<p>I've been thinking recently about the collegeboard's claims about the new SAT's ability to predict a student's success in college. Now i do not dispute that the scores do indeed correlate to college GPA, but i don't buy their explanation that the new writing section "tests skills that are fundamental to success in college". It seems more likely to me that the students who fared well on the SAT tend to succeed in college not because they can whip out 25 minute essays or identify gramatical errors, but rather because they carry over the study skills that they used to prepare for this "new sat" into their college classrooms.</p>
<p>Granted, there are the "lazy geniuses" out there who can walk into the testing room and pull out a 2400 with little to no prep. However, that is simply where the error in the SAT's prediction power lies. These lazy students will go on to college or their future profession and eventually drop out or get laid off. If the ability to study effectively is the true indicator of college success, perhaps we should devise a system that can more accurately measure it. Oh wait, we already have one. It's called GPA.</p>
<p>you seem to assume that everyone studies for the SAT's. I would assert that that's not the case, and that for the bulk of students taking the test, the SAT measures something other than study skills</p>
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It seems more likely to me that the students who fared well on the SAT tend to succeed in college not because they can whip out 25 minute essays or identify gramatical errors, but rather because they carry over the study skills that they used to prepare for this "new sat" into their college classrooms.
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<p>That's not an attack on the validity of the test, of course.</p>
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If the ability to study effectively is the true indicator of college success, perhaps we should devise a system that can more accurately measure it. Oh wait, we already have one. It's called GPA.
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<p>Most of the time, GPA's from different schools can't be compared to one another just because of the rigor and difficulty of that school itself. So a 4.0 in one school might be easier, or harder to get than a 4.0 in another school. So if a student 1, gets into a more selective and rigorous college because of their high grades at a not so rigorous school, then chances are, that student will have a hard time doing well that college.</p>
<p>Also, GPA can be inflated highly. The SAT's can't.</p>
<p>personally, the writing section really showcases my natural ability for grammar, which i've never even learned in school really.</p>
<p>i mean, i don't know. i think if you DONT study, it shows your natural ability to learn, etc., like it was initially supposed to.
in terms of just, how smart people are, psats are probably a better indicator. just because you know.. at least at my school, people don't study and most get in the 30's and 40's. the real smart people get decent scores. but by a year later, most of the 30's and 40's have increased to 50's and 60's.. not by learning anything new, just by studying.
but colleges WANT people that know how to study. and the sat probably is a pretty good indicator of how well you studied. because honestly, if you take really similar tests again and again and again and again and again like some people do to practice, eventually you'll get good at it. which, i guess could be considered a form of a prediction of college success?</p>
<p>pachydermia, I gagged on my coffee when I read your post. Thanks....thanks alot.... bc09, keep in mind that homeschooled students don't have a GPA, and that colleges don't even look at writing, so why bother mentiong the flawed essay? The SAT, ACT, and subject tests are the only form of "formal transcripts" that colleges can have for students like myself. (Besides college courses, which most do not take)The verbal section 100% shows your ability to understand a story. I did BAD on the verbal. (I'm still going to use the 98 degree temperature as an excuse for my atrocious score.) Not like 450 or anything, but not nearly as well as I hoped. What does this bad score mean? Does it mean that the student who gets 780 on verbal is capable of interpreting a story better than I am? Absolutely. Vocabulary also determines your experience with reading and writing. Mathematics is also very accurate for determining your overall thinking skills. Do you see the problem as it is shown to you, or do you see the problem as it SHOULD be shown to you? Can you decipher the problem that is jam packed with hidden details? All of these are vital skills needed to succeed in college. I don't mean pulling through with a C avearge; I mean making it to the top of your level. That's what Harvard and Princeton and all the other "why-won't-they-let-me-in-dammit!" colleges want.</p>
<p>"Granted, there are the "lazy geniuses" out there who can walk into the testing room and pull out a 2400 with little to no prep. However, that is simply where the error in the SAT's prediction power lies. These lazy students will go on to college or their future profession and eventually drop out or get laid off."</p>
<p>Seems like you have a grudge against those who don't study. Why is that?</p>
<p>Pfft, How does anything in College Board predict success?
I got a 5 on the AP Lit test, yet only 660 on the SAT II Lit section, and a 630/630/630 on the SAT I. So, do my low Writing and Critical Reading Scores digress from my predicted success in a College Writing Class? Yes.
Do they prove anything? No!</p>
<p>Zester, your knowledge of literature has nothing to do with your SAT I scores. I don't know what happened to your SAT II's, but the writing doesn't determine what your true writing skills does. The verbal and math, on the other hand, DO show what your reading and math THINKING skills are. Speed is a factor of course, but which college would admit a student who takes thirty minutes to read and understand an 800 word article?</p>
<p>I thought that the essay portion helps colleges pick out if the student actually wrote their college app essay. Other than that, I don't see how the writing portion can help predict college success.</p>
<p>I think the writing section is a valuable predictor of college success. If you can't pick out the best sentence when it's sitting right in front of you, you're likely to produce college essays that resemble some of the passages the writing section asks you to correct.</p>
<p>I have a lot of friends with very low SAT scores, but they are incredibly smart kids and I'm sure they'll do amazing in college. Some people are simply just not good at standardized tests and it doesn't mean that people who are, are going to do better in college. I'm not going to completely bash the SAT (okay maybe i did just a little :)) and I will say I can respect it a tiny bit for a few reasons. My class rank is low because I took the most challenging classes I could and I still maintained a 3.8. But the grades are so inflated at my school that there were tons of kids with 4.0's and 3.9's ranked ahead of me even those their classes were incredibly easy. Literally we had kids ranked in the top ten taking algebra 2 in their junior year, but they're getting 1400's on the SAT so obviously they will not get into top schools. Sometimes SAT scores can weed out kids with inflated GPA's. (if that makes sense?)</p>