UMKC 6-year BS/MD Program

@Asoles111, you are not at any disadvantage. It’s a natural part of the college admissions process to have a waitlist. There are x number of student spots, y number of interview slots. If someone is given an interview and turns it down they still have to fill that spot, so it goes to the person who is at the top of the numbered waitlist and working their way down. Same when you apply for residency, in terms of a waitlist, etc. You are treated like everyone else, and yes, in this thread even, there are people who were on the waitlist and made it into the program after being given the chance to interview. So for all intents and purposes, you are on a clean footing with everyone else who received an interview back in December. You won’t be docked points in the process because you were on the waitlist at one time. It’s not a punitive thing.

I would not shadow at all at this point. Your application has already been processed. You wouldn’t gain anything on the admissions front, although you might gain in terms of knowing whether becoming a physician (vs. some other type of healthcare professional) is truly right for you. You can see the previous posts in the thread that I’ve written regarding the interview which is now in MMI format and not the traditional interview format.

I don’t think just “prestige” by itself is a problem, in terms of name for UMKC - I think that gets confused on this thread a lot by those who rush to defend, as if we’re comparing UMKC to Harvard (none of us are doing that and it’s a very extreme comparison at that). What kind of goes with so-called “prestige” is more high-powered institutions with networking, opportunities to meet big academic people in specialties who can write you great letters, research opportunities available on site that help when it comes to top-tier programs as a well as strong middle tier programs, etc. It’s more an issue of opportunities and resources available at that institution when it comes to helping students in the residency match. There are many great, well-funded (thus low student tuition), state public medical schools across the nation that have wonderful opportunities for their medical students to expand their CVs to do very well in the residency match. UMKC doesn’t really fit into this category for several reasons which have been previously discussed.

But you are correct, it very much depends on what your specialty goals are, keeping in mind that this is very likely to change by the time you graduate from medical school. If you’re interested in a surgical subspecialty like Pediatric Surgery (which is a fellowship after General Surgery), then yes, you would be at a disadvantage coming from UMKC whose strength isn’t in surgery and doesn’t have many residencies/fellowships in surgical specialties. Pediatric Surgery is a very competitive subspecialty fellowship and is with Children’s Mercy Hospital. For Anesthesiology, you would be ok, as UMKC does have an Anesthesiology department, although not really a strong one by itself. But for the purposes of matching into Anesthesiology as a med student, you should be fine.

@Roentgen Thank you so much! It’s a huge relief to know that I’m still considered equally as those who were offered an interview immediately. I really like UMKC in general like the campus and just the general vibe I felt when I visited. I assume you were or are in the program, so do you know how difficult it would be to participate in activities at the college? I was hoping to join the dance team and maybe a sorority but that’s the extent of what I have looked into since anything that travels is out of the question.

Since I’m aiming to go into surgery should I shy away from the 6 year then? Or take my chances since it’s likely my preferences will change? And if I don’t get into the program would UMKC be considered a good college for the traditional 8 years? Or would I be better off going somewhere like Mizzou or Saint Louis University?

@asoles111 I agree with Roentgen, I also see no negative for you to interview.

What you seem to be questioning is, “If it is worth the trip to go and interview?” You do not sound like local KC area, so that may be your concern, or your parents’ concern.

I am out of state, far out of state, round trip flights for my father and me, several days hotel, rental car, airpost parking, ouch it cost over $1,250, and that is much more than we could afford! I understand you, I hear you, and I wondered if I should even try when it seemed impossible for me to find the money. But, I had to try, I told my dad that I would do my best and that if we went and later could not accept, at least I would know I was good enough to get in. My dad gave me my dream, he is a kind man, and I am so blessed. I hope you are equally blessed, You have a chance to become a MD!!! If that is what matter to you, if that is what drives you, what makes your heart pound, then go and interview!

Do not raise straw men arguments like prestige to retionalize against going., you will later see through them, Simply be honest, do you want to interview? They would not invite you if you did not have a chance! There is nothing wrong with saying no, but say no for the correct reason - but not because you think you do not have a chance or that the medical school is not good enough. Maybe you got a better offer, maybe you want to be a teacher instead, there are plenty of reasons. But, UMKC thinks you have a better chance than you do, so look in the mirror and tell the guy you see that you have faith in yourself!!!

