Unemployment = high EFC?!

Paying for College
1

<p>I'm just shy of 30 years old and trying to go back to school. I have two semesters under my belt (four classes total), but never got around to filling out the FAFSA, so this is my first time ever seeking out financial aid.</p>

<p>I finally filled out the FAFSA via the web and my EFC was almost $10k! Obviously this made me ineligible for the Pell Grant, as it so nicely told me after hitting the submit button.</p>

<p>What I don't understand is this:
I lost my job this summer.
I couldn't afford to register for the upcoming fall semester.
...Yet I make too much money to qualify for federal aid because LAST year I had a job? It's not like I had a lot of extra money even when I did make $30k/yr. Afterall, I'm not a kid! I have rent, car payment, bills! I don't have any fancy "assets" or anything either.</p>

<p>And as far as that "expected" contribution goes, I never would've been able to scrape together $10,000 to spend on schooling even if I'd tried. I didn't even pay that much in car payments last year, let alone my education!</p>

<p>Am I missing something? Can anyone explain the logic here? </p>

<p>It's SO hard to find information on the web for adults... everything is geared toward high schoolers and their parents. The system really works against you when you're independant and old! (The funny thing is - everyone told me it would be the opposite! Hah!)</p>

<p>Any helpful/useful information anyone can provide would be lovely.
Thanks for reading! =)</p>

2

<p>ElleM I went back to school about 6 years ago (as an adult, and older than you). What I found was that I needed to sit with the financial aid officer at the school I was planning to attend. She guided me and walked me through the entire process.</p>

<p>Just note that there's little "free" money for adults returning to school, the bulk of financial aid will be in the form of loans (subsidized and unsubsidized), therefore you will graduate (or not) in debt. This may mean seriously considering the "whys" for going back to school as an adult student. </p>

<p>I did find a few grants and scholarships, but I was also a "first generation" college student as well as a single parent. Otherwise I was unable to find scholarships and grants.</p>

<p>Perhaps you can consider returning to community college for your "elective" classes, and a local university for those pertaining to your major. That's what I did, and I literally saved thousands of dollars (no need to take history of rock and roll at the major university for a cost of $1900 a class, when community college cost $51).</p>

<p>It's time to get creative. What are you planning to get your degree in? Is it worth the expense of graduating in debt? And just how much debt are you willing to take on?</p>

3

<p>You can try asking the financial aid office for a special circumstances adjustment. This can be awarded, at the FAOs discretion, based on a change in circumstances such as loss of income or benefits and also for higher than average expenses such as medical expenses. (consumer debt such as car payments are not a special circumstance). If the adjustment is approved they can go into your FAFSA and adjust the income and then the numbers are run through the EFC formula again producing a new EFC.</p>

<p>Independent students do not really fare that well under the financial aid formula. For the 2008-2009 school year a single independent student only has @ $6,200 in income protection plus a little more for taxes and ss taxes. Over that 50% goes toward your EFC which probably explains your high EFC.</p>

<p>Try asking for the special circumstances adjustment. Here is some more information
FinAid</a> | Professional Judgment | Special Circumstances</p>

<p>Keep in mind that the FAOs decision is final. Good luck - let us know how it turns out.</p>

4

<p>Justamom is right. Some schools even have special awards and programs for adults going back to college. If you do not already have a UG degree, there many be some special funds for you. What many have to do, is borrow heavily that first year so that the second year there is a very low EFC that just may put you into PELL range which may make you eligible for other monies. Bear in mind that PELL is less $5K in money which may not make much difference for high cost colleges, if you can make a good amount working part time. My neighbor found that it was better for her over all to continue working than to make herself eligible for low income funds. A zero EFC just guarantees PELL and subsidized Staffords. Possibilities but no guarantees of other goodies.</p>

5

<p>if you made 30k and you do not have a considerable amount of assets, and your EFC came out to 10K, I would advise you tp go back over your paperwork and check your numbers because it seems that there could be an error (even if you met the simplfied needs test which is under 50K in income, you would have had a "0" EFC and your assets would have not been counted).</p>

6

<p>
[quote]
if you made 30k and you do not have a considerable amount of assets, and your EFC came out to 10K, I would advise you tp go back over your paperwork and check your numbers because it seems that there could be an error (even if you met the simplfied needs test which is under 50K in income, you would have had a "0" EFC and your assets would have not been counted).

