Vassar vs Amherst

College Search & Selection
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Ok. I swore to myself that I would never make one of these but I am really really REALLY stuck between these two schools. I would love to be able to finalize a decision within the next few days, and come back from break without even having to think about colleges.

I guess I’ll share what I found the strengths in each/both schools and my personal interests (and how the strengths align with them).

I am a gay male who is interested in pursuing the social sciences (particularly politics and education), who also has significant interest in and commitment to performing arts. I really hope to be able to foster friendships with all sorts of people, and be able to explore tons of different things I would have never normally come across. I would also to find some of my own people (aka. LGBTQ+) both through friendships and perhaps something deeper :slight_smile: , since I live in a VERY heteronormative place.

Strengths both have:

  • Open Curriculum
  • Strong academics
  • Great reputations
  • Quite good diversity for a LAC
  • Strong in humanities

Strengths of Vassar:

  • More known for performing arts
  • More known for LGBTQ+ community
  • Perhaps more relaxed environment?
  • There seems to be more diversity in professors
  • The education program seems to be very strong (especially compared to Amherst, which seems to have just started that major and don’t really have set faculty for it yet)

Strengths of Amherst:

  • Already made some great friends there (mostly LGBTQ+, we seemed to naturally be more active on the gc). Vassar’s gc (same app) never gained traction.
  • Maybe slightly stronger reputation/academics (though I don’t know if the difference is that significant)
  • More general diversity (BIPOC students especially)
  • 5-College Consortium
  • Perhaps stronger Poli Sci (they also have a cool LJST Major)
  • Better town (imo)

Would love people’s thoughts! Thank you so much.

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I have nothing I can offer on Vassar really, other than having been there a few times. As an Amherst alum, I’m of course biased. My take as an active alum who has been on campus a lot:

  • Town is great, and benefits from the presence of UMass, which creates more scale.
  • The consortium is great, but MOST people come to Amherst, as opposed to Amherst students going elsewhere. So you may not get a ton of benefit from the consortium.
  • PoliSci and LJST are very strong at Amherst.
  • The Amherst network has been pretty astoundingly strong throughout my career. Not to say Vassar would be better or worse, but the responsiveness of Amherst alums to requests for help, introduction, etc., is amazing.
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You seem focused closely on a comparison of the 2 schools. Naturally. My suggestion is that you widen the lens a bit and look at the communities they’re in.

Vassar is in Poughkeepsie where there’s not a lot going on. And it’s not even in the city proper, so it’s removed from Marist, the other small college in town, and from CIA and Bard, small colleges in nearby towns.

The town of Amherst is crawling with college kids - about 30,000 of them. Two towns away is Northampton, a hip, almost counter-culture town with a lot going on. I don’t think you’ll have any trouble finding “my own people” in lots of different clusters in this scene. Amherst seems to me to be a better fit for you.

Your other concern was teacher preparation at Amherst. It’s not so much that teacher prep is new at Amherst, it’s that they really don’t have a teacher prep program at Amherst. They sent their students 10 miles down the road to Mt Holyoke College, op another member of the 5 college consortium, which has a long established teacher prep program.

This arrangement with Mt Holyoke makes little sense to me - not when another 5 college consortium member with a big School of Ed & a long established history of preparing teachers, UMass, is just a mile or so down the street. You could walk or bike over to UMass while MHC presents unnecessary commuting hassles.

I suggest that you call Admissions at Amherst and ask them to put you in touch with the person who coordinates teacher prep at Amherst to find out if you can do your education training at UMass. If you plan to teach grades 7-12, your major is what you’ll teach and you only need a cluster of courses in educational methods & theory as well as child development.

The