Re shadowing? Nerves, just relax! UMKC does not care! The selection committee will not know about any new shadowing! You want to look better, improve your application, but why? You have already been given an interview, you won that battle! Anything you deo now - activites, grades, win a Noble prize, the Selection Committee will not take into consideration or even read! Well, perhaps a Noble Prize, but short of that, nope! Relax and be proud of yourself, slap your back and tell yourself how well you did, Then go and get acceped - you can do it, have fait if yourself Asoles111

PS @asoles111 if you feel you must interview practice out of friendship with your principle then fine, but unless he is giving you MMI questions, you are totally wasting your time. This is not SLU, this is UMKC School of Medicine, and it is very different. Just relax and follow Roentgen’s wise advice!

@Asoles111, no problem! Glad to clear that up. So over the years, at least since I’ve graduated, which wasn’t too long ago, it looks like BA/MD students have been able to participate more and more in ECs on the main Volker campus, although it definitely will not be to the extent that regular undergraduate students are able to (in theory), unfortunately. This is mainly just due to the structure of the curriculum and the time commitment with the BA/MD program. This kind of alludes to my point about not having the typical college experience. UMKC fraternities and sororities have always had some level of medical student participation (which waxes and wanes depending on the year, in terms of how many total people in the class actually end up doing it and sticking with it – trust me you’ll figure out very quickly whether you will like it or not, as they recruit in the fall). I believe there are BA/MD students who participate in the dance team as well.

So I think it really depends. How committed are you to surgery? That’s really hard to know at 18, quite honestly, when most people are deciding whether to do medicine in the first place. The unvarnished truth is that UMKC’s strength is not in surgery or the surgical subspecialties, and it definitely plays second fiddle to Internal Medicine in terms of the overall UMKC culture and curriculum. Your preferences will change, but a change from a surgical specialty vs. a non-surgical specialty is big. All specialties are divided into so-called medical (non-surgical) specialties and surgical specialties. Your other interest of Anesthesiology (my field FTW!), is a non-surgical specialty (obviously). Just so you know, UMKC BA/MD students do not dissect in the Human Structure Function course to learn Anatomy. They view prosections. This is a little frowned upon by the Surgery dept. when it comes to our Anatomy knowledge, but it’s not really in their hands in terms of our anatomical curriculum.

If you were to go the traditional route, you would be much better off to go to Mizzou (USWNR rank #103) or SLU (USWNR rank #96), so not a huge difference in terms of reputation between the two, but quite different in terms of cost. Although SLU does have its Med Scholars program, which is an 8 year Bachelor/MD program. If you decide to do the traditional route, I would absolutely NOT do your 4 years of undergraduate work at UMKC. Most BA/MD students, including even those from KC, would not be at UMKC if there wasn’t a combined Bachelor/MD program. Even the traditional premeds that are at UMKC, their first choice in terms of allopathic med schools is not UMKC.

Ha! I’m blushing @OmniaMed! Thank you for taking the time to give your contribution to the thread for future UMKC high school applicants as well, I really wish many more UMKC med students throughout Years 1 - 6 would come back after they’ve gotten into the program to give their admissions tips, advice on the program, viewpoints and perspective on how things have changed, positives, negatives, what they wish they had known, etc. as they progress. A man can always dream, I guess. I-)

Thanks guys! @Roentgen @OmniaMed

This helps a ton! I will be giving practice questions from MMI structure to my interviewer so I’m just a little prepared and not blindsided.

But as for what I want to do. I really like the idea of surgery because it interests me. I like watching videos and learning about the body systems. But mostly I really want to be involved with my the patients and hands on. Does anesthesiology offer that opportunity? What about genetics? These are really the only fields I’ve looked into.

