<p>Nice story about your son, mom99! Our oldest started playing sports so she wouldn't have to do physical therapy..she has JRA...diagnosed at five. She continues to play sports in college. She did write about this for her college essays. Determination and heart can accomplish many good things!</p>
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I am afraid that his friends are going to get recruited and all his effort will not have any value.
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<p>Just something for the back of your mind: My H was a great h.s. football player, but too small for Div. 1 college football (5'11"), but he ended up on a Div.1 rugby team. Another boy at our local h.s. just accomplished the same transition to rugby at a top 25 university - and it is what got him admitted after his initial rejection - he called the rugby coach. He is about 5'7".</p>
<p>Son spent LOTS of time on his varsity sport in hs - and did well - including becoming a captain in senior year and achieving regional rankings. Big competitive hs - you really have to devote yourself to the sport year round if you want to even make a team. Turns out he was not good enough for a big D1 program though although he was recruited at some D3s (not really interested though). He did NOT get into his first two choices of schools. Excellent student and scores, but didn't have much in the way of leadership or school clubs (no time) but he was an Eagle Scout (not too shabby).
I agree with the poster that said that kids should follow their passions and do what they like. My son really enjoyed his sport - and it's one of those sports he can continue to play in his older years. So no regrets. But if you're looking to get into an elite school, and you're not good enough for the team - it may be hard to compete with all those folks who have stellar ECs. Don't think the sport really helped him there...</p>
<p>D was a multi sport athlete, including as mentioned above- rugby, she could not be recruited in rugby technically as it is an emerging NCAA sport and at schools a club sport, though a very serious club sport trying to go varsity at many schools.</p>
<p>She had minor other ECs, enough to fill out the boxes- student govt, did dance & other artsy pursuits, but her passion is sports and it showed on her apps. She made it into the 6 schools she chose, several very highly ranked, including two top publics and top LACs.....so even with "just" a club sport it affected her admissions.</p>
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she could not be recruited in rugby technically as it is an emerging NCAA sport and at schools a club sport, though a very serious club sport trying to go varsity at many schools.
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<p>Yes, thanks for clarifying and sorry a little off-topic, but for accuracy, H's rugby team was a Varsity sport at a Div.1 school, as was the team at the other boy's school I mentioned. They still do recruit somewhat, but not like the NCAA sports.</p>
<p>Last night I gave the "mom" reponse to this question.</p>
<p>This morning I asked my daughter, who is a recruited athlete for Ivies, now accepted at her dream school, if she thought her community service EC's mattered. She didn't hesitate to tell me that it certainly did. She said her various service activities were probed in interviews with coaches, other student/athletes on her visit, and in the "official" interview. We haven't seen her teacher and GC rec letters, but now that I consider this question again, I would guess that they would have described her service within the school at length: team captaincy, president of clubs, including service clubs, and her community volunteering. She didn't do these things with the college app in mind, but because she has trouble saying no, and feels "called" to causes. </p>
<p>I can't say whether most successful applicants to the Ivies have a similar sense of civic duty that has played out as service in high school. It would be nice to know.....</p>
<p>I guess I should clarify further- Women's Rugby is an NCAA emerging sport and varsity at half a dozen small east of the Rockies schools, men's is not, but some schools with $$ from alumni actually have a men's varsity program, but technically is it not NCAA varsity, though it is still varsity- like Berkeley ;)</p>
<p>D2 is currently being recruited D1-3. Her player profile list academics, sports and other ECs. She can't talk with coaches at the moment (unless on campus) but gets emails all the time asking about what else she is doing. Most of these questions come from the small D3 LACs like Emory, Carleton, Grinnell. The bigger schools don't ask so much.</p>
<p>Is it naive to think that good admissions officers have a good sense of which ECs take up a huge amount of time and which ones don't? I have a daughter who is a gymnast...she practices 15 hours a week (not counting meets). She could join every club in the school and it wouldn't take up 15 hours a week.</p>
<p>My freshman D played basketball from age 7 on. As a HS freshman, she was asked to play for a highly competitive Nike sponsored team that traveled all over the country to tournaments. She played for her high school varsity team (that went to the Class L state finals her junior and senior years). She was recruited by D1, D2 and D3 colleges (with scholarship monies offered). Basketball was her life. She chose the D3 school of her dreams, did the whole preseason workout, was told she had a spot on the starting five and decided.....she did not want to play anymore!!!
