<p>If you take a group of talented and bright individuals and track their success in college, you'll find factors like: motivation, determination, emotional stability, organization, etc. have a much greater bearing on outcome than the minor differences in intellectual prowess. Some of these factors are, indeed, reflected in class standing. I would think top achieving kids would also be top achieving adults.</p>
<p>What if your school does not rank, and only shows salutorian and valedictorian... and we find out much later (we find out in April, so by then it doesn't really matter)? I think that the val.'s (Weighted.. we only rank by weighted) GPA is around 4.25, whereas my GPA is around 4.2 or 4.19. Does it really make that big a difference? Now I'm scared. Plus, since my school doesn't rank, I think my counselor just put "top 10%" when it said specify nearest decile. I know I'm still top 1-2%, just not top 1-2 RANK. Maybe top 5 students. The article was a little vague on how many was the "few handful at the top."</p>
<p>At my High School last year the student who was the valedictorian was a jock and only took 4 APs her whole high school career - basically took easy courses like Theater Arts, Food Science. I think she got into Furman University whereas the 2nd and 3rd took over 12 APs and ended up at Princeton and UPenn.</p>
<p>How much advantage does being val or sal give though, assuming other stats are the same?</p>
<p>my school doesn't rank and anyone who gets above a 4.0 is a valedictorian... soo im guessing valedictorian doesnt really help out in my case</p>
<p>I think it's hard to predict how much val or sal actually help but I'd guess it's an excellent predictor of college success when coupled with a demanding course schedule.</p>
<p>Our son is val by a good margin and is one of the least competitive kids you'd ever meet (unless you want to run the 800m). He's been taking AP classes since freshman year but has also taken non honors classes like theater and guitar because he wanted to.</p>
<p>I guess the title of my thread is misleading. By valedictorian, I don't mean the historical use of the term (the student with the highest GPA who gives the graduation speech), but instead the contemporary meaning (the student ranked class rank 1). </p>
<p>Actually, after reading Attewell's research paper, I'm more interested in the significant difference between the admit rates of two pools: those ranked in the Top 1-2% and those who fall in the Top 5%.</p>
<p>superstresseddd, you should read Hernandez's explanation of the academic index. Though a bit outdated, the book that she wrote is quite revealing of how admission officers approach evaluating at the Ivy Leagues. In your case, the evaluation of your classes will determine where the college places you in "actual" rankings. Basically, upon submission, every applicant's class rank is reorganized, some more than others. If you don't have class rank, they will rank you regardless. This is a disadvantage because if your school only states that you are within the Top 1%, and say by GPA you are ranked 1, and your school is out of 500 people, the college may choose to set your recalculated rank around 2-3 because they can't determine the exact position.</p>
<p>^yeah, that sort of sucks. But i don't think valedictorian alone will get you in, will it?</p>
<p>No, it won't. That's why only 43% of valedictorians were accepted at UPenn last year. I guess the other 57% just weren't competitive enough. Still, that near 50% chance of admission does look incredibly enticing...</p>
<p>Does it matter if you know the statistics, the admittance rate of valedictorians? It's not like you can go back in time and change the way you approached your studies so that you could've gotten those straight A's and increased your chances of admittance. It's sort of a bad mentality as well--kind of saying that you're only in it for the A, not to actually learn stuff.</p>
<p>Living your life for the sole purpose of getting in college. Sounds sort of... not fun.</p>
<p>valedictorians are very good rule-followers (they have to be in order to get the As) so sometimes they aren't as creative as some others. I'm not saying that ALL are like that, but there probably are other factors than just being val ... that help you get in</p>
<p>explode, where can you get evidence for that assumption?</p>
<p>there was this study... i forgot where i found it, if i do find it i'll post</p>
<p>Valedictorians</a> Don't Stay At The Head of The Class, Says Education Researcher
[quote]
As high school valedictorians, they were the best and the brightest. Now, as adults, most of them are successful, well-adjusted and psychologically healthy, according to Asst. Prof. Karen Arnold (SOE), but in the working world they no longer find themselves at the head of the class.
"They obey rules, work hard and like learning, but they're not the mold breakers," said Arnold of the 81 Illinois high school valedictorians - 46 women and 35 men - she has tracked since their graduation in 1981. "They work best within the system and aren't likely to change it."
[/quote]
</p>
<p>^ true. But that doesn't neccesarily mean valedictorians are all zombish dull-minded rule lovers either. </p>
<p>I think what that study makes clear is that it doesnt really matter if you're valedictorian, and that it indicates NOTHING about your 'personal qualities' in any possible way. Its just whatever way your random school decided to randomly 'lolrank' students</p>