URM 2.5 GPA 2100 SAT and We're Going For It

Parents Forum
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<p>Probably the assumption that the student falls into one of these UC guarantee classes. The calculator at the first link indicates that a 3.2 HS GPA (UC weighted) and 700/700/700 SAT score qualifies for the statewide top 9%, so it is likely that the student does fall into the statewide UC guarantee class, where the student is admitted to a UC that has space available if not admitted to any explicitly applied to.</p>

<p>[University</a> of California - Statewide path](<a href=“http://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/freshman/california-residents/admissions-index/]University”>http://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/freshman/california-residents/admissions-index/)
[Local</a> path (ELC) | UC Admissions](<a href=“http://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/freshman/california-residents/local-path/index.html]Local”>http://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/freshman/california-residents/local-path/index.html)</p>

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<p>OP,
The Engineering major is impacted in the following CSUs: SLO, San Diego, Long Beach, Fullerton, San Jose, Pomona, Maritime Academy. The first five campuses are impacted in all majors. <a href=“http://www.calstate.edu/sas/publications/documents/impactedprogramsmatrix.pdf[/url]”>http://www.calstate.edu/sas/publications/documents/impactedprogramsmatrix.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Presuming your son’s UC GPA is the same as the CSU GPA, your son’s eligibility index is 3960. To get an accurate CSU GPA calculation, here is the link: <a href=“Cal State Apply | CSU”>Cal State Apply | CSU;

<p>For SDSU, admitted students’ ave. CSU Eligibility index is 4151. <a href=“https://www.calstate.edu/sas/Fall2013-CampusPre/SanDiego-HighSch-CC.pdf[/url]”>https://www.calstate.edu/sas/Fall2013-CampusPre/SanDiego-HighSch-CC.pdf&lt;/a&gt; </p>

<p>For Cal Poly SLO’s College of Engineering, the ave. GPA/SAT (math+rdg) is 4.08/1388. [Student</a> Profile - Admissions - Cal Poly, San Luis Obispo](<a href=“Cal Poly Admissions”>Cal Poly Admissions) </p>

<p>Cal Poly SLO calculates GPA based on 9th-11th grade. [Freshman</a> Selection Criteria - Admissions - Cal Poly, San Luis Obispo](<a href=“Cal Poly Admissions”>Cal Poly Admissions)</p>

<p>Still, I wish you good luck!</p>

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<p>Op,
Maybe applying to any college as a Math major will allow him to apply to a less impacted or less competitive major, which allow for easier acceptance. </p>

<p>If he is applying to many “lottery” schools (for his GPA/SAT combo), I would sit him down and explain that it’s a lottery. All based on some adcom’s mood that day and whether they decide to give him a “chance.” Knowing this info, he will either say…“hey let’s roll the dice” or “bleh, it’s not worth the effort to fill out the app and then I’ll be depressed afterwards.” Then you will know your answer. Sometimes kids take these rejections very personally, while others don’t. Sometimes parents take these rejections VERY personally. YOU seem to know that it’s a lottery and won’t take it personally. You have to make sure that HE knows this and is on board with it as well.</p>

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<p>I have yet to meet any student (or parent) who didn’t feel some sting from rejection, even if it was a reach or lottery school; when it was multiple schools, the rejection stung all the more. I don’t see how applying to mostly lottery schools is a good thing for the kiddo, family or parents. There is enough stress and tension in SR year without adding extra. If the family needs good merit and FAid, even more stress with these apps.</p>

<p>Good luck in making choices that you and your student and family will be happy with.</p>

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<p>I’ve been quiet but fascinated by this thread. I do have a couple of comments.</p>

<p>Howard, NC A&T are definitely well regarded on the national level, so I wouldn’t write off HBCU’s. There are probably others.</p>

