<p>confidentialcoll, would you mind listing your predictions of the top 25 for 2011? </p>
<p>My only doubt to your claim is why would the US NEWS editors and compilers agree to dramatically changing their rankings. Having just a few universities move a couple of spots will alter the rankings significantly. How would they justify this shift without losing their credibility?</p>
<p>Wait… I read the article posted about the changes. The article says they haven’t even implemented them, nor do they necessarily plan to. Why has this discussion proceeded as if these changes are definitely (or even probably) being made?</p>
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</p>
<p>well yes you’re right that they haven’t promised anything. But the fact that they’ve given such detailed suggestions and then defended those suggestions implies that the proposed changes will very likely be incorporated. Most discussions on CC get pretty academic anyway.</p>
<p>
so if the changes are implemented I would (very roughly) predict:
scores out of 100 in ()</p>
<p>1) Harvard, Yale (100)
3) Princeton (98)
4) MIT (94)
5) Stanford (93)
6) UPenn, Columbia (92)
8) Dartmouth (91)
9) Caltech (90)
10) Duke (89)
11) Northwestern, U Chicago, Brown, Cornell (88)
15) WashU (85)
16) JHU (84)
17) Notre Dame (82)
18) Rice (81)
19) Georgetown (78)
20) Emory, Vanderbilt (77)
22) UVA, UCB (74)
24) USC (73)
25) UCLA, Carnegie Mellon (72)
26) UNC (71)
27) Michigan, Tufts, Wake (70) </p>
<p>large changes in actual variables rather than changes to methodology would alter this ordering.</p>
<p>confidentialcoll…very interesting; you obviously have put thought toward this. I’m curious to know why you’ve predicted specific schools will move (up or down) based upon the proposed methodolgy changes. For instance, why is there a four way tie for #11 (Chicago falls 3, Cornell moves up 4, Brown moves up 5, while NU moves up 1)? Emory and Vandy fall 3…why? Carnegie Mellon falls 3? UMich gets surpassed by public UNC? Etc. Again, all very interesting theory…would love more detailed explanation on individual schools.</p>
<p>take a look at my post on page 15:</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1065104952-post213.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1065104952-post213.html</a></p>
<p>US News is proposing including counselor opinions and yield and lowering traditional peer assessment to compensate. </p>
<p>Brown has a low peer assessment, extremely high counselor assessment and high yield (50 something %). Georgetown and Cornell fit in the same way. CMU has an extremely low yield. Emory, Vandy and Caltech will be hurt the most by counselors relative to peer assessment. NUs difference between peer assessment and counselor rating is small with counselors rating it better and it’s yield is normal, which is why it doesn’t move too much. UChicago has a very high peer assessment, counselors don’t rate Chicago nearly as well, and its yield is extremely low relative to its current company in the rankings. UNC’s yield is extremely high at 55+% while counselors don’t view Michigan quite as highly as peers have assessed. JHU and WashU are hurt a little by the counselors and hurt a lot by yield.</p>
<p>Thanks for explaining, ConfidentialColl. To be honest, after reviewing the proposed amendments, I’m completely in favor of these changes. It seems like they would create a more balanced and accurate assessment. Naturally, HYPMS will always prevail; however, I like the way it seems as though there’ll perhaps be less regional bias. Who knows?!</p>
<p>1) Harvard, Yale (100)
3) Princeton (98)
4) MIT (94)
5) Stanford (93)
6) UPenn, Columbia (92)
8) Dartmouth (91)
9) Caltech (90)
10) Duke (89)
11) Northwestern, U Chicago, Brown, Cornell (88)
15) WashU (85)
16) JHU (84)
17) Notre Dame (82)
18) Rice (81)
19) Georgetown (78)
20) Emory, Vanderbilt (77)
22) UVA, UCB (74)
24) USC (73)
25) UCLA, Carnegie Mellon (72)
26) UNC (71)
27) Michigan, Tufts, Wake (70)</p>
<p>NU would drop to 14 cos its PA score is ok and HS rating would be around the same as its current PA, but its yield is like WashU’s and JHU’s.</p>
<p>Confidentialcoll, the HSC rating for Michigan is just as high as the PA rating (both will be roughly 4.5/5.0). And Michigan’s yield is 45%, which is relatively high. This said, I agree that UNC will potentially jump ahead of Michigan thanks to is 57% yield rate.</p>
<p>^yes, but that’s because the high school counselor opinion and peer assessments are scaled slightly differently. Michigan’s (average) rank in peer assessment is 13 while it’s average rank among HSCs is 22. So significant net drop, but yes its yield will help.</p>
<p>confidentialcoll, you are allowing for it to be nail-biting, nerve-racking exciting times for the August period when the USNWR rankings are going to be released this year.</p>
<p>excellent work</p>
<p>Well, based on ALL indicators via USNWR, I do not see how tOSU not crack the Top-50 this coming August!!</p>
<p>Up-and-Coming Colleges</p>
<p>[Best</a> Colleges - Education - US News and World Report](<a href=“http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/national-uc-rank]Best”>http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/national-uc-rank)</p>
<p>Most Popular Colleges</p>