[/quote]

A 30k income would not produce a 0 EFC for either a dependent or an independent student. The income cut off for the automatic 0 EFC for 2008-2009 school year is < $20,000 (it increases to <$30,000 for 2009-2010 - but must be less than $30k). Unfortunately an independent student is not eligible for the automatic 0 unless they have a dependent other than a spouse.</p>

<p>Unfortunately, based on the current EFC formula, 10,000 sounds about correct for an independent student with $30k income and little assets. The income protection for an independent student is a little over $6,000 but federal taxes paid are also deducted and an allowance is made for State taxes and SS taxes. After that 50% of the remainder goes to the EFC for an independent student.</p>

<p>The simplified needs test which requires an income <$50k does not give an automatic 0 EFC - it causes assets to be ignored calculates an EFC using income.</p>

7

<p>You guys are great and very helpful.</p>

<p>To clarify, I actually am at a community college and this is my first degree. I'm not asking for much, just enough to register for next semester and pay for books. The Pell Grant would've covered that.</p>

<p>I'm perfectly okay with subsidized loans, but if I supposedly have "no financial needs" (hah! according to the government, anyway), I'm not very hopeful that I'll be eligible for those and the unsubsidized loans make me a little nervous since I have no idea how long I'll be in school for (oh the life of the adult student!)</p>

<p>I wish the FAFSA form worked more intelligently on its own and took more into account than the previous year's income. The economy is terrible, of course people's lives are subject to change - I don't feel like this should be considered a special circumstance, I know several other people who've lost their jobs this year, some of whom were students.</p>

<p>Thanks again to all for your responses. Trying to get ahold of the FA dept at my school (to no avail - which doesn't really suprise me, heh) and will keep everyone abreast of my situation... anything I learn can only help others, I figure! =)</p>

8

<p>It would probably be best to go in and talk to the financial aid people face to face. We have generally found FA people to be very helpful and willing to help where they can. My daughter had a special circumstances adjustment her freshman year based on loss of income and high medical expenses. My son recently was denied aid because of a previous bad semester where he tied to work full time and tanked his classes. He talked to a lady in the FA office and she told him how to appeal and the appeal was granted. Go in and talk to them - make sure you are talking to someone in the know about special circumstances adjustments (sometimes WS students help out in the financial aid office and they may not have the knowledge of what is possible).</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

9

<p>Ohmygoodness,</p>

<p>Thanks so much. I did not realize how much ones EFC goes up once they become independent (my recent college grad will end up with an EFC that is close to what our EFC was as a family when she applies to law school next year. Arrrghhhh) . So much for sending them off to work after graduation!</p>

10

<p>
[quote]
It would probably be best to go in and talk to the financial aid people face to face. We have generally found FA people to be very helpful and willing to help where they can.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Yeah, I have a feeling they're pretty swamped right now (fall semester started yesterday), so I'm trying to make an appointment and/or find out the best time to sit down with someone. Fingers are crossed!</p>

<p>Thanks again. =)</p>

11

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<p>Unfortunately, everyone applying for financial aid has the above.</p>

<p>I agree, go and talk to the folks at the community college financial aid AND look at possible aid for non-traditional students (you are one if you are returning to college or attending college in your 30's for the first time). </p>

<p>Also, is there any way you can work full time and attend CC part time? I know this will take longer for you to complete your studies but it may make them possible. Perhaps looking for another job and going that route would work.</p>

<p>Since it's a local community college, I would suggest that you go in person to make an appointment to speak to someone. That might work better than the phone or email.</p>

12

<p>Well, I'm comparing the average adult with a job to the average teen who DOES qualify for financial aid who doesn't have real life responsibilities. It's crazy to me that a kid with no financial responsibility can get FA, but not an adult who's been paying taxes almost as long as that kid has been alive. ;)</p>

<p>I have an appointment with a FA advisor for later this week. I was on the phone less time than I'd have been in line to schedule an appointment - it worked out much much better that way!</p>

<p>Oh, I definitely have to work. Getting laid off was far from my choice! It did do me a favor in allowing me to reconsider working full time, though. If I can find someone to help out with college expenses, I can get by with a part time job (no frivolous spending whatsoever, but that's okay) and not have to take tiring night classes only and I'll be able to get things done faster. Since the government's not being of much help, I'm interested to see what other options I'll have once I meet with an advisor (though it's not sounding like anything is going to drop my EFC enough for the 08-09 year).</p>

13

<p>Elle,</p>

<p>Have you considered looking into full-time programs for non-traditional students?</p>

