed easier to get an 800 on Math II than on UH. For the latter, too much to memorize means more time to prepare for it. </p>

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<p>I agree. That’s why 800 is a 83th percentile for Math 2. But it’s not just USHistory–Chemistry also seems to hover only just above the national average, despite Physics being well above. But what I’ve gotten out of this is that BS kids tend to be overconfident and just walk into the test room without having properly familiarized themselves with the test formats…or are bad test takers (94% average SSAT?)…or learn exotic stuff that barely overlaps with the content of the SAT II (but the SAT II only tests straightforward high school material, so arguments of “teaching beyond the AP” are not reasonable because you can’t get beyond something without knowing the basics first, e.g. all good high school chemistry courses must touch on calorimetry, thermodynamics, redox, electron configs, etc.?).</p>

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<p>Guys, it’s not all about Andover. The post was meant to share one source of measure on SAT/ACT and identify which schools score highest in the nation. Interesting how it becomes all about why Andover students aren’t in the top 25. Yes, if your kid is in a school that makes the list, you feel good. But why do we have to explain why Andover students aren’t on the list? Suffice to say there are lots of students in fantastic schools around the country, not just in NE that score well nationally. As far as why Andover kids are not on the list, I guess they are not all that afterall. And no amount of trying to explain it away makes it so. Let’s get back to fit…duh right, more parents care about scores and prestige of schools.</p>

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<p>^^Explain what? The legitimacy of a list based on “data” full of errors?</p>

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<p>@redbluegoldgreen, The thread concentrated on Andover because few high schools release their SAT II scores. </p>

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<p>But they didn’t. It’s a bogus list. I suspect that fact checking be too labor intensive (read: expensive) for the company. Had they attempted to survey the field, Lawrenceville (2095) would be listed with Exeter. I’m certain there are other schools with high SAT scores, which I haven’t heard of. </p>

<p>The whole thing is shady. They claim to base their results on survey results. There doesn’t seem to be any attempt to ascertain if a student or alum is really enrolled in a particular high school or college. It has the problem of identity verification which bedevil all online social media. </p>

<p>Poking around, the first two public high schools I looked at have Niche SAT scores about 150 points higher than the figures released by our state department of education. The state and the schools can buy reports from the College Board listing school wide results.</p>

<p>@MBVLoveless and Benley,</p>

<p>The curve for the results are set by the college board. The mean scores reported by the schools no doubt include many really high scores, and some not-so-high scores. I think schools probably should educate their students and parents about the SAT II, when’s the best time to take it, and how one should prepare. Students are often told to take the tests when they’re finished the relevant course, but not all high school classes set their standards by the SAT IIs. </p>

<p>Some high schools have started cross-disciplinary courses, which would make it very difficult to do well on the SAT IIs covering single subjects.</p>

<p>@Benley, I think the timetable of the last two years of high school make it difficult to cram for achievement tests. My kids haven’t done the whole test prep thing, but I do gather that there’s a fair amount of tutoring for the SAT which teaches kids how to handle standardized tests, when to guess, how to pace oneself, etc. A fact-based test is very different. I suspect the SAT/ACT, school grades, ECs and college application are much more important than marginally raising scores on a test which the colleges know the boarding schools don’t prep their kids for. In general, you’d expect tests of aptitude to score in the same range, but it would be very possible for an individual student to post a great score on chemistry, but a bad score on UH. As students can choose which SAT IIs they submit, there isn’t a huge pressure to Make Everything Perfect.</p>

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That’s something I haven’t thought of but would agree. Chances are students would take multiple SAT II’s and only submit the scores for the ones they have aced, which is a possible reason why there are some very low scores dragging down the average of individual SAT II’s. I also agree that when it comes to test scores, SAT I is more important than SAT II’s, especially when the student can show their knowledge and aptitude with relevant coursework and/or AP scores.</p>

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<p>“especially when the student can show their knowledge and aptitude with relevant coursework and/or AP scores.” Is this true? I have always been under the impression that grade in corresponding course >>>> sat ii > AP because technically AP scores are self-reported and are not required. It’s also harder to get a 800 on the SAT than a 5 in the AP in most subjects.</p>

<p>@Periwinkle: I agree with your point that schools should at least educate students about the SAT IIs. I didn’t even know that the Math II test corresponded to PreCalculus when I finished the course last year in May…I only discovered that from a friend in October, and rushed to take it. I also expect being aware of SAT IIs early enough to prepare adequately will help many unhooked BS students in the college process. </p>

<p>But as the MIT admission blog says, any scores above 750 are treated no differently in the eyes of the file readers. That explains why there is less pressure to make everything perfect than the SAT I. </p>

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<p>MBV, Sorry. I should’ve said it was really just my “speculation”. There’s obviously no official word from college AO’s. And, although AP scores are self-reported, my understanding is that students are supposed to submit official score reports upon matriculation to colleges.</p>

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<p>^my understanding is that they’re only supposed to submit scores if they want to (for placement credits)</p>