I’m looking at VAERS data now and there are quite a few reports of stroke (confirmed) and strokelike symptoms. There’s always the “was it going to happen anyway” question – the causation/correlation question – but I’ll check and see if there are any studies going on to investigate that. Patients had both Pfizer and Moderna (and J&J), doesn’t seem to do with any particular vax or vax type.
I believe we were two of us had Pfizer and one had Moderna.
Can’t get into the “was it going to happen anyway’ as it did happen to 3 of us directly after the shot.
Would maybe consider getting the booster if I thought it was more effective but several I know have had the booster have gotten it and gotten pretty sick. I know several unvaccinated who have gotten it recently with more mild symptoms than everyone I know who has gotten it with vaccine.
Please don’t take that as I think the vaccine is not working, I just can’t sign up for a booster based on my own medical reaction coupled with the idea that the booster is just not as effective as I would like it to be.
Also, we were one confirmed stroke with two of us having “stroke like” reaction.
No, of course, if there’s something specific to your family (and others with a similar trait) that makes the vax dangerous, that’s obviously something to take into consideration.
The “was it going to happen anyway” question has to do with the total population of people reporting strokelike/stroke events some days after vax. If some just happened to have the two events happen near each other without causation, you’d want to exclude them from studies investigating the connection. But you’d need to know how to tell the two groups apart first.
It’s normal for drugs to affect different people differently, and for side effects to turn up in what I call “Phase IV” after rollout. Normally they’re quite rare, but it can still be very useful to find out what’s going on with them so that you can screen people ahead of time and not, you know, give them a vax that’ll cause a stroke, even if it’s a rare side effect. There are similar efforts that go into prescribing particular cancer drugs.
eta: seeing a number of studies from last summer on Bell’s palsy after vax, which all look like they’re looking for evidence of non-coincidence with various vaccines…will be back in a bit to look again for vax/stroke incidence studies and who’s doing them. Someone in that area that is who you’d want to get in touch with directly, keeping in mind that science is s-l-o.
Anecdotal but a friend I work with had a stroke like reaction after his second shot. Temporarily lost some coordination and had focus/concentration/memory issues. They cleared up in a day or so. He did go on to get the booster recently and had nothing this time.
I believe there can be something genetic to some of these issues. I know another family that also had bad reactions in several members. Our family has noticed nothing out of the ordinary. Just the standard side effects.
I am sorry for the experiences that you and your family members have had. But, I do have two questions: 1) How do you know they were connected to the vaccine and 2) How do you know any of you wouldn’t have similar, or worse, effects from covid (stroke and stroke like symptoms are not uncommon in covid patients)?
Regardless, I would consult my physician and act accordingly, especially if I had an at-risk condition, which at least 75% of US adults have. People with Certain Medical Conditions | CDC
I wish you and your family good health.
ETA
Indirectly they already have changed the definition, because vaccinated unboosted people are now supposed to quarantine for 5 days after exposure (same as completely unvaccinated people), which boosted people do not have to do.
I don’t. How do you know it wasn’t? One of us maybe. 3 of us, too coincidental for me to knowingly inject something in my body that has already possibly been the cause for stroke and stroke like reaction. This isn’t a stat on paper saying there is very low risk. This is a reality for me and my brother and my mother.
I don’t for me and my mother but I do for my brother. He just got over Covid at Thanksgiving , and he didn’t have a stroke or stroke like symptoms. As a matter of fact, about 15 people from that event got Covid and no one had a stroke or stroke like symptoms. Another brother and his wife just got over Covid. He has significant heart issues and we were very nervous but he did fine, had a mild case and did not have a stroke or stroke like symptoms. As a matter of fact I could name 50 plus people who have had Covid (probably more) if I were to really sit down and list them. No one had a stroke or stroke like symptoms. No one has long Covid. One late 80’s died with Covid last year but he was already in the process of being moved to hospice. This may all be anecdotal to you but it’s my reality. So, yes. I am making a decision based on my own medical reaction to the shot.
No. They have not changed the definition. So yes, I am fully vaccinated. If and when they change the definition then I will no longer be considered fully vaccinated.
