I am wondering why Illinois seems to have such a mediocre reputation in my suburb of Chicago. I am a parent and have had friends tell me that they wouldn’t even let their kids apply there. Meanwhile, their children went on to attend MSU, Minnesota and Iowa–schools which I think are less selective. Some honestly believe that UIUC is too much of a party school or too expensive when they are most likely paying more as an out-of-state student. What is going on?
It depends on the program. In my area, Grainger and Geis are very highly regarded, and the other colleges are considered “respectable”. UI-Carbondale is the one with the mediocre reputation, but that is a flagship-directional comparison, and may not be entirely fair.
I think the “party school” rep has to do with the sheer size of the college. It is enormous, and one is bound to find all types there.
A few years ago there was concern about funding at the state level, but this has mostly been resolved. Plus, the UI system (C/U, UIC, Springfield) was never at risk like the other state schools that operate under a different entity with separate endowments and budgets.
As for academics, overall I suspect only Northwestern and Michigan are significantly higher ranked in the Big 10, and it is pretty similar to Wisconsin in most ratings and Purdue in some (like Engineering). The problem is that it can be expensive compared to schools like MN, IA, MSU, IU and Purdue as sometimes they offer merit and other scholarships that can make them similar in price or even less expensive in some cases for top students. Other state flagships like Nebraska or Arkansas can be considerably cheaper, especially for out of state tuition.
In the upper midwest in general, MI, NU, WI plus U Chicago, ND and maybe one or two others are similar or higher overall in academics and selectivity. There are obviously exceptions, for example, some engineering and business majors in particular at UIUC are top 10 in the nation, while others may not be as high as schools you mentioned. My daughter chose Minnesota over Illinois because she liked a specific biology major there better. My son chose UIUC for the highly regarded physics program.
I don’t think it’s known as a party school like it used to be, I think Wisconsin may now have that crown?
I agree with the two posters #1 and #2 and in the process of choosing a college. Both Illinois and Minnesota are in the mix. We are in suburban Chicago and never heard about the partying at UIUC. Been to Wisconsin and can vouch for the partying there. I have the theory that the OP’s parent friends kids dont have the numbers to get in UIUC. Iowa is way easier to get in because its only a formula. Also it not diffcult to get in state tuition there. MSU appears to be easier to get into to. As the first poster mentioned engineering and business are difficult to get into. My daughter got into Minn being a Liberal Arts major and should get into UIUC though it appears slightly more difficult than Minn.
UIUC is an excellent school, and my daughter has applied there.
I think this is such a good topic. We are in the suburbs of Chicago and I’ve thought the same thing.
My son is a pretty high achieving student (4.0GPA 1540SAT) and will be going for engineering. He spent 2 weeks of Engineering summer camps over the last few years on campus at Illinois. At the end of the day he just didn’t like the campus and didn’t feel at home there. He didn’t even apply. We have visited Neb, NU, Wisc, Purdue and Minn and he ranked Illinois campus last (I agree). I know you don’t pick a school just based on that, but you have to be happy if you are going to be there for 4 years.
I don’t know if its perception or reality, but there isn’t a lot of merit money at Illinois (because our state doesn’t have money). I would assume that we would be paying full tuition, room and board there ($36K). A number of schools my son applied to out of state are roughly 25%-50% less than that due to merit awards. Other schools are using the lack of funds to aggressively recruit upper tier students out of Illinois. And financially it makes a lot sense to families.
That’s just my two cents. If my son changed his mind tomorrow and wanted to go to Illinois I’d be in favor of it though because its engineering school is excellent.
The merit situation is definitely not generous at UIUC. It’s not because of state finances, necessarily, as the U of I system is pretty flush with funds. Just look at all the beautiful new buildings and renovations and other projects. Campus may not be beautiful in terms of countryside, scenery or urban location, but it is pretty well maintained and updated. Top programs like EE/CompE and Mech E have or will have essentially brand new facilities, while CS and BioE have relatively modern buildings too.
My son received engineering merit each year, but relatively smaller amounts than others we know with worse academic records. I agree that they probably don’t offer as much merit as some state flagship or Big Ten schools and what they do give doesn’t seem to be awarded objectively based on academics like others. Depending on which engineering major, Purdue may well be similarly rated and possibly less money if they award a top non-resident merit scholarship, though honestly I don’t find that campus any more interesting than UIUC.
I would be interested to know when merit awards are issued as to which of the schools you mentioned end up being 25% to 50% less than in-state UIUC TCA for the first year, let alone future years when UIUC tuition and housing is capped while others can increase 5% or more each year. Nebraska I know can be quite inexpensive, but it’s also not in the same tier for Engineering. If he is earning that large of a non-resident merit award at schools like Purdue or Wisconsin or Minnesota or NU, I’d guess that he should be awarded at least a modest academic scholarship at UIUC as well.
All good points and right on the buildings. It just wasn’t a fit for my son. Getting all the aps done was stressful on him, so I didn’t force him into Applying to Illinois.
I think that is an excellent point about the tuition increases per year. Probably something I have to build into my spreadsheet.