I think her Dad and I were sad (we always loved watching her play) but it was her decision to make. I guess my point is your D may think she wants to run in college, put her all into it in HS and then decide in college it is not for her. So unless she is absolutely intent on running in college I would suggest not putting all of her eggs in one basket. BTW....my D is so happy with the decision she made.</p>
<p>I have a different perspective. If D thinks that she might want to run track in college, she should first check out the times for varsity athletes at various schools in her events to see if it would even be plausible, and if so, at what level. If it is plausible, and she thinks that she wants to do it, in order to give herself the best chance she should put maximum energy into running unless and until she decides that it is too much.</p>
<p>By the way, based on my experience with a number of very highly selective DIII schools, I don't think that other ECs matter very much for recruited athletes. Mostly its based on the recruits GPA and test scores. After that, it is the Heidi Klum rule--either you're in, or you're out.</p>
<p>A guy I know from the national fencing circuit told me how his daughter was told to drop all her other ECs and just focus on her academics. She is now matriculating at Harvard.</p>
<p>G- sorry to hear your daughter is in a rough patch.</p>
<p>I have different advice from the other parents, probably colored by the fact that my kids are out there in the real world now, and a lot of the "noise" of HS and college is past history; plus the fact that my kids were always "tries the hardest and most improved" in whatever sport they played vs. being a serious athlete.</p>
<p>At the end of the day, your kid is going to emerge from HS half-baked, and then finish college a few years later mostly baked, and then a couple of years after that, be it grad school, work, etc. almost done (except for the continuous growth through middle age and beyond... ahem!) I think your job is to provide support and guidance through these stages and to help give grown up perspective when needed.</p>
<p>****ing match between band leader and coach? Who cares? Some day your daughter will have a boss who could care less that she's got a cranky toddler with an ear infection so she needs to leave work early to get the kid to the pediatrician. Your daughter may have a spouse who thinks her yoga class shouldn't take precedence over getting the oil changed. She may have a child with medical issues who needs weekly interventions or therapy and will need to balance that with another child's ballet class or need to get to the library.</p>
<p>Life is filled with these choices and balancing one's time and commitments and not disappointing people who are counting on you etc.</p>
<p>I don't think you can predict the future vis a vis college admissions, nor can you micromanage her schedule or pick her priorities. But- sleep for an adolescent is very very important, especially if she'll be driving soon. Zoned out kids behind the wheel who sleep 5 hours a night are a public health hazard. Finding non-academic activities that your D enjoys is very important for her self-esteem. Giving back to the community in some way to recognize all that she's been blessed with is also important.</p>
<p>If it were my kid I'd find time when we were both relaxed and not feeling too hyper to ask her whether she thinks a full time commitment to her sport is a gratifying plan going forward (i.e. spring, summer, next fall.) If the answer is yes, then help her carve out time to sleep and ignore everything else. She may have some opportunities for music and community service over the summer which would be great- but if not, there are only 24 hours in a day.</p>
<p>If the answer is no, then you need to support her in finding a way to incorporate these other activities into her life. But- she needs to make the decision based on what works for her, and not what works for some adcom out there.</p>
<p>Truth be told, I'm sure we all know these super type adults who are the mirror image of these super teenagers. I know one at work; she takes yoga and pilates, she gets her hair-colored when it needs to be (oh i'm envious of those highlights... but I know THAT's a time commitment!) she has a big gorgeous house which is beautifully kept and the windows actually have lovely silk things hanging from them (I'm ready to tack up a bath towel and call it quits in the window-treatment department!) etc. She's got kids, a very demanding job which requires overnight travel 2-3 days a month, and although her salary allows her to have the kind of household help which keeps it all together, I know from experience that juggling all these things requires SO much stamina and energy and just the ability to keep the wheels from falling off the bus.</p>
<p>However she recently confided that her perfect marriage is on the skids.</p>
<p>Lesson for me? Nobody can manage everything all at once. We've all got 24 hours a day. My colleague clearly needs less sleep than I do (or maybe all that personal trainer stuff actually gives you more energy like they claim!) but even so.... life involves trade-offs.</p>
<p>I have a cruddy house but we entertain friends and family a lot and that's important to us. I will never win the "she's middle aged but people think she's 25" contest; too much upkeep, too much time, too much money. My job is important to me but I've passed up significant opportunities because the toll to my H and kids would have been too much. I have a couple of causes that I care deeply about, and would rather spend time volunteering in the community than picking out fabric or re-doing my bathroom.</p>
