<p>Why is the 4 year graduation rate an abysmal 30%? Their part time students account for 13.3% of the students. That is high, but not really high enough to be an explanation for me. Anyone have any ideas?</p>
<p>One answer may lie in the 25% percent whose SAT scores fall below 1000.
Unless Towson provides extensive remedial support, many of these students will struggle and drop out.</p>
<p>Most probably many of those students will not drop out, but will take more than four years to graduate. Most schools do provide extensive remedial support, but that almost automatically means the student will take longer than four years to graduate, as remedial courses do not count toward graduation. Additionally, students with lower SATs may come from backgrounds where there is little familiarity with college, they may choose to take less than the average credits per term, they may be working extensive hours while in school, have familial obligations, etc. It would be important to know what the six year grad rate is, to see if those students are graduating or dropping out (federal guidelines allow six years of aid, so that is the number commonly used now to track grad rates).</p>
<p>Thank you for helping me to gain some insight into this. The 6 year graduation rate is 60.3%.</p>
<p>My younger son attends Towson.It may have small, intimate classes taught by professors, but It is also a hard school- period. Regardless of SATs of the students, they don't make allowances or excuses. If anything, they raise the bar as to what is expected from their students. </p>
<p>Moreover, although Towson does have some tutoring and academic help, they really aren't that good at it. I have an older son who was diagnosed with ADD . When I investigated what Towson had for learning disabled kids, I was very disappointed.</p>
<p>For what it's worth, I have found that there are many top schools today, who weren't as well known years ago. They adopted the philosophy that they want to achieve top notch status and will not make any compromises. Towson seems to be one of those that are "up and coming."</p>
<p>Taxguy, Please understand first that I think Towson is a good school, but I want to understand what is behind the low 4 year graduation rate. There are many schools with a much higher bar set for their average student to gain admission. They do not have such a low 4 year graduation rate. Having such a low grad rate IMHO does not make for a better university. It raises red flags for me. It may be that not cracking the 1000 sat score means that there are remedial classes going on and that is why it is low. I do not know. It may mean other problems; I just do not know. IMO, a school that would not help a student who has a weakness in an area of study, does not show strength in a school. I can understand not allowing for wiggle room as far as courses one must pass.</p>
<p>maybe it is not that off the mark when compared to other state schools. I just picked 3 arbitrary schools and came up with:</p>
<p>University of Colorado- 4year-36% 6yr.-66%l
university of Arizona-4 year-31% 6 yr.-57%
suny oneonta- 4 year 34% 6 year- 49%</p>
<p>but then there are higher 4 and 6 year graduation rates at other state schools</p>
<p>I think there are a lot of factors that justify low 6 year graduation rates. Lower quality admitted students clearly can be a factor as can school toughness. Maybe in some schools ( which I don't think is a problem at Towson), there is very little to do in the area. RIT is a school such as that.</p>
<p>I think that you will be seeing Towson's 6 year graduation rate slowly climb since they are getting tougher to get admitted to each year. Better students should correlate with higher graduation rates. However, I do think that Northeastermom has a good point. If some of the lessor known state school graduation rates were analyzed, they would also have lower graduation rates than that found at the more well known schools. State schools also have to admit transfers from junior colleges. Thus, they would seem to be more prone to flunk kids out than that of their private school counterparts. I don't have actual stats on this, but it does make sense. Maybe Xiggi can dig up stats flunk out rates at lessor known state schools vs. private schools and top schools.</p>
<p>Other reasons for low graduation rates include students not being able to get into classes, especially pre-requisites needed for graduation. In addition one of the biggest reasons that many students drop out or do not finish on time because of money. As undergrads they are limited in the amount of subsidized loans they can take and as a public school they are probably very limited as to the amount of grant/scholarship aid they provide.</p>
<p>I do not think RIT has a student retention problem or 4-year graduation problem that can be explained by "nothing to do in the area." (Which is not really true anyway - especially when compared to many other schools.) I think it is that they are accepting kids at the slightly lower end of the engineering applicant spectrum and, well, engineering is HARD no matter where you take it. So, perhaps more of their students struggle.</p>
<p>Taxguy, Has your son had any trouble getting into his required courses at Towson? I know he is the honors program, so do non-honors students have trouble gettting required courses at Towson?</p>
<p>Being in the honors program, he didn't have any trouble getting the courses that he wanted. Also,if you are in the honors program, you are generally in the honors dorms ,and you associate with honors kids. Thus, most of his friends didn't have trouble getting their course needs met either. I can't speak for non-honors kids. However,based on the few kids that were on my son's team ( ultimate frisbee) and not in the honors program, it would seem that they didn't have any trouble getting their course needs met. I wouldn't consider this, however, a valid statistical survey.</p>
<p>In addition, freshmen generally take different courses from the upperclassmen. Thus, I don't think that freshmen would have too much trouble finding courses that they need and want. I think that the problem starts hiting, if at all, in the sophomore year and above.</p>
<p>Does one apply seperately for the honors program or are they automatically considered based on application?</p>
<p>Actually a 30% 4 year graduation rate is about standard for public universities across the country. As Sybbie notes, there are many factors in public colleges that can influence this --- make sure to also check 6 year grad rates, as I think those a more realistic way to take into account things like students having to work to pay for school, difficulty getting classes, etc.</p>
<p>Of the 2 kids we know going to Towson, one seems to be doing ok and the other came home (transferred) after her 2nd yr. Said she "wasn't feeling it socially" whatever the heck that means. I think she was also unhappy with whatever housing she had. Maybe she was more inclined to come home regardless of the school itself. Many kids we know that were uneasy with being away from home chose state schools and then came home often on weekends. Sort of sets them up for disaster in my opinion.</p>
<p>RIT loses alot of kids due to the intensity of the programs (not just engineering but CS and the design school kids too). I've heard housing really opens up throughout the year as kids drop out, finding the workload more than they bargained for. I know my d has 17 credits this qtr (7 classes) including a 3 hr computer class at night - and that's standard for a design major. She wanted to take a phys ed class just for fun but is afraid to take on anymore. She hears about friends at other schools taking 4 classes a semester and having one or two days off and she just groans. Then there are the kids at trimester schools that just take 3 classes at a time.</p>
<p>Northeastmom, frankly, I don't remember. If I were you, if your child is close to meeting or meets the listed requirements, you should send them a letter requesting honors program admission. I should note that EVERYONE in the program gets money. It ranges depending on SATs between $1,000 and full tuition. However, be advised, staying in the program is very hard. You need to graduate with at least a 3.5 average to stay in the program. I think you need 3.25 by end of freshmen year and 3.4 by end of sophomore year or they put you on probation from the program.</p>
<p>Northeastmom, I just asked my wife , and she told me that my son was invited to honors without our applying. I still don't think that a letter would do any harm.</p>
<p>northeasternmom,
my d was invited to honors also but I think there may have been a next step (my d didn't follow up because she decided to go elsewhere). I believe we were told that everyone has to fill out the honors application, including essay. I could be mixing up Towson and UDel about the application, though because she never filled one out and she was offered $ (I think it was $6000 - we're oos).</p>
<p>We're oos? What does that mean?</p>
<p>OOS= out of state</p>