I didn’t berate anyone over anything, merely pointed out that medical professionals unfortunately often have to deal with extraordinarily difficult patients and their family members. I don’t blame anyone for venting about it but it is a fact of life.
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You are right. The berating comment was to be directed at the other two posters, and was just lumped together in one post
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Let’s move on, please.
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Thank you. The others got off on their own tangent and linked it (somehow) to my post apparently.
And yes to this too. MIL had Alzheimer’s and it was awful. We tried to explain to those who might not have known simply by saying Alzheimer’s. Some nodded and understood. Others will probably figure it out someday. The guy on drugs who knocked my guy out surprised everyone in the room because he hadn’t been aggressive. Nonetheless, blame was placed on the drugs and he learned to be more wary, that’s for sure. Getting abusive due to wanting woo woo drugs when it’s been all over the news that those aren’t effective and aren’t used doesn’t fit the paradigm. Most he deals with who die of Covid (and their loved ones) aren’t nearly so abusive, even if they were requesting those treatments.
Some people are just jerks and likely are in various settings, not just hospitals TBH. They’re getting “a” point across, but I doubt it’s the one they want to be sharing.
But whatever… moving on.
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Actually, I need to point out one additional thing. When I bring up my medical lad - which is often with Covid - it’s because he’s my source. It may be my science background, but I always prefer knowing the source, so always try to provide one when I share something that doesn’t start with “me.” Sometimes it’s links to AAMC, JAMA, or a news source. Other times it’s from my medical lad/his GF working in hospitals and dealing with it or hearing things. Once in a while it’s my ED department nurse neighbor.
When one knows the source they know the pros and cons of that source. In his case, it’s one or two hospitals and then his/GF’s experiences within them - the equivalent of a data point vs a study or something read on social media. To a science minded person, the distinction between sources is important.
I’m sorry if that offends some people, but honestly, I don’t plan to change. I do the same on other threads where my source is kids/parents from my school district, my farming or financial lads, my experience with Alzheimers which comes from my MIL, or anything else that is thread appropriate. Sources are important info for me to know, therefore I provide them when I share my info.
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I agree with you, but at the same time you have to remember these people have been brainwashed. It’s a cult. I’m angry at the people who deliberately created the cult and spread the misinformation.
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I agree. But my anger extends to those who would chastise medical professionals (or their families) for calling for civility and sanity.
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In the country and even as I track this thread, there are those who have favored a more laissez-faire approach to Covid and those who favor a more activist approach. There is some overlap between those who favor a more individualistic ideology and those that favor a more communitarian ideology, though I don’t think the overlap is crisp. As @mtmind observed, those in the laissez-faire camp seem to emphasize the costs, often hidden, like mental health, suicides, educational dysfunction and delays, and loss of jobs and bankruptcies due to lockdowns, etc. and of preventative measures like vaccines (though disparagement of vaccines has diminished in CC’s threads over time) and masks (disparagement probably increasing over time) and vaccines, shutdowns and social distancing, and mask mandates, and downplaying the costs of not using/requiring preventative measures (there’s an over-emphasis, I think, of the effects of the vaccine on oneself and a de-emphasis of the effects of getting infected on others chances of getting infected) including hidden costs like long Covid. Those in the more activist camp probably are de-emphasizing the hidden costs of activist approaches and focusing more on the direct costs of not using preventative measures (higher infection rates, hospitals operating beyond capacity, non-Covid ailments not being treated, deaths, etc.) although I don’t think even this group tends to give sufficient weight to the potential long-term consequences of long Covid.
The US overall has adopted a more laissez-faire approach than most other developed nations. Overall, we have and continue to have higher death rates per capita.
I have also seen other articles recently that show that things are actually worse than this. Excess deaths (i.e. those that are unexplained) are much higher over the last two years than in previous years.
To the extent that the laissez-faire v. activist split is explanatory, one does see higher death rates in counties that voted for Trump than those who didn’t. That was not true prior to the introduction of the vaccines but only came about when vaccinations became politicized.
Not a pretty set of pictures.
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The US also has a much sicker population, with less access to affordable health care, than other wealthy countries, and an absence of paid leave policies for those who are sick.