<p>Your comment that your son will grow where he is planted, but he doesn’t really think he’ll get into these top schools sounded a big alarm. My parents thought I would just of course bloom by going to a top university (after all, my other siblings were doing very well). They were wrong. I didn’t flunk out (although it might have better if I did), but I didn’t thrive at all. Worse, I didn’t know it was not a good fit; I just thought I was incompetent for four years. It wasn’t until I went to grad school at a lower tier school, I realized what good fit meant. I suddenly became this stellar student, feeling confident enough to participate in class and talk to professors outside of class.</p>

<p>I agree with others who say to rebalance the number of reaches versus matches and safeties. Of course throw in a couple of reaches (why not?), but also be realistic.</p>

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<p>ucbalumnus:

I didn’t go through all of them, but it looks like auto admit is mostly for residents of such state’s public. I don’t believe Rutgers has auto admit.</p>

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<p>This is EXACTLY why “fit” is far more important than prestige. A kid who really had to struggle to get into a highly competitive school (or was pushed by parents) is going to feel academically inferior the whole time he is there. He or she also may not take any risks in course selection because of the fear of not getting decent grades. And there will likely be less time for socialization, clubs, and other activities that contribute to a rich college experience if the student has to study all the time just to keep up.</p>

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<p>I helped D navigate the admissions process and really enjoyed it! But we also talked about what she wanted and then I helped facilitating her to find it. Of course, I had my own opinions - like apply to a couple Ivys. D did not want to apply to any Ivys. She also had opinions that needed to be tested - wanted small LAC. D visited two LAC in rural upstate NY and realized that they were too small, secluded and not nearly diverse enough for her. So she settled in on mid-sized universities after that and only applied to one LAC. Her list changed several times as she received more information. When I look at the first list compared to the list she applied to - it is quite different. In the final list I found that my influence was not really present - the list was hers alone. </p>

<p>As April 1 approached and decisions began to roll in I am struck by her sheer tension in awaiting the answers. She - unlike you - had not really found a “safety” that she wanted to attend and so only applied to one - the state flagship. Each decision date was important and ended with either a bolster to her confidence and sensibilities or not. She applied to 8 and was accepted to 6 with one waitlist. Even so it was clear that the non-admits were tough for her - although not unpredictable. She is currently a freshman at a school that she loves.</p>

<p>4 years ago, S agreed to the major that I recommended since he couldn’t decide. a year and a half into college he realized that it was not for him. He has since decided to double major - keeping the major I chose for him because it guarantees a “job”. But also majoring in something that he is passionate about - but will be a challenge to break into the field and become financially successful.</p>

<p>Both these experiences have made me realize that kids will do best when they make their own choices in both college application and major. For applications - it helps to visit the prototypical school for each category. For major - sometimes the only way is to “go for it” while keeping an open mind for a potential change. Lots of kids change majors in college.</p>

<p>Good luck to you and your S - it will all work out.</p>

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<p>“He used to think he wanted to be a doctor. I steered him from that because I didn’t believe he had the discipline (hello… 2.5 gpa). He is mathematically inclined so I suggested engineering”
-Engineering is the hardest UG major of them all. Much harder than pre-med. If you doubt his hard working habits, then this choice has no meanning. I did not read much on this thread, so maybe you have already reach the sam conclusion. I am also very very familiar with both enigneering (both academically and as a job) and pre-med (and Med. School) requirements. While Med. School is as hard as one can imagine and beyond, as I said engineering is much harder then pre-med in UG.</p>

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<p>…did not address that main concern, sorry! Getting in is nowhere near as important as staying on the track. Also, getting in is much easier than staying on the track. And third point, in case of either engineering and even more so pre-med, it is absolutely does NOT matter which UG you attend, completely irrelevant. So, choose whatever, the cheaper the better!!</p>

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<p>Many of the ones listed are not restricted to in-state residents. The <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1348012-automatic-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships-19.html#post16145676[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1348012-automatic-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships-19.html#post16145676&lt;/a&gt; are some of those which are not.</p>

