I’m an Australian swimmer looking to go to school in the USA. I wanted advice on what school everyone considers better, swimming aside. I am looking to study something in math and science, potentially in the engineering field. I got a 2280 on my SATs and have a class rank of 1/198. Do you think there is any potential for academic aid at either school? Which school do you think is better and why?
Thank you.
UMich is a TOP engineering school. They are top 10 in engineering according to USNews Rankings.
http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/rankings/engineering-doctorate
It all depends on what you like in a college. Size, Spirit, Food, Location, Weather, Diversity, etc.
Also, if you are an international, there is going to be a lot higher tuition.
In math and science, both universities will provide you with excellent opportunities. Michigan has a slight edge, but UNC is no slouch. In Engineering, Michigan has the clear advantage, mainly because UNC does not have a traditional college of Engineering.
I am not sure about UNC, but Michigan does not provide need based financial aid to international students. Since UNC is public, I would assuming they too do not provide financial aid to international students.
I think both schools are excellent, academically and non-academically (social, athletic etc…). You really cannot go wrong with those two universities.
I don’t think UVA, UNC or UVA give aid to int’ls.
UVA does not give aid to int’ls. UMich and UNC don’t.
Are you a senior? How much will your parents pay each year?
There are some schools that give merit for stats, but the award won’t be a full ride…it might be for tuition only.
What is your M + CR SAT
For full disclosure, my opinion is pretty biased because I went to UMich and took lots of classes in the engineering school, and my opinion of UNC comes from family members who attended there.
Michigan Engineering is ranked #6 in the US, UNC #93. The big difference at UMich is that nearly every program is ranking in the top 10, only chemical engineering is less at #12. This gives you a lot of flexibility to switch between programs; any one you decide on will be good and most students change their interests. You can also dual-enroll at LSA or the Ross business school (ranked #4), this a pretty popular option too.
There is a very large international student body on North Campus from pretty much everywhere ; lots of Chinese, Koreans, Indians, S. Americans and even a few Europeans - especially as engineering graduate students. UNC has fewer internationals and fewer OOS domestic students, I believe that Michigan residents are 62% of the freshman, at UNC is is around 80%. There are significantly more women than men at UNC: 59% of the UNC freshman class is female, at UMich it is closer to 50-50.
The quality of the professors and students at both schools is extremely high. UMich has a higher mean and smaller range of ACT scores. The UMich engineering school is predominantly male (about 70%) and has a higher ACT (average:33) than the remainder of the university.
In my experience, the UMich engineering school is designed to help you succeed - there are departmental lounges where you can get tutoring and help all day, lots and lots of office hours and review sessions, and an open door policy for administration. If you want to have a chat with the dean, just make an appointment! In addition, there are incubators and a department to help students start businesses and a thriving startup community. The computing resources are world class with labs open for student use 24x7. Successful graduates often come back and lecture on the companies they started. There are lots of student teams - the most famous being the solar car team with has won numerous awards (latest: Abu Dhabi solar car challenge) Recruiting or UM grads is pretty fierce, most students have several job offers by the time they graduate.
Campus wise, both are very nice college / research towns, with Ann Arbor the quintessential small college town (population 113K, regional population 344K) and UNC in a large city (Chapel Hill, population 59K, regional population 2 million) but contiguous to Raleigh/Durham). Ann Arbor is much colder, with snow a few months of the year but lots of winter sports. Lots of great, affordable restaurants in both places even on a student budget. Ann Arbor is rated the #1 most educated city in the USA, Raleigh #10
Tuition at UMich is higher: currently appx USD 43000 per 2 semesters vs 34000 at UNC. Very large difference, especially considering the low A$. There are also a number of engineering scholarships like Stamps and Shipmans; you should check the engineering web site for contact to see what is available to internationals. You can apply for need based aid after 1 semester.
http://www.engin.umich.edu/college/admissions/finances/scholarships/international
UMich has one of the best swimming and diving programs in the USA. Michael Phelps trained in Ann Arbor for years, and Michigan has produced many Olympic quality divers and swimmers. If you are competitive at the state or national level, or close to it, I would urge you to contact the athletic department at UMich. You probably won’t be on their radar as an Australian, but as a recruited athlete you could get a partial or full scholarship. If not, it might be interested to go to the meets.
Both are large state schools and have their share of partying, but not so much on the North Campus at UMich, which houses engineering, CS, music, design, art and architecture. Ann Arbor has a pretty amazing sports culture with everything from football to cricket on a sponsored , inter-mural or club level. I’d also give the edge to Ann Arbor for things to do : largest art fair in the USA in the summer (500K people attend) , amazing concerts and music with cheap student tickets ($10-15 usually), (even Kasey Chambers stops here on tour) , tons of free student concerts and lectures, free transportation on university and city buses too. The airport is Detroit (DTW) appx 35 min away, $15 shuttle to campus) but unfortunately there are no non-stops to Sydney.
Doesn’t sound like either would be affordable. Unless you are a good enough swimmer to earn an athletic scholarship. Then the picture changes, I think.
As Alexandre pointed out, UNC Chapel Hill does not offer engineering.* North Carolina divides many programs between UNC Chapel Hill and NC State – which are in some ways dual flagships – and engineering programs are solely at the latter institution.
*BME is the one exception, but that is an offshoot of applied science at UNC rather than part of a traditional engineering school.
Chapel Hill and Carrboro make up an excellent college town and in no way feel like a large city. Raleigh and Durham are easily accessible by bus or car, but Chapel Hill feels fairly self-contained.
I second all of the above.
@mom2collegekids is incorrect – UNC offers the Robertson scholarship (a full ride scholarship), and students from Australia and NZ have specially reserved slots in the program. You’re a perfectly strong contender with your stats.
http://robertsonscholars.org/apply/international/
https://scholarships.online.unsw.edu.au/scholarship/sc_al_search_detail.display_scholarship_details?p_scholarship_specific_id=607
UNC does not have a school of engineering. They offer biomedical engineering but it is not part of a traditional school of engineering. Chapel Hill and Carborro are amazing college towns and absolutely do not feel like a large city. They feel like traditional college towns. As far as parties, you will find them off campus if you want them. If you have no interest, you can choose never to see them. There are plenty of things to do on and off campus at CH that do not involve parties. Michigan is the larger school; UNC has about 18,000 undergrads versus Michigan’s 28,000. Michigan also has more graduate students - approximately 15,000 versus 10,000 at UNC.
You will get top notch math and science opportunities at both schools, but if you are looking for a traditional school of engineering I would attend Michigan. If you are interested in biomedical engineering, the program at UNC will land you excellent internships and the students I know who graduated from the program received job offers immediately.
I can’t answer the question about FA.
Not mentioned yet, but Michigan is also top ten in biomedical engineering according to USNWR:
Michigan is better known world-wide.
The biomedical engineering major at UNC is a joint program with NC State. As of 2014 the major at UNC only had 24 students but seems to be growing. UNC is very very strong in math and science but is not known as an engineering school the way many others are. Regardless, the students I know who graduated from the program are employed all over the country and are very happy.
Thanks for all the information and details on scholarships. Whilst I am an Australian, I am also a US citizen, and therefore will qualify for financial aid. I have been in close contact with the coaches of each school and I think they are both fantastic programs. Thanks for all the engineering information, it has been very helpful.
Uh, you might have mentioned that in your OP since it obviously changes the aid matter immensely.
UNC has excellent FA for OOS students.
oh good heavens… You should’ve mentioned that you are a citizen in your first post
Run the NPC calculators and see if you qualify for aid