<p>Interesting article in the NYTimes: Was</a> Earning That Harvard M.B.A. Worth It?</p>
<p>The story examines the impact of an MBA, and in particular MBAs from elite B-schools. Mostly anecdotal data, unfortunately.</p>
<p>maybe you should just post the article, you can't read it without a new york times subscription</p>
<p>Signing up is free.</p>
<p>
[quote]
"The real value of an Ivy League business degree is arguably not the education itself, but the screening of intelligence, drive and past accomplishments that the schools do," said Ben Dattner, founding principal of Dattner Consulting in New York. "Just like with undergraduate degrees, if you're smart enough to get into a top-tier school, you're likely to inspire confidence."
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Kind of scary if companies are thinking like that. There are plenty of smart people with high SAT scores, gpas, etc who are rejected from top schools.</p>
<p>"Kind of scary if companies are thinking like that. There are plenty of smart people with high SAT scores, gpas, etc who are rejected from top schools."</p>
<p>Exactly. People that manage to get through are assumed to be more shrewd. The Admission Process to top schools is a transaction. You are marketing yourself like crazy to a school so you can pay them!!! If you are insightful enough to negotiate that process, manage to graduate with good grades and do well there in general (leadership, ECs, etc), you should have the qualities companies look for. On the other hand, if one is smart but so lethargic that doing more than merely opening a book when required is a hassle, well, I can't blame the companies for thinking that way.</p>
<p>For business school, in particular, the gap between college and applying to B-school is the student's opportunity to demonstrate what they are capable of doing.</p>
<p>There's also the theory that why you get an MBA is for all the networking contacts and friendships that'll be exploited. And for many, it's well worth the $$$ just for that alone, regardless of the value of the classroom education.</p>
<p>My mom got her MBA from a no-name school in Michigan. Big reason she was able to find a higher position at DaimlerChrysler. She could likely have gotten another promotion or two since then had she received it from a more-recognized school. She makes an awesome salary as it is, I can't imagine how it would be at a higher pay grade.</p>
<p>what if you got into a top tier school but believe that if you are smart you'll do good wherever you go and end up going to a state school on a full ride.... am I any less of a person just because I don't wanna blow 50k on a top-tier "name brand" school....I think NOT</p>
<p>"am I any less of a person just because I don't wanna blow 50k on a top-tier "name brand" school"</p>
<p>This is funny.</p>
<p>If you measure your self-worth by the education you receive, well, that's troubling. Look, if you measure your self-worth by the career opportunities you will have because of the education you pursue, then yes, you'd be, according to your logic, less of a person. You will not have the same opportunities if you attend a no-name MBA program. Besides, the cost of an MBA at a top school is easily covered by your increased earning potential. The really hard part is getting in.</p>
<p>Good State University MBA programs are almost just as expensive as private ones. Thus, it would not really make much sense to choose Ross over Harvard B-School (assuming you get into both).</p>
<p>A lot of it depends on your career goals. If you want to work in commercial banking as a branch manager, you may not even need to get an MBA -- a BA would do. On the other hand if you want to go into Strategy Consulting and I-Banking and have the opportunity to rise through the ranks, well, it's foolish to consider the lesser MBA programs. Does that make you less of a person? Of course not. But, that should not be the standard you use to measure your self-worth to begin with!</p>
<p>Maybe I am crazy, but 2 years into your job, what will matter more: your performance on the job or the perceived "value" and prestige and all that stuff of the degrees you hold? </p>
<p>I think the article was trying to emphasize that the more prestigious degrees offer you some sort of safety net. Even if you blow at whatever it is you do, there's still a company out there willing to take a shot on a <insert "elite"="" school="" here=""> MBA grad. </insert></p>