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<p>Part of the discussion seems to be missing the context:
Even with the new NCLB exemption, for kids in the LAUSD, going to college -any college- can only happen if they are exceptionally driven and talented, or if they have a parent who will do nothing but keep at them. It’s a school district where a large percentage of students (about 40%) drop out and those who stay in school do, well, marginally, most of them getting D’s (which was a passing grade). In that school district, fewer than 20% have a 2.0 - OP’s son is probably top 15% if not close to top10% and must have learned to resist peer pressure in at least some classes. Fewer than 20% students in the school district take AP classes, and among those top students only 40% get a 3 or more. According to a recent Harvard study, only 16% LAUSD students qualify for CSUs - it’s even lower for African American students. That 2100 may have been the best SAT score the school had seen in years.
That’s why there’s holistic admissions guys :).
I hope OP’s son’s Guidance counselor will provide this context, but if not OP can make a bullet point list to make sure it is mentioned. :))</p>

<p>Not to say a 2.5 is good - it is problematic, but I think OP realizes it; 2.5 + 2100 will require an explanation so that he’s not termed “lazy underachiever”; some schools in LAUSD are better than others (Op’s son may go to a specialized high school that graduates most of its freshmen, for example, or one of the technical schools where AP science and calculus is routinely offered) and many people who work there are incredibly dedicated…but OP is right to be driving this search, to look for information for her son, and to be strict with him. Overwhelming odds are against him and as many pointed out, his mother being his advocate is his greatest asset. The teachers and guidance counselors are probably trying to help too but they may well be overwhelmed. He has to be involved in the search, of course, but he can’t pilot it. “Finding your way”, “figuring it out on your own” isn’t an option there. He should be involved in explaining how he envisions himself next year: on a big campus where big sports are important? at a school near/in a city for internships and entertainment opportunities ? at a college in the middle of nowhere where therefore everything happens on campus to the point you can’t possibly do everything you’d like to do? Does he want his college male-only (few colleges are) or would he rather attend a coed school? How about diversity? How comfortable is he being far away from home - and how far is “far”, is it 4 hours by car, 4 hours by plane, accross the country?</p>

<p>In addition, it means that attending a college where academic support, peer mentoring, first gen or URM support… are strong is very important. This is something that should be checked out thoroughly and pleads for either a school with deep pockets or a smaller school where there’s constant stimulation and tracking of students (so that he doesn’t fall through the cracks). Any top school will challenge him, which is great, but at first it may be a little overwhelming, so support is essential. Furthermore, there is one category of students for whom where they attend college does matter, and it’s first gen/immigrant/URM students. So, essentially, for these reasons, OP is right to look at some of the schools she’s looking at (top-notch private universities will have more money and more support available than UC Merced).
It seems to me that we need to help her find schools that offer similar support (both financial and academic) so that her son has everything helping him reach his potential rather than flounder, and graduates with a recognized degree that will lead him to the good job he is capable of having - yet are less selective than some of the reaches on the list.
Also, how about Rolling Admissions schools and Early Action schools that would fit? OP’s son would have a few admission decisions by mid December and would be able to judge his chances better ( keep aiming high? aim higher? aim lower? aim differently?)</p>

<p>I agree with other posters that engineering may not be the best choice though. It’s incredibly tough, not only to get into, but to “survive” and graduate from. The “weed out” factor may be bigger depending on campus so how “nurturing” and encouraging the Engineering program is, or how “Sink or Swim”, is I think a criterion people in-the-know should communicate. There are lots of engineers and scientists on CC, I’m sure they can offer contrasting experiences.
A better bet may be a math, CS, or physics major, which may be complemented by graduate engineering work. Or a major in Economics, with a minor in math. In addition, these majors will open up a lot of schools that would love to have OP’s son - in the Midwest and MidAtlantic region, not to mention New England. Schools that aren’t engineering schools but are well-recognized and overall academically challenging, support as well as challenge, offer good financial aid, are strong in math or CS or chemistry or physics, and are trying to recruit bright AA young men (as long as your son doesn’t mind being in schools that aren’t nearly as diverse as what he’s used to.)</p>