Just approximate net costs based on where he applied and merit aid he got:
Nebraska - $20K
Iowa State - $21K
Arizona - $15K
ASU - $27K
Michigan St - $20k
Purdue, Minn - Still waiting, but probably not much less than Ill
Didn’t apply at Wisconsin or NU, but would not expect much if any merit there.
A couple years ago our high school had a breakdown on what and where kids were going after high school. Our school graduating class was about 500 in 2018. The CC had the most kids. UIUC had 65 kids. There is a perception, at least with my daughter, that you are going to see some of the same people. Some will like that others won’t.
An observation I had about Illinois compared to schools like UW, UMN-TC, and NU is that those schools are part of Madison, Minneapolis and Chicago. UIUC is Champaign.
Iowa State is a relative bargain for Engineering for sure, we know a number of people there. Those are great awards for Arizona and MSU, if either of my kids had applied there I might have made them accept at that cost;-) Congrats to your son, he has a number of excellent options!
My son would have essentially gone for free at Alabama with their academic scholarship metric, but he had no interest. My daughter would have paid much less with her major and merit awards at UIUC, but liked Minnesota a lot more. Thankfully they also offered good merit scholarships to make it affordable.
I agree with @Nicki20. We are also in the Chicago suburbs and kids go to a highly ranked large public school. I think S19’s class had 730 kids. Many kids do go to Illinois but it does seem like many of them aren’t happy about it.
Champaign is in the middle of nowhere. Many kids don’t want to go to school with a bunch of kids from their high school or to a school where they will meet mostly kids from Illinois. Sports teams aren’t good. We’ve heard the food is really bad. To these (sometimes entitled) kids, Illinois isn’t what they pictured for college. Many are flocking to places like Boulder.
A few kids who want comp sci or engineering are happy to have been accepted but, even for most of them, Illinois was a safety school. It’s more like, “yeah ok, I guess I’ll go to Illinois”. These kids obviously have good stats as those are not easy admits. Most of them applied to private universities and are most likely only going to Illinois when they didn’t get into Duke, Northwestern, etc. Some of them are going to Illinois because their parents won’t pay for Michigan even though the student got in.
Kids who want business have been preferring Indiana. Doesn’t seem that hard to get into Kelley. Bloomington is beautiful compared to Champaign. Wisconsin is seen as “harder to get into” than Illinois for arts and science majors and, therefore, comes with more prestige for the student. Kids like saying they go to Wisconsin. That campus is also better than Illinois’ campus - beautiful with the lakes and more hopping because it’s the state capital. As for Iowa, Iowa State, Oklahoma, etc., they are easier to get into that Illinois and seen as more adventurous anyway since the student is leaving the state. Kids who can’t get into Illinois and want a big school like those schools.
So, really, who goes to Illinois? From our high school, it’s mostly comp science or engineering majors or maybe legacies whose parents have tried to show them the ropes and gotten them excited about it. They also have to be kids who want big rural campus. Not all kids want that. I know some parents whose kids got into other Big Ten business schools but, in the end, told the kids that they are going to Illinois because it’s less expensive (in that case it was a better price than Michigan, Indiana, and Minnesota).
Most kids we know there are happy enough. Seems like they are pleasantly surprised and make it work. They are all bright kids who are making the most of it. That message never seems to make it back to the high school, though, and the trend continues that Illinois is not a first choice for most kids.
@homerdog What you say is more or less true today like it was 35 years ago. UIUC isn’t a destination for a beautiful campus. Sure it’s nice enough with a classic Quad of old buildings and such, but outside of campus and maybe downtown Champaign there just isn’t much to lure kids over many other campuses. You usually go because its the only top-10 rated major you can afford, because you are in state and it’s the least expensive top tier public university that admitted you or because you want to go where most of your friends are going. In my case it was all of the above. That may be true for my son, too, I don’t know, but he was very objective. For possibly selfish reasons I’m glad he will graduate with no debt rather than having gone out of state to a private U or pricey west coast state flagship where he would have debt to graduate, possibly even from a lower rated program, and likely more difficult and expensive to visit. But the campus would certainly be more interesting;-)
Even as an alum, most other campuses I saw on road trips or during campus visits for my kids were nicer than UIUC. Minnesota is every bit as nice as UIUC and has a great urban feel that many kids like my daughter prefer. Plus easy airport access makes it almost as easy as driving to UIUC.
I will say that I know it is a first choice for a lot of kids. Maybe not privileged suburban high-performing academic students whose families can afford to entertain nicer options, but I’m sure a lot of other Illinois residents have it as a top choice above other Illinois public schools and regional colleges that would be a distant second best for them. And it is a solid school with a nice campus.
Ironically I just talked to my BIL tonight. We have a 24 rotation watching my MIL. Thanksgiving came up and he mentioned his 2014 UIUC grad was going to South America with college friends that week. She keeps in touch with them and high school friends some who are in both groups. She went to a North Shore where kids could of went anywhere. I learned, while he’s a nice guy, to tread lightly discussing UIUC.
Such an interesting thread! I’ve always wondered why everyone around here seems to apply to Michigan, Wisconsin and Indiana, but leaves out UIUC. S20 did apply, and would be happy to go there, but he is one of the few from his high school to apply
I also think that it’s a mix of a very boring sort of area, and lack of merit money.