@Asoles111, well in terms of being involved with your patients, I would say surgery probably doesn’t have a monopoly on that, in terms of hands on, that would probably describe most procedural specialties, not just surgery. Anesthesiology can definitely have both of those things esp. as it has a variety of subspecialties. In all honesty, for most med students, the time commitment that surgery and their surgical subspecialties have in terms of residency training is the usual deal breaker for most people, even with the most genuine of interests. There is a residency called “Medical Genetics” but there are very few programs total in the nation. I don’t really know the job market demand for medical geneticists, however.

For interview practice, I think an easy way is to role play and constantly practice with your parents!! They’ll be able to “act” well in terms of interviewer demeanor and asking you interview questions. It’s good practice for getting in interview game mode, calming those nerves, and formulating your thoughts cohesively, as well as getting any annoying habits under control.

Traditional Interview Questions

As I’ve mentioned before, there will be some MMI stations that will tend to feel more like a traditional interview question type station, these are the questions I was asked way back when I interviewed under the traditional interview system, that I remember:

  1. Why do you wish to do an accelerated combined medical program instead of the traditional route that most physicians do? ---- EXPECT TO GET THIS ONE FOR SURE sometime during interview day.
  2. Why do you want to come specifically to UMKC’s medical school?
  3. What is a book/novel that you have read that was not assigned to you in school? What was it about? What did you learn from it?
  4. You’re sitting in class taking an exam, and you notice a classmate cheating. What do you do?
  5. Why medicine?
  6. If you were not to get into UMKC’s combined medical program, what would you do?
  7. Tell me a time you faced an adversity or a challenge and how you overcame it.
  8. What specialties do you think you’re interested in?
  9. What experiences motivated you to pursue medicine?
  10. What do you think is your greatest personal weakness/flaw?

***** http://krnpremed.blogspot.com/p/a-guide-to-my-posts.html (this has a link to both traditional interview AND MMI questions – click where it says “Link:” for both types) — one document is 15 pages the other is 17 pages. This is more than enough practice on its own to be prepared for UMKC’s interview.

More traditional interview links:
http://www.colorado.edu/advising/sites/default/files/attached-files/Med_100%20intquest.pdf
http://www.futuredoctor.net/questions_and_answers1.shtml
http://gradschool.about.com/cs/medicalinterview/a/medquest.htm

@Roentgen thank you so much. I’ll take all this into consideration! :slight_smile:

@Asoles111 Btw, ENT is also one of those specialities where you can get clinical exposure with patients as well as surgery time. Although, I’m pretty sure not many high schoolers seriously give otolaryngology any thought! :))

Do not Join GOLDEN KEY! We paid over 3 months ago and we have not received our membership number nor have we seen any information. Paid $120, asked for a refund recently and told no refunds after 30 days. I have not received anything. The response from them still did not include a membership number or any other information. No apologies or anything. Save your money, networking through your school, peers and conferences would give you more benefits.

@TheHouse, why not go to your local student Golden Key Honor Society officers on campus and ask them what the issue is? I don’t really see what this has to do with the UMKC BA/MD program in general, but whatever. At least at UMKC, in the med program, we all joined honor society organizations like Golden Key, Mortar Board, Omicron Delta Kappa (ODK) etc. when we qualified during Years 1-2.

Medical Ethics

also called Bioethics[ul]
[]http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/physician-resources/medical-ethics/code-medical-ethics/principles-medical-ethics.page
[
]http://www.med.uottawa.ca/sim/data/Ethics_e.htm (Canada – but same rules apply) – Keep these 4 main pillars of medical ethics in mind when answering questions that relate to this topic
[li]https://depts.washington.edu/bioethx/topics/[/ul][/li]In traditional interviews, you’re usually given a medical ethical scenario in which there isn’t a “right” answer, although there may be “better” answers. Common classic topics/questions in medical ethics in medical school interviews – abortion, euthanasia, giving a blood transfusion to a child who needs it whose family is a Jehovah’s witness (Jehovah’s witnesses don’t accept blood transfusions), end of life issues, see link #3 – to see common topics in medical bioethics and familiarize yourself with them. Don’t STRESS about knowing the fact details and ins and outs. If you have any questions, please ask them in the CC thread so we can answer any confusing topics.

Keep in mind the overlying theme in terms of answering – do what you would want the IDEAL physician to do if you were a very sick, vulnerable patient (which all of us in our lives have been or eventually will be), not necessarily what a doctor ACTUALLY does in real life.

