Yes I would think so. But if someone has lost time from work or has high medical bills because of someone else’s actions, the offender should have to pay those bills/reimburse the victim IMO. If someone hits you with their car, who pays your medical bills? Isn’t it the person who hit you, intentional or not? I know when that happened to my family, our insurance company went after the person. The insurance company paid my bills but were reimbursed by the offender.
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It’s an invisible virus. Can you see it being transmitted. Can you prove for a fact where that invisible germ came from. They are saying you can transmit even if vaccinated. Unless someone intentionally coughs on someone, the idea of charging someone unvaccinated with assault is the most ludicrous idea I’ve ever heard.
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You can do a simple online search and easily find lawyers willing to consider a COVID transmission case as an assault. Unfortunately, you can easily find lawyers willing to take cases for anything. So I guess I found the answer to my original question earlier this morning.
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Reported August 25. Natural infection provides 13x more protection than 2 dose series of the Pfizer vaccine.
Having a hard time figuring out how to link the study.
This story makes me sick. I know we’ve been told to have empathy for the unvaxxed, but, quite frankly, it just gets me more angry.
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Please share the study. There’s already posted peer-reviewed literature stating the opposite. But if you compare someone’s antibody levels a week after recovery from infection to someone’s antibody levels 8 months post-vaccination, especially if they were elderly or on immunosuppressants, then I would bet the person post recovery would have higher levels.
Trying to figure out how to link it. I’m technologically impaired
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Is this it?
Conclusions This study demonstrated that natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalization caused by the Delta variant of SARS-CoV-2, compared to the BNT162b2 two-dose vaccine-induced immunity. Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant.
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Yes. That’s the one I saw.
Interesting study. Of course it doesn’t account for all those who didn’t survive the infection. It only has those who survived in the “pool” (better natural immunity) vs in the vaccinated group there very well could have been some who wouldn’t have survived without having been vaccinated and they could be the “bad” cases post vax.
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Not suggesting anyone should get Covid to get the immunity but many are not getting the vaccine because they have previously had Covid. This study would indicate they don’t need to. My spouse had one dose then got Covid which is indicated to have the best immunity. My spouse did not get the second dose yet and is debating whether it is necessary.
I have two doses of Pfizer and feel that my spouse is better protected than I am.
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Regarding liability on someone who is unvaccinated, has there been any precedent involving more established vaccines such as measles, HPV or Flu? My guess is that precedent is as important as facts and circumstances would be. To establish liability, the claimant would not only have to show a fact pattern but also would need to demonstrate how such issues are handled in case law. If the parents of Measles Mary have been on the hook for hospital costs and lost work associated with infecting a school full of kids, then Covid Candace may find herself in court as well. However, my hunch is that short of personal contact outside of work place or school or venue, any lawsuit resulting from symptomatic infection would be directed at the institution and not any individuals. The institution will have deeper pockets and it might be easier to establish something like failure to provide a safe workplace or school or customer environment.
More good news regarding Pfizer vaccine safety.
The vaccine was found to be safe: Out of 25 potential side effects examined, 4 were found to have a strong association with the vaccine.
Myocarditis was found to be associated with the vaccine, but rarely—2.7 excess cases per 100,000 vaccinated individuals. (The myocarditis events observed after vaccination were concentrated in males between 20 and 34.) In contrast, coronavirus infection in unvaccinated individuals was associated with 11 excess cases of myocarditis per 100,000 infected individuals.
Other adverse events moderately associated with vaccination were swelling of the lymph nodes, a mild side effect that is part of a standard immune response to vaccination, with 78 excess cases per 100,000, appendicitis with 5 excess cases per 100,000 (potentially as a result of swelling of lymph nodes around the appendix), and herpes zoster with 16 excess cases per 100,000.
In contrast to the relatively small number of adverse effects associated with the vaccine, high rates of multiple serious adverse events were associated with coronavirus infection among unvaccinated patients, including: Cardiac arrhythmias (a 3.8-fold increase to an increase of 166 cases per 100,000 infected patients), kidney damage (14.8-fold increase; 125 excess cases per 100,000), pericarditis (5.4-fold increase; 11 excess cases per 100,000), pulmonary embolism (12.1-fold increase; 62 excess cases per 100,000), deep vein thrombosis (3.8-fold increase; 43 excess cases per 100,000), myocardial infarction (4.5-fold increase; 25 excess cases per 100,000), and stroke (2.1-fold increase; 14 excess cases per 100,000).
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High vaccination rates in the country (> 80% over age 12, > 90% over age 60). Greater than 85% of the unvaccinated are less than 50. Older people are orders of magnitude more likely to be hospitalized with a respiratory virus than younger (> 50 over 20 times more likely to be hospitalized than < 50). Hospitalizations in Israel are now increasing in the vaccinated which you would expect given that such a high proportion are vaccinated statistically the hospitalized portion will flip. It’s base rate bias. But the people being hospitalized are because of waning immunity, dropping antibody levels, in elderly who were vaccinated 8 months ago, which is why they began the boosters before the US.
Agreed on that, though my long haul son and others like him have improved considerably after getting vaccinated post Covid.
The harm comes when people think they are better off getting Covid than the vax. There are lots of graves, long haulers, and serious other issues that should be weighed before making that decision as we don’t know going forward who will do well and who won’t.
My long hauler was in his 20s. Medical boy’s GF works in a ward of people recovering from Covid. It’s ugly in there and not all are old and while most do, not all come out alive (usually blood clots for that).
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The bigger issue is that she went to work for 2 days after she became symptomatic.
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I had heard some people with long haul were improving with vaccines. Makes me very happy that your son was one of them. My spouse has no long haul symptoms so that benefit does not exist. One dose plus Covid feels pretty protective for us. No final decision has been made on second dose (technically it might be considered be a booster at this point).
Unfortunately, “vaccine passports” don’t account for having previously had Covid. Every report I’ve read on why they are pushing vaccines for the previously infected has stated it is encouraged because “we just don’t know” how long natural immunity lasts. This study would indicate it’s lasting longer and better than a vaccine series. Our bodies are amazing things and doing what it is supposed to do when providing natural immunity.
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Regarding the article about natural immunity being better than the vaccine against Delta. A couple of points. This is against Delta and was not the case against other variants AND it was only for people who had Covid in January or February of 2021. Natural immunity does wane. At this point in time, against this specific variant, fairly recent natural immunity was better than vaccination, NOT natural immunity is better than vaccination.
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You can nitpick the study and try to decide which natural immunity is better than the other. My spouse feels pretty protected. I feel my spouse is better protected than I am.
I would like to see studies showing how many previous Covid infected are getting infected again. Haven’t seen any. Not saying it’s not possible just saying I’m seeing a lot more about vaccine break through cases than I am about reinfection.
I look at this new study as really good news. It means that those who have been infected and are not getting the vaccine are less risk and means we are closer to herd immunity. I’m not going to spend a lot of time looking at ways to not accept good news. That’s just me!
Friends bil just died last week of covid. Delta variant. He had covid last winters end didn’t get vaccinated. Obviously just one data point but only 60 years old and no other conditions.