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be careful with drawing conclusions to raw data, shaw. The US is the most overweight country in the western world, and since obesity is a risk factor for bad covid outcomes…
One really needs to solve for age & other demographics as well as other co-morbidities, to compare apples to apples. Then you also have to consider access to health care. Rural areas are less likely to have ICU’s, respiratory personnel and vents in comparison to the urban cores (Biden voters) which have massive medical complexes, medical schools and top medical professionals, even on a per capita basis.
edited to add: when asked on a Sunday Show, the US Surgeon General responded today that “elderly and obesity” were the two biggest co-morbidities to having a bad outcome from covid.
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Not getting political, but the lack of a national health insurance system that provides easy access to doctors means many Americans can’t afford to visit doctors when they get sick or do not even have a doctor to visit.
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Since covid affected the elderly primarily, nearly all were covered by Medicare. Part A, hospitalization, is free.
That said, I’d love to see any data which indicates those who died lacked insurance, particularly since the feds picked up the bills early on. (yeah, I get that many/most had no idea that the feds would pick up bills taht their insurance did not.) Look at the chart in teh NYT article posted by shaw. While the US was the worst, the Euro countries right below have national health services, so they didn’t fare a whole lot better wrt to deaths per capita. Japan and Australia did extremely well, but then they are essentially islands that went into complete lockdown. Not possible in the US with large, open airports and borders.
Absent any data, your post does lean towards that p-word.
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I was reading this article earlier today. It’s a sobering read and not really limited to the south, so I’m surprised at the title. It talks more about the rural divide and medical access due to closed hospitals (and more), plus how Covid threw it into a mess causing people to die, both Covid sufferers and those who couldn’t get “other” treatment due to overwhelmed hospitals where they were still open.
It honestly has me wondering about donating some of our charity donations to hospitals, but I have no idea how to figure out which ones need money, not to mention, there are oodles of people/places/causes to be donating to right now - all desperate for more funds to help people.
The system needs fixing.
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We just spent two days traveling to Florida from MA. I hate driving through DC so we went west through PA then down through VA on 81, then south through Charlotte, NC. We make frequent stops to stretch our legs so we got a good feel for how people were behaving down the way. I can report that America has decided covid is over.
The rest areas were packed - lots of people traveling. The entire way, through two days, I saw five masks total. One in CT, one in PA, one in VA, and two in NC. We went to the supermarket after we got here and there was not a mask in sight.
The regional differences are so interesting. Not sure where in CT you stopped, but in my area of the state, the vast majority are still masking everywhere.
It was a rest area on the Merritt Parkway, close to the NY border.
Maybe the people who are traveling are behaving differently than those who aren’t.
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The route you chose made a big difference. 81 is rural, then you were in the south. Masking was probably never high on that route - or at least it wasn’t when we took 81/77 to Charlotte visiting our oldest son over the past couple of years.
Roads are definitely packed all over, but even here in PA, where we travel matters for masks (and always has). Where I am never reached > 75% even in the peaks. Traveling 95 or 301 to VA still has several masked people. In NY, rural tends to be unmasked, but as soon as one gets to a major city, it differs. Same when we went to OH earlier this month helping our son move.
But yes, traffic has definitely returned and that’s been true for a year or so. I had hoped higher gas prices might have made a dent, but so far if it has, we haven’t seen it.
ETA I suspect we’re not alone in choosing to do what the majority does, so many of the same travelers in a masked vs unmasked area could opt differently. I still carry a mask with me, just in case. I haven’t needed it since returning home.
We did the same drive a couple of weeks ago, staying overnight in Rocky Mount NC. In Florida, even in a community where the median age is really high, customers had stopped wearing masks. AFAIK, Covid does not exist in FL. Below DC, no one wore masks, even in crowded bars. We would stop every 3 hours roughly at a Starbucks, where the staff were required to be masked. We stopped at a rest stop above DC and I think the vast majority of folks were masked.
In Massachusetts, we are seeing declining mask usage. Patrons and employees are masked only by choice at our local supermarket. We actually went indoors for a meal for the first time in many months. Servers were masked. Costco employees are masked as are a fair percentage of the customers.
I am watching a lot of college basketball in many different venues all over. Few masks.
The first question that came to mind was what were the masking requirements of each locale that you travelled through? If that State/County has removed masking restrictions (ostensibly following ‘the science’), why would you not expect to find un-masked?
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