<p>OP: you said your son really likes math - what’s the highest math class he’s taken?
(The new, “tough” requirement for LAUSD graduates is algebra2 - has he taken classes beyond that new requirement?)
You also mentioned your soon-to-be ex-husband graduated from Cornell - from what college (whether you son applies to his father’s college or to another one will likely impact how his application is treated. I don’t know if an ILR legacy is considered legacy for COE admissions for example).</p>

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<p>Note that LAUSD students are about 75% Latino; black students make up about 9%.</p>

<p>[2013</a> Growth API LEA Report (CA Department of Education)](<a href=“http://api.cde.ca.gov/Acnt2013/2013GrowthDstApi.aspx?cYear=&allcds=1964733&cChoice=2013GDst2]2013”>http://api.cde.ca.gov/Acnt2013/2013GrowthDstApi.aspx?cYear=&allcds=1964733&cChoice=2013GDst2)</p>

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<p>Stressinf one more time, in case of engineering + pre-med, name of UG is hugely irrelevant. It is a waste of time to even try to get into some selective places, unless the applicant absolutely wants to be there personally. It will have no consequences on the applicant’s future.

  • Engineering firms mostly hire locally.<br>
  • Med. Schools absolutely do not care, they need to see very high college GPA (3.6+) no matter what UG you graduated from and what major (also pretty irrelevant, any major will do), decent MCAT score and reasonable amount of medical ECs.</p>
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<p>Some context about current high school. 60/40 AA/Hisp. Title1. 75% graduation rate. Of that 75% 20% UC eligible, 30% CSU eligible. Average SAT score 1275 (CR+M+W). Current math class is AP Calculus AB.</p>

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I don’t know, but the ones I clicked seem to be restricted to instate. I didn’t look at every school.</p>

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<p>Miami- you are surely aware that many engineers do not get hired by “engineering firms”. Google is not an engineering firm. Boeing is not an engineering firm. Caterpillar is not an Engineering firm. Pfizer is not an engineering firm. Apple is not an engineering firm.</p>

<p>To state that where a kid goes has no consequences on the applicants future is absolutely incorrect as a blanket statement. If the kid wants to become a civil engineer and work for the city he grew up in planning tunnel and bridge renovations- no, it doesn’t matter where he goes as long as it’s an accredited program. But there are dozens of career paths where it does indeed matter where he goes. I recruited engineers for a dozen years and can tell you that there are some programs where “you can’t get there from here”.</p>

<p>And of course a high percentage of engineers don’t even work as engineers; they get jobs in finance and as demographers and they do route planning for airlines and they work in government relations for large construction/infrastructure companies.</p>

<p>You have your own POV on med schools based on your D’s experience which is fantastic, but there are other career paths besides working for a local engineering firm and becoming a physician.</p>

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<p>Slymlady, any idea where your son ranks in his graduating class?</p>

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<p>Absolutely not true. At the Med School weekend just concluded at UC Davis, the representative from one of the med schools shared with the audience its “points system” for grading applications. The quality of the UG school was graded on a scale from 3 to 30. Where you go to UG actually does matter.</p>

<p>I don’t know if it is still up and running or accessible, but a year or so on CC there was a thread emanating from Stanford advising pre-med students to take all their required science courses at community colleges over the summer because, of course, only the grades mattered for the application – no one cares where you got them. Med school deans aren’t stupid. They know when they’re being gamed and your application goes poof. If you are in a good school and you get your science credits at a less good school, you can bet it will be noticed and (absent reasonable explanation) is a sure-fire application killer.</p>

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<p>That seems to indicate a slightly unusual distribution. UC eligibility is supposed to approximate the top 12.5% of high school graduates, while CSU eligibility is supposed to approximate the top 33.3% of high school graduates (meaning that there should be about 20.8% of graduates CSU eligible but not UC eligible). It looks like the school has a group of high performing students (the 20% of graduates who are UC eligible), but it drops off quickly from there (only the next 10% are CSU eligible).</p>