Thank you. Wishing you and your family good health as well and a very Happy New Year.
Incredibly happy for you and your family and continued best wishes as this will be a long journey for us all.
Obviously, I hope everyone in your family continues to mask and socially distance. That is something they can do. Every day for the past week I have been receiving urgent texts from the hospital asking people to round and discharge patients that can go home first thing in the morning to free up the beds for the saturated EDs. 90-100 waiting in the ED with 30 outside right now. I’m sorry for anyone who needs to go to the ED, people like your family members if something else bad happens, because if anything else happens to them it will be a long time before they get any attention unfortunately. They need to be especially careful.
ETA: WAY too many sick people with Covid out there right now clogging the EDs.
The Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are fairly similar, though the Moderna vaccine has a larger dose of mRNA. The J&J vaccine is different in using an adenovirus vector (like the AstraZeneca and Sputnik vaccines used in some other places). There are also inactivated virus vaccines and protein subunit vaccines used elsewhere or in trials.
If your family has a genetic related issue with the vaccines gotten, it may be worth considering whether it is based on the vaccine platform (mRNA versus adenovirus vector versus …) or the actual payload (the spike protein). If the former, then it may be safer to choose a different vaccine platform. If the latter, then getting infected with the real virus is likely to be much worse, since it will keep making spike proteins in far greater numbers.
Yeah, I was wondering about that, and about how the clotting/stroke cases sort in covid victims, esp given that the clotting news and some VAERS reports involve J&J. I never thought I’d be saying we don’t have enough cell-and-smaller biological scientists (money, labs, etc.) in America, but I think’s actually the case right now. There’s too much to sort through from this thing, and that’s just one virus.
Plenty of brains, hands, and labs. All what is lacking is finding for this work. It is a sad situation when a biotech that already saved multiple lives from cancer is valued less than a company that offers an app that lets you have a beer delivered to your door in 30 minutes.
Middle-aged vaxed/boosted/masking hospital worker with covid-recovering long-haul spouse is now in ICU & hoping not to be intubated, under orders to stop tweeting and rest. Spouse and others taking over updates.
VAERS is probably working through a huge backlog. I did v-safe, and actually got contacted by the CDC when I had a medical issue after my booster. But v-safe was never promoted much.
@CTTC I tried to update V Safe when they sent me a text about updating (I had gotten my booster). I tried to respond…it didn’t work. They sent me several different “codes” to try and none of those worked. I finally gave up. I’m sure I’m not the only one.
I’m sure many gave up, too. I sent CDC an email, and their instructions to me worked. As with so many things about CDC (we know now), it was a well-conceived but poorly-executed idea. Of course, now I’m thinking CDC doesn’t even have well-conceived ideas anymore (for example, their new quarantine/isolation guidelines).
According to the U.S. Department of Education, 54% of U.S. adults 16-74 years old - about 130 million people - lack proficiency in literacy, reading below the equivalent of a sixth-grade level…
Adults who scored below Level 3 for literacy on the PIAAC were defined as at least partially illiterate. Adults below or at Level 1 may struggle to understand texts beyond filling out basic forms, and they find it difficult to make inferences from written material. Adults at Level 2 can read well enough to evaluate product reviews and perform other tasks requiring comparisons and simple inferences, but they’re unlikely to correctly evaluate the reliability of texts or draw sophisticated inferences. Adults at Level 3 and above were considered fully literate. They’re able to evaluate sources, as well as infer sophisticated meaning and complex ideas from written sources.
There is no connection between illiteracy and scientific illiteracy. I am partially illiterate based on these tests, and have worked in a scientific field forever without a problem. I know many in the same boat.
I don’t agree that a low score on a literacy test is a problem, but that is another topic.
This is a classic example of a survey creating more questions than it answers, correlation/causation, etc. They could probably conclude the same thing about ACT scores. Should we assume that we are “losing” X amount of money in the economy because not every student is scoring a 36?
Regarding vaccine hesitancy, I also don’t think scientific literacy has anything to do with it. It has everything to do with trust, and acknowledging this would required everyone to accept some level of fault for the current situation. Unlikely to happen.