<p>for example</p>

<p>Adam Comstock Scholars - Smith College</p>

<p>Smith</a> College: Ada Comstock Scholars Program</p>

<p>MCBride Scholars - Bryn Mawr College</p>

<p>[McBride[/url</a>]</p>

<p>Francis Perkins Program- Mount Holyoke College</p>

<p>[url=<a href="http://www.mtholyoke.edu/fp/%5DMount"&gt;http://www.mtholyoke.edu/fp/]Mount&lt;/a> Holyoke College :: Frances Perkins Program](<a href="http://www.brynmawr.edu/mcbride/#%5DMcBride%5B/url"&gt;http://www.brynmawr.edu/mcbride/#)&lt;/p>

<p>hope this helps</p>

14

<p>Also have you thought of looking into jobs in your area where they may pay tuition? For instance UPS has some sort of tuition help plan. Sykes where we live does. There are bound to be others depending on where you live.</p>

15

<p>ElleM: your profile says "California" so I assume that means you are at a California Community College. I am over 30, high EFC and no assets nor dependents, attended a CCC for 7 years part time while working full time, and will transfer to a UC this year. I don't own a car, but I do have credit card debt.</p>

<p>The cost of attendance at a CCC is very low, compared to 4-year universities. Your cost will be, basically, mostly your living expenses. I highly advise against taking out even subsidized loans for CCC, if at all possible. The reason for this is that once you transfer to a 4-yr university (especially if your goal is a UC), you might have to take out a lot in loans, especially if you end up working a lot and again have a high EFC when applying to UC or CSU. However, if you play your cards right, by the time you transfer, your EFC might be 0 or very low.</p>

<p>If you can, take a part time job that covers just what you need plus tuition and books, or take a lower paying full time job and take only a few classes this year. Then, when you apply for FA next year, your aid may go up because you made less money in 2008. Get high grades and you might be eligible for the Cal Grant. </p>

<p>I am not eligible for the Cal Grant, Pell Grant, nor work study because of my past high income, so this year I am taking the full amount of unsubsidized loans offered to me. I am truly hoping that my student contribution appeal will at least convert most or all of those unsubsidized loans to subsidized loans...we'll see in about 1 month. Because I chose to continue working full time through, well, Monday, my income for 2008 will be high again, so next year I think I'll have to go through the appeal process again. So, all I can say is, try to reduce your expenses (sell your car, move to a cheaper place closer to public transportation, get roommates if you are not married or don't have kids), and reduce your income for future FA eligibility. Or, work full time, go to school part time, and save save save at the same time (I found CDs to be perfect for short term saving). Further, try to keep your grades high and apply for every scholarship that you can find.</p>

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<p>This is my exact problem! I lost my job in April 2008. I was on UI for the rest of the year. I finished the year with $33K in income, half of what I made the previous year. I am going back to school and currently at CC and hoping to transfer to UCSD in the fall. My EFC=$10k. My income this year will be around $16k, and next year could be even less. I am not eligible for Pell or Cal Grant because of my income currently. Is there a way I can appeal with FAO or is it too late?
I am afraid I may be SOL at least for my first year there. I have applied for different scholarships, but I am 33, going back to school, I have no degree, and first time college student.
Do I talk to the FAO at my CC or the UC I plan to attend?</p>

17

<p>A kid really has it rough too IF he does not have parents who are supportive. A ridiculous number of kids get no financial aid because the parents just won’t fill out the FAFSA. Unless there is an abuse/neglect type situation, you are stuck with your parents’ financials until you are age 24 or married, have a dependent, a veteran, etc. </p>

<p>I often tell kids who do complain about that definition of independence that it isn’t all roses when you are treated as an adult. Your assets and income are hit far harder than a family’s. It’s not as though a bunch of money suddenly becomes available. </p>

<p>My son has friends in this situation. What they often do is borrow for the first year and take a job for just subsistence, living at home with parents sometimes so they don’t need much money. They then have the requisite lack of income the following year to qualify for PELL and other low income programs. So the next year, they can pretty much get our state tuition covered. But if they want to live independently and work only part time, it is not easy to do. You gotta take loans unless you get a high paying job and still live frugally. You really need to put away half of what you make towards the following year school costs. It is not easy to work one’s way through school.</p>

18

<p>Wdprice, you need to borrow the first year and do as I outlined above, and take that one year hit to get on the PELL and other need grant roll.</p>