I also think that there is some circular reasoning, because the number of applicants is pretty much steady, the acceptance rate for non-engineering majors is relatively high. This creates the impression that it’s not selective, which affects the applications, etc.
Many of the smart kids in Illinois look at it as their safety, which means that they will not attend if they are accepted elsewhere. Having a college regularly considered a safety does dim its luster quite a bit.
It was considered the safety for most of the smarter kids in my daughter’s class (also suburb of Chicago), and regularly about 1/4 of the class applies, about 70% are accepted, and about a third of those end up attending. It regularly has the second largest attendance from my kid’s HS (the largest is the local CC which about the 1/8 of the class attend, usually before transferring to UIC for junior and senior years, mostly to save money).
Hi Wolfie!
Hate to be harsh to us parents but it is simply based on an emtotional decision and not fact based.
In terms of engineering and cs many outside of our county consider it among the finest schools in the world. In terms of business, my usual focus, it’s really a top flagship. In fact, uiuc is ranked number one in accounting nationally by usnwr. That’s all schools.
It comes down to bumper stickers and wanting our children to be seen as special. Not necessarily in any conscious way, but it’s my opinion.
Because I am victim to it myself.
Because it doesn’t feel special enough for our particular child. Too many others in the neighborhood going and my progeny deserves better. It’s human emotion and pride, the bad kind.
It also includes feedback from our kids. They worked too hard to go to the same school as classmates a step function beneath them in perceived school rankings, academically.
It also based on information we obtained 20 and 30 years ago when we were looking ourselves. Times have changed but certain myths are hard wired into our psyches. .
We live in Chicago but I practice in the western suburbs. The choices of schools is different. I don’t know any families applying to Iowa /Iowa State or Minnesota or Alabama. In the burbs it’s very common.
3 years ago my sons school was the top ranked school. They are all told to at least apply to Illinois since it’s like an automatic guarantee. Something like 85 % are accepted (don’t have the actual number but it’s high) so yes it’s looked upon as a safety. Also besides engineering it is not that hard to get into for these kids. For my son he wanted the entire student body to have more selectivity. He actually wrote about this in one of his Michigan essays. Michigan also gave financial aid and UIUC gave no merit or aid. Michigan was ranked 2nd in his engineering field of interest and like almost everything is ranked in the top 10.
Sports… Well enough said.
As far as Michigan State honors merit my son got this. It would of been something like $30, 000 for oos with research guarantees Study abroad stipend. Mentor ship with a professor and some other stuff.
Even like Rose Hulman would of been less expensive with half merit.
Over all he liked the campus experience better at Michigan.
As an Illinois alum. but current resident of Wisconsin, I find this thread interesting. We toured Illinois when looking for schools for my daughter last year since it’s a great engineering school and not TOO far from home. She actually liked it a LOT more than she expected. She likes the classic quad sort of campus and liked the Green Street area right next to campus. It was also a gorgeous spring day, sort of the perfect weather for a college tour.
Funny enough, she was very uninterested in Madison. I think she felt like many of you have mentioned your kids feeling about Illinois. She did not want to go to where “everyone” from her high school goes. For some kids here Madison is their dream school, especially if that’s where their parents went. But, for many it ends up being their safety or where they end up when they realize it’s significantly more affordable than the out-of-state options. Minnesota is a huge draw for Wisconsin kids too since we have reciprocity and then the kids feel like they are getting away.
@PrdMomto1 That is a good point. I suspect almost every public state flagship is a dream school for many in that state, just as UIUC in regard to reputation for many HS students in Illinois. Sure, other than a handful of majors at UIUC that are nationally recognized, it is a safety for a lot of high performing seniors as it was for my kids. But a lot of kids aren’t in the top percentiles of a college prep suburban or magnet high school and most can’t afford non-resident tuition at an out-of-state flagship or private university without a major scholarship. For many students, UIUC has a very good reputation in Illinois and may indeed be their dream school, much as it may be for kids in Computer Science, Physics, Accounting, Civil Engineering and some other top-10 majors.
Really, unless you live in California, Michigan, Virginia or maybe a few other states, it’s a similar situation academically to UIUC as the state flagship in Illinois. If you can get into and afford an Ivy League, Stanford, MIT, Chicago, NU, Duke, Michigan, Berkeley, Virginia, or other top 25 university or LAC, then of course those are your dream and reach schools. Otherwise that state flagship often looks a lot better in terms of reputation than most other in-state and regional colleges where you may be accepted. The major drawback UIUC has compared to many similarly ranked universities is that it’s rural, flat farm country.
@privatebanker You have a point. Also, my wife and i spent 7 years down there for grad school. So while we think that the college is great, we still have a feeling of “I just want to leave this place” which permeates every thought we have about UIUC.
Of course, there was always a very large chance that our daughter would have attended, since my wife works for the system, so we would have paid only 1/2 of the in-state tuition, and we know very many people who work there, most who also have known our daughter since she was born.
There are advantages having your child attend a college at which many faculty and staff have known her since she was a baby…