UC Berkeley and the Future California Governor

Colleges and Universities A-Z University of California - Berkeley
1

<p>Lets talk about education and how the different potential governors of California would potentially affect the UC system, the CA public school system (a major path to the UC system), and perhaps also the possible changes to California community colleges and Cal States system. Who do you think would imrpove life for the education in California and in which ways would they do this, especially UC Berkeley? </p>

<p>PS. Please do not turn this into an idiotic bashing of any candidate or idea. :)</p>

2

<p>he deleted...</p>

3

<p>I love how Arnold was a product of the community college system!</p>

<p>
[quote]
PS. Please do not turn this into an idiotic bashing of any candidate or idea. :)

[/quote]

Oops. Sorry, you can blame me for instigating.</p>

4

<p>Democrats always win on education.</p>

<p>Phil Angelides' comprehensive plan for increasing educational opportunities is the way to go. Tuition will be lowered across the board.</p>

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<p>Yeah, but Angelides is a dumbass who would like to increase business taxes. This guy needs a good whacking of neoliberalism into his minute Bruin head. Hell, I voted for Westly in the primary (even though he went to Stanfurd).</p>

6

<p>in 20 years the UC system will turn private....mark my words</p>

7

<p>I don't think Angelides cares too much about improving the UCs. I think he just wants to stuff more students into them. I would have preferred Westly.</p>

<p>Hey, I wonder where Allorion is?</p>

8

<p>The preference for Westly is kind of ridiculous. They both had similar ideas about education, although Westly advocated making community college free, while Angelides wants a reduction to pre-Schwarzenegger levels. Also Angelides was stronger when it comes to lowering tuition and trying to really build up the system.</p>

<p>Stryker, increasing taxes on the rich is not the same as taxing business. Angelides would close the wasteful corporate tax loopholes. Taxes on millionaires would lead to amazing improvements in our education system. I don't think his views lead to labeling him a "dumbass who would like to increase business taxes." Congrats, also, on violating the principles DRab outlined with amazing haste.</p>

<p>Frankly, if you are like many of the ridiculous people on this board who seem not to care much at all for public education, for the less fortunate, for increasing opportunity (but instead stand for decreasing it) then I encourage you to vote for Arnold--he's a candidate that is more in line with your views. If you believe in the principles a quality university education should provide you with, you should vote for Angelides.</p>

9

<p>I suppose I'll play devil's advocate.</p>

<p>Before Arnold was even prominent in the political arena he's taken an active roll in childhood education. As a strong advocate of after school programs pre-governorship Arnold has continued his legacy of strong leadership in the areas of secondary and primary education. As we all know the quality of California's high schools and junior highs play a direct role in the competitiveness of UC admits against the national, even world, standard.</p>

<p>We can see this education emphasis in the recent special election. Specifically we saw Proposition 74 which would increase the time it takes for educators to gain tenure. It was a reasonable proposal that would hold our public secondary teachers to the same standards we hold university professors throughout California. </p>

<p>Also Schwarzenegger supports a limited school voucher program. A step away from the outlandish Republican proposals, this new voucher system would be offered only by schools that are strapped for cash or cannot handle the influx of more students.</p>

<p>Finally, in January Arnold proposed a budget that increases k-12 funds by 1.2 billion WITHOUT increasing taxes.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.ontheissues.org/Governor/Arnold_Schwarzenegger_Education.htm%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.ontheissues.org/Governor/Arnold_Schwarzenegger_Education.htm&lt;/a>
<a href="http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:-gRlqXOYwJcJ:sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi%3Ffile%3D/c/a/2005/11/09/MNG6IFLAMF1.DTL+proposition+arnold+schwarzenegger+special+election&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:-gRlqXOYwJcJ:sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi%3Ffile%3D/c/a/2005/11/09/MNG6IFLAMF1.DTL+proposition+arnold+schwarzenegger+special+election&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1&lt;/a>
<a href="http://www.ktvu.com/station/4068232/detail.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.ktvu.com/station/4068232/detail.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>
[quote]
We can see this education emphasis in the recent special election. Specifically we saw Proposition 74 which would increase the time it takes for educators to gain tenure. It was a reasonable proposal that would hold our public secondary teachers to the same standards we hold university professors throughout California.

[/quote]

It was a horrible, completely unreasonable, harmful proposal that was part of a wasteful, useless special election that the vast majority Californians utterly rejected. It would have resulted in fewer qualified people wanting to become teachers.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Also Schwarzenegger supports a limited school voucher program. A step away from the outlandish Republican proposals, this new voucher system would be offered only by schools that are strapped for cash or cannot handle the influx of more students.