<p>I think your D could benefit on some grownup perspective on how hard it is to have to make trade-offs, but that right now her health and school work come first... the other stuff needs to get slotted in if/when she can manage it.</p>
<p>Great post, blossom.</p>
<p>Most important question has to be, "What is the best thing for this child?" (not the adcom, parent ego, neighbor kid, etc.) </p>
<p>I'm raising three teenagers, and I find the parent role in all this is, as you say, the relaxed conversation about priorities/passions, time realities and sleep needs. After that, my role becomes the person who looks them in the eye every day and says, "You can do this, the things you've chosen are right for you, and I'll make sure you have clean socks and a hot meal." Quiet confidence in them goes a long way.</p>
<p>"As far as I can see so far, colleges really don't care about the fact that he's a decent 3-season athlete or the hours he puts into it because he isn't good enough to be recruited."</p>
<p>I do think this is a harsh reality you have to consider. You should make a realistic assessment of how strong her track talents are, and how competitive she is likely to be over the next few years. While I agree that people should follow their passion, in this case I would question whether the extreme degree of focus and elimination of activities is worth it, unless she really has a realistic prospect of being competitive at the college level.</p>
<p>Answer to the OP, yes. My D mostly did her sport and school with limited but quality (relative to her interests) EC. She was recruited heavily for a DIV 1 sport by Ivies. It seems that the school grades tests matter more than the athletics for these schools, i.e., the coaches have to get the kid in (past admissions). Many Ivy group schools require the coach to pass the propective recruit to pass through admisisons and admissions gives the coach the permission to continue. However, there is more slippage for "revenue" sports than others.</p>
<p>S is involved in a sport that requires a year round commitment. When he went through the recruiting process, we found that most schools were interested in his ability to make a positive contribution to the team, coursework, grades, and test scores. (Not necessarily in that order). This was particularly true of the Ivies. In high school, S basically did his academic work, his sport, one school activity as time allowed, some community service (about 40 hours over four years) and held a part-time summer job (starting at age 14). There did not seem to be any concern for the lack of a large number of ECs. </p>
<p>S who wanted to study engineering, ended up with a wonderful list of colleges (D1-D3) who wanted to recruit him. The list included several Ivies as well as numerous other schools with top 25 engineering programs.</p>
<p>GFG isn't gonna brag about her daughter, but she's VERY competitive for D3 and Ivies.</p>
<p>I find it very sad if it is true that colleges only look favorably on sports if the student wishes to and is "good enough" to pursue it at the college level. My DD1 has played soccer all of her life. She has been a four year Varsity starter and played club ball since she was very young until the fall of her Junior year (from 8th grade on at the "Elite" level). She stopped playing club because she decided to pursue a second Varsity sport in the Spring of her Junior year. She is a Varsity starter in that second sport also and will continue to play this spring as a Senior. Varsity sports (and club sports, too) require an incredible amount of time and dedication. Even so, she has been able to maintain straight "A's" throughout high school with the most rigorous courseload (10 AP's) and will graduate in May as Valedictorian. She has done a bit of community service that she has enjoyed, enough to satisfy NHS and her school's requirements and then some. She has also participated in a couple or three clubs and has served as an officer in two of them.</p>
<p>That being said, she has decided that she does not wish to pursue sports at the Varsity level in college. She would definitely like to play at an intramural level, because she genuinely enjoys both her sports, but she wants time to concentrate on her studies and on becoming a big part of the campus life by participating in clubs and organizations. She was contacted by a few recruiters last year, but the schools they represented were very small and not the type of university that she would like to attend.</p>
<p>I can't believe that colleges would not look at her time playing sports and see the value that they represent in showing her dedication, commitment and time management skills . . . even though it is something that she has chosen not to pursue further.</p>
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I can't believe that colleges would not look at her time playing sports and see the value that they represent in showing her dedication, commitment and time management skills . . . even though it is something that she has chosen not to pursue further.
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<p>My understanding is that colleges will look at your D's sports commitment the same way they would look at any other EC commitment. But if your D wants to play in college, they will look at it as a hook. It is not a hook if she is not going to play in college.</p>