<p>[Most</a> Popular Colleges: National Universities - US News and World Report](<a href=“http://www.usnews.com/articles/education/best-colleges/2009/01/26/most-popular-colleges-national-universities.html?PageNr=1]Most”>http://www.usnews.com/articles/education/best-colleges/2009/01/26/most-popular-colleges-national-universities.html?PageNr=1)</p>
<p>High School Counselor Ranking </p>
<p>[Best</a> Colleges - Education - US News and World Report](<a href=“http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/national-counselor-rank]Best”>http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/national-counselor-rank)</p>
<p>Ohio State Master Plan</p>
<p>[OSU</a> Vision Would Move S.R. 315 | NBC 4i](<a href=“http://www2.nbc4i.com/news/2010/jun/21/osu-vision-would-move-sr-315-ar-116906/]OSU”>http://www2.nbc4i.com/news/2010/jun/21/osu-vision-would-move-sr-315-ar-116906/)</p>
<p>Project One </p>
<p>[New</a> OSU Hospital Will Add Thousands Of Jobs | NBC 4i](<a href=“http://www2.nbc4i.com/news/2010/jun/18/new-osu-hospital-will-add-thousands-jobs-ar-114641/]New”>http://www2.nbc4i.com/news/2010/jun/18/new-osu-hospital-will-add-thousands-jobs-ar-114641/)</p>
<p>The buckeye academics are full steam ahead, rolling on all cylinders under the leadership of President Gee!! lol~</p>
<p>“Michigan’s (average) rank in peer assessment is 13 while it’s average rank among HSCs is 22. So significant net drop, but yes its yield will help.”</p>
<p>Actually, among HSCs, Michigan is #20…I think. Either way, clearly, university presidents know more than High School Counselors! ;)</p>
<p>Seriously though, I think the HSC rating will count significantly less than the PA, so that alone will probably not alter than rankings too much.</p>
<p>If these changes proposed by USNWR are implemented, it will greatly increase the stress associated with the college admissions process. You better bet that MIT, Caltech, and Chicago (and maybe HYPS) will go to ED to increase yield (or possibly append an ED system to their present EA systems). Students will have to apply to an ED school since RD will remain ridiculously competitive.</p>
<p>I think the proposed changes are absolutely ridiculous. For instance, counselor rankings put Brown and Cornell ahead of Caltech and Chicago. The big name Ivy schools are benefitted while the academically excellent schools that don’t focus on name brand will have problems. Obviously, college counselors don’t know as much as college presidents, so such an implementation is really absurd.</p>
<p>INCREASE weight of graduation rate? You mean the easier schools jump in the ranks while the harder schools get the shaft again? Caltech and Chicago are in trouble, while the Ivy League schools known for grade inflation will get a boost. Why doesn’t USNWR just make half of the ranking determined by the average GPA of a school (where the higher the GPA, the higher the score)?</p>
<p>Eliminate 3rd tier? So now there’s just a 1st tier and a 4th tier? This is a joke. US News is just trying to appease the people that go to crappy schools. They know that people who go to 4th tier schools don’t read their newspaper (since the sad truth is that most of them can hardly read in the first place), so might as well try to boost the egos of everyone in a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd tier school.</p>
<p>I just lost the remainder of the little respect I had for US News. It has become a ‘prestige’ ranking, and not an ‘academic’ ranking. Looking at confidentialcoll’s list, does this list NOT align almost exactly with lay prestige and not with academic quality?</p>
<p>@confidentialcoll, just curious, why do you expect Dartmouth to move up so much?</p>
<p>Wait, so yield and HS counselor ratings are definitely coming back? I thought it wasn’t sure.</p>
<p>Here we go again…with the serial obsessed with college rankings, as if “their school” ranking means something about them personally (positively or negatively). NOT!</p>
<p>There are many outstanding colleges in the 3rd and 4th tier by the way. College is supposed to be a transformational experience and one that helps kids grow intellectually, physically, spiritually, socially and sometimes athletically. To me the measure of success in a college is the measure of how well they perform their functions in serving their student clientele, helping them become productive citizens and better human beings.</p>
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<p>dartmouth has an extremely low peer assessment because they are more of an LAC, even though by most measures dartmouth offers a top notch undergrad education. Counselors rate it highly and its yield is good relative to chicago, duke and caltech.</p>
<p>does anyone have the list/can post the list of PA scores?</p>
<p>confidentialcoll, I am not sure I agree that Dartmouth’s PA is “extremely” low. Northwestern, UVa also have 4.3 PA scores and Brown, Duke and Michigan have PAs of 4.4 while UCLA and Carnegie Mellon have PAs of 4.2. Those are all excellent universities.</p>
<p>Harvard 4.9
MIT 4.9
Princeton 4.9
Stanford 4.9
Yale 4.8
Cal 4.7
Caltech 4.6
Chicago 4.6
Columbia 4.6
Cornell 4.5
Johns Hopkins 4.5
Penn 4.5
Brown 4.4
Duke 4.4
Michigan 4.4
Dartmouth 4.3
Northwestern 4.3
UVa 4.3
Carnegie Mellon 4.2
UCLA 4.2
UNC 4.1
WUSTL 4.1
Wisconsin-Madison 4.1
Emory 4.0
Georgetown 4.0
Georgia Tech 4.0
Rice 4.0
UIUC 4.0
Vanderbilt 4.0</p>