[/quote]

Vouchers are antithetical to the purpose of public education and the attempt to improve public education. They are mostly supported by those who believe private education is inherently better than public. I don't see why "this new voucher system" would be different than any other proposal. If there's a cash-strapped school the answer is alleviating that problem directly, providing the school with more funds, not sending all the kids off (and public money) to private schools.</p>

<p>Arnold has finally made concessions to education after quickly amassing one of the worst records on education one could possibly imagine. He had to do something given his horrible poll numbers, especially on the education issue. It will be a huge issue this November that Democrats will place a great emphasis on, knowing it is unquestionably a big winner for them.</p>

11

<p>Is Angelides still advocating an increase in higher education by 20% and a decrease in tuition to pre-budget crisis levels (adjusted for inflation)? Would this entail making Berkeley have 20% more students than it currently has, or only 5 or so %?? What other things does he plan to do with regards to education?</p>

<p>g1a2b3e, I think much of California (and much of America) "rejects" (or I think is too lazy or apathetic to vote) in many cases, and I don't know if they specifically "rejected" that particular election.</p>

<p>Citan, the system as a whole turning private would be remarkable and unlikely. Who knows, maybe it will happen, but it's far more likely one school will do so, if any do, and that's pretty unlikely as it is.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Is Angelides still advocating an increase in higher education by 20% and a decrease in tuition to pre-budget crisis levels (adjusted for inflation)? Would this entail making Berkeley have 20% more students than it currently has, or only 5 or so %?? What other things does he plan to do with regards to education?

[/quote]

From his website:</p>

<p>"Phil Angelides will work with our state's higher education leaders, as Governors like Earl Warren and Pat Brown did a half century ago, to plan this expansion of higher education, including finding ways to make our universities and colleges more efficient and more technologically advanced, so that taxpayers get their full money's worth from the public investment in higher education."</p>

<p>You need to keep in mind that the increase is across the system of higher education (not just UC). You also should keep in mind that the demand for spaces in college is going to continue to increase in the years ahead; further, WE NEED more CA college grads--that's part of the point, for business, etc. Public education is about educating as many citizens as possible for the benefit of society as a whole.</p>

<p>
[quote]
g1a2b3e, I think much of California (and much of America) "rejects" (or I think is too lazy or apathetic to vote) in many cases, and I don't know if they specifically "rejected" that particular election.

[/quote]

I was merely restating what almost every commentator has already said about the special election, pundits on both sides. Even Arnold quickly admitted that the voters had rejected the special election and that he had made a mistake. Voters may have reacted differently to a special election that contained measures that they actually would like to vote on, measures that had real solutions for real issues of concern to them. The measures in the election, however, were typical Republican fare that simply did not reflect the issues of California's voters.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Citan, the system as a whole turning private would be remarkable and unlikely. Who knows, maybe it will happen, but it's far more likely one school will do so, if any do, and that's pretty unlikely as it is.

[/quote]

As long as California stays liberal that will never happen. It would be possible if there was a huge earthquake and millions of Californians migrated elsewhere and there were huge population shifts. Even then the chance would be minute.</p>

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<p>"You also should keep in mind that the demand for spaces in college is going to continue to increase in the years ahead; further, WE NEED more CA college grads--that's part of the point, for business, etc. Public education is about educating as many citizens as possible for the benefit of society as a whole."</p>

<p>While we do need MORE college grads because of the increase in population, we DONT need a higher percentage of high school students getting accepted to college! Right now the UC's want the top 12.5%, whether the population is 1 or 1 billion the UC's want only the top 12.5%. Thus as the population increases there will be more college students, but not a higher percentage of college students.</p>

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<p>The point is that the 12.5 percent number is outdated, as is the CSU number.</p>

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<p>What's the current master plan say, that the UC should select from the top 10% of the public school students in the state?</p>

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<p>The Master plan states that the UC's mission is to enroll the top 1/8 (12.5%) or California's high school graduates.</p>

<p>Gabe, in what way is this number outdated? I think if the top 1/8 of CA high school students go on to the UC's, while the top 1/3 go to CSU, then we're in good shape. The Regents of the University of California thought that it was best for the top 1/8 of our population to be able to get a UC degree, so what has changed that makes this so outdated?</p>

17

<p>
[quote]
The Regents of the University of California thought that it was best for the top 1/8 of our population to be able to get a UC degree, so what has changed that makes this so outdated?

[/quote]

The economy has changed drastically. The old percentages don't cut it anymore; they were produced in and for a different era.</p>

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<p>Does anyone know if the percentage of 12.5% has been changed? I heard somewhere that the UCs don't have enough space to hold all the qualified candidates i.e. the top 12.5% anymore.</p>

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<p>No one really has to say it; either we build more UCs (Merced) or lower the quota, the larger and larger enrollments of the UCs today, along with skyrocketing UC tuitions say it all.</p>

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<p>"The point is that the 12.5 percent number is outdated, as is the CSU number."</p>

<p>The CSU system is <em>not</em> even at full capacity according to one of the articles I've read not so long ago. g1a2b3e, your response to why the system is outdated is simply the generic response of what Phil Angelides said. Keep in mind I'm not attacking what you are saying but Phil Angelides' stance on higher education.</p>

<p>"Angelides would close the wasteful corporate tax loopholes. "</p>

<p>Soundbite.</p>

<p>As for increasing enrollment of the UC by 20%: the top UCs are already overcrowded. The quality of the UC education is going down as more students enroll at each UC. Campus resources are being shared by more and more students, class sizes are getting bigger and bigger.</p>

<p>His platform certainly "sounds good", and probably the best way to win the support of the greater public. But increasing the enrollment of the UC will decrease the quality of the UC students and education received.</p>