Some ethical situations will be slam dunk type scenarios – see my traditional interview questions post. In which case those are mainly to test that you’re an ethical person (or at least as much as an interview can test for that).

The U.S. Healthcare System, explained

Right now, we’re mainly a mixture of private insurance and public insurance – what are called third party payers. They’re called that because involved in a healthcare interaction you have a doctor, a patient, and then insurance, so they are the “third party” involved. Think of it as a third wheel: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Third+Wheel. Very few people in this country pay for ALL of their medical care, including those requiring hospital admission, with cash on hand.

Tutorials on how the U.S. Healthcare system works[ul]
[]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yN-MkRcOJjY
[
]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMHxxvbzFqc
[]https://www.khanacademy.org/partner-content/brookings-institution/introduction-to-healthcare
[
]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klR7TCPQh0c[/ul]
Currently, our only “government” sponsored health insurance plans are these 3, which are mainly thru the federal govt. although there is some state involvement as well:[ul]
[]Medicare — for those over 65: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_(United_States)
[
]Medicaid — for those who are poor: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicaid
[li]SCHIP – for children under a certain income level: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Children%27s_Health_Insurance_Program[/ul][/li]Everyone else buys private insurance (Blue Cross-Blue Shield, Aetna, Humana, Cigna, UnitedHealthcare, etc.) whether that’s as an individual or as a job benefit offered thru their employer.

How health insurance works[ul]
[]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4-pklsDT_Q
[
]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-58VD3z7ZiQ
[]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-58VD3z7ZiQ[/ul]
Some problems with our current healthcare system (no system in the world is 100% perfect) in terms of what you need to be aware of[list]
[li] http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2015/oct/us-health-care-from-a-global-perspective (no need to understand the nitty gritty – just understand the major bolded headings as to what we are getting for our healthcare system at least from the patient perspective)[/li][
]http://www.businessinsider.com/whats-wrong-with-healthcare-in-the-us-2014-9
[*]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klR7TCPQh0c

Obamacare (a.k.a. the Affordable Care Act)

So for people in high school, I don’t think the medical school will make you know the ins and outs of Obamacare. The main reason being it’s THOUSANDS of pages long (with internal regulations yet to be written) and the law has yet to be fully implemented in practice – not just everyone (most) getting insurance which is the step we are at now, but also coming soon, attempting to lower the nation’s healthcare costs. Even many practicing doctors don’t know all the ins and outs so expecting an applicant to know is quite unreasonable. This is what has been implemented in terms of what affects patients:[list]
[]mandatory healthcare coverage, or you pay a fine if you don’t get it, on your IRS tax form.
[
]no more denial of pre-existing conditions in order to get a health insurance plan (the way most insurance works [home, auto], i.e. you can’t buy home insurance, if your current house is currently on fire)
[]The Obamacare exchange – where everyone (if their employer doesn’t offer insurance) is able to go to this state/federal website, healthcare.gov, and sign up for health insurance.
[
]If you’re under 26, you’re covered under you parent’s insurance - usually offered thru their employer.
[]no lifetime caps on how much medical coverage you can have by the insurance company (which can be difficult for those patients who have certain conditions that require very expensive care).
[
]you can’t just be dropped from a health insurance plan, except for fraud or not paying your premiums: http://obamacarefacts.com/ban-on-rescission/

Links:
https://www.brandeis.edu/acserv/health/events/acaoverview.pdf
http://www.studentdoctor.net/2014/12/discussing-obamacare-in-your-med-school-interviews/

http://obamacarefacts.com/obamacare-explained/
http://useconomy.about.com/od/healthcarereform/a/Obamacare-Explained.htm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZkk6ueZt-U
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-Ilc5xK2_E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vju70I6qSKk

@Roentgen How would you answer the blood transfusion Jehovah Witness scenario?

@watang, well you could say that you would get the hospital ethics committee involved (every hospital has one for situations like these), but that really doesn’t get you out of the question. Because next as the interviewer I could say (and I would fully do so, since we have like 8 to 10 minutes at a particular station) what if the child is dying right in front of you and you don’t have time to get the ethics committee involved (i.e. say the child is on the table and is actively hemorrhaging after being brought in from a car accident), then what would you do? The BEST answer clearly is to transfuse blood, since the child isn’t old enough (considered competent) to make their own medical decisions, likely they aren’t conscious so they don’t get to make that decision, and my job as the physician is to #1 save their life with time very much on the essence, regardless of what their parents’ religious doctrine may say. Just FYI, legally the law would be fully on my side, but that’s unnecessary to say.

I should add, you don’t need to know the ins and out of medical ethics like I just laid out, but clearly most of us as human beings with a conscience would do what it takes to save that life, esp. when you don’t have all the time in the world to make a decision. Unless you’re a psychopath, then you might have a bit of trouble. =))

Practicing at Home/School for the MMI (Getting into the Groove)

So, I’ve been getting a LOT of PMs on how to adjust and get comfortable practicing for the UMKC BA/MD interview from now until the day of your interview, from the usual previous setup of 2 separate faculty traditional interviews to the relatively new (at least to UMKC) format of the Mini Multiple Interview (MMI).

There are two ways you can do this:[ol]
[]Roleplay: this can be with your parents, an older sibling, a classmate, or a principal/teacher at your high school. As you get closer to your interview date, you can even do it dressed up in the clothes you would wear on the day of interview to make it “feel” like the real thing (all the more reason to wear clothes that fit), get any annoying habits under control (like tapping your paper pad with your pen, etc.)
[
]Watch videos of OTHER people doing it (whether on a DVD [see one of the books listed that has one] or on Youtube).[/ol]
Whoever is interviewing you should get in the mode of a boss interviewing someone new for a starting position in their company, who is trying to get to know the person, for example. Then have them role play and read the questions/prompt to you. You can even go further and play out the whole thing – Have them print out or write each prompt on a separate piece of paper to place on the outside of your room door, you then get x number of minutes to read the prompt, then open the door to sit in a chair, to answer in whatever the number of minutes you get per station to discuss inside with the interviewer. Practice how to give a good confident handshake (practice with your Dad – who will tell you not to give a “fish” handshake but don’t break their hand either, lol), how to introduce yourself properly, etc. You can find the MMI practice prompts like these http://multipleminiinterview.com/mmi-questions/ and these http://■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■/blog/files/sample-mmi-practice-questions. I’ve listed some of those MMI prompt links in my prior posts. The key is to get through them and don’t overload yourself as after a while, you’re testing the same competencies. Use them and take advantage of it!

I’ll say it again: You should NOT be learning for the very first time what the MMI is, how it works, etc. on the day of your BA/MD interview at UMKC.. When they explain it on interview day, you should be nodding your head and smiling, since you’ve already done all the prior preparation.

Links:[ul]
[]http://medicine.arizona.edu/admissions/application-process/interview
[
]http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/how-to-prepare-for-a-multiplemini-medical-school-i.html
[]http://medadmissions.ca/mmimed-school-interview/
[
]http://www.secretlifeofamedstudent.com/2012/06/sit-back-relax-its-going-to-be-smashing.html
[]http://mindfulofmedicine.com/2014/12/28/med-school-interviews-mmi/
[
]http://www.prospectivedoctor.com/mmi-pitfalls/
[]https://www.themedicportal.com/application-guide/medical-school-interview/mmi-interviews/[/ul]
YouTube videos:[list]
[
]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NPzieykTF4 (Pay special attention to Stanford who does the MMI)
[]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNebeEKg-Ak
[
]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOVbDD9lNjE (Notice how the applicant is dressed for this interview – the interview is not the time to show off how well you can dress) – ignore the Youtube comments as they are inappropriate (but quite hilarious). Remember the point is to see your critical thinking skills and to see all sides of a given scenario.
[]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPGuuOZTtSs
[
]https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLltsQb0J9n8vJ69Rlvqyu6chREtdObu8V
[]https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbMGLZgPOG1tw_B8shsq4T0iINGLkKZDd
[
]UC-Davis Prehealth - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdXKVLTt1ZQ