<p>Wildflower, let's just say someone with a BA or BS graduates at the top of their class, gets multiple offers in I-banking but also gets into some top-tier B-schools. He/she chooses to take the job, and at the same time that company brings in a Harvard MBA grad. The MBA grad starts at a higher position, better pay, all that - this is a given. Yet, let's say after their first two years on the job, the BA/BS guy has significantly outperformed the MBA grad. There's now an opening "higher up" in the company - who will they choose? The MBA because that person has a better degree, or the person who's performed better on the job? The choice is obvious. Sure, the Harvard degree will help, and if that person completely sucks at whatever job they take and end up out of work, it likely wouldn't take long for them to find another job because of the recognition that comes with their degree, yet its hardly a given that an MBA grad will automatically have more opportunities to advance - especially if they are sticking in the same company.</p>
<p>"Wildflower, let's just say someone with a BA or BS graduates at the top of their class..."</p>
<p>Heck, let just say that a third-grade kid gets an I-banking offer and outperforms the Harvard grad as well...</p>
<p>Unfortunately, the guy you mentioned, from a not elite school, WILL have a much tougher time landing that job. The reality is that the Harvard grad will not. It may not be fair, but it is how it works -- I think it's pretty fair. </p>
<p>Look, I didn't creat the system, that's just how it works. You can speculate that, say, snoopy will outperform Harvard MBAs in Investment Banking and any other industry -- which may or may not be true. But the fact remains that elite school grads will have better opportunities to get their foot in the door --what they do after is up to them. Nonetheless, let me add that usually successful alumni from one's school will be more willing to help you and mentor you, too. Thus, the advantage becomes more significant, as they will represent a majority of the people in I-banking and other "sexy" fields.</p>
<p>"Maybe I am crazy, but 2 years into your job"</p>
<p>Perhaps you are: two years into the job the ba/bs guy will most likely be kicked out, OR sent to get an elite MBA. Check out Deloitte's page for instance (not even an investment banking!). They recruit people from a broad group of undergrads; HOWEVER, one of the hiring criterion is "a desire to attent a top MBA in the future." Check it out, it's on their website <a href="http://www.deloitte.com%5B/url%5D">www.deloitte.com</a> </p>
<p>You see, for people who know, the quality/prestige/name of your MBA will matter a great deal; and, while there are exceptions for everything, why would you want to put yourself at a disadvantage because of some faulty logic. The private sector is not the place to be ranting about egalitarianism or advocating for educational reform. Besides, why would you want to attend a lesser school? Can't get in? (in which case it's understandble). If getting in to a top program is not a problem, however, by all means stop being so idealistic and hypothetical. Be a realist. We can all tell tales about underdogs conquering the world, but that doesn't change how things are done.</p>
<p>And keep in mind, we (most people on this forum) are not talking about all careers/jobs/industries. Mostly, we are referring to I-Banking, Strategy Consulting and some other high profile "sexy" jobs. You really don't need a Harvard MBA to sell cell phones in the mall.</p>
<p>blah screw all elitist bastards</p>
<p>you know, graduates of elite colleges are more likely to succeed if only because those elite colleges only accept the best and the brightest</p>
<p>you guys are missing a piece of the puzzle when it comes to promotion of jobs</p>
<p>you have
1) educational background
2) performance on the job</p>
<p>but you forgot a huge one</p>
<p>3) relationship with your boss</p>
<p>
[quote]
you know, graduates of elite colleges are more likely to succeed if only because those elite colleges only accept the best and the brightest
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Yeah, like Jeff Skilling! um, I think this statement is a little broad, because, although elite schools do have very difficult entrance requirements, those entrance requirements are based on a limited number of factors that, IMO (maybe yours will differ), don't cover the entire scope of "best and brightest".</p>
<p>relationship with your boss partially depends on your personnal ability and the rest on luck, and in the ability relates to you performance on the job and education</p>
<p>so at the end is your ability and luck. that applies to almost everything</p>
<p>not necessarily, really. there's a good number of those who get promoted who do a mediocre job and only have decent academic background (bachelor's from a regular state university). but they brag about themselves and go to lunch with management, and in turn become part of the management. at the same time, there's those who work their tail off or go get an MBA from a top school and get passed over because they're missing the connection with the management.</p>
<p>it's definitely not a rare occurrence in the corporate world. i hear about it all the time from my parents actually.</p>
<p>go to lunch with your boss is a work too, you need to spend time and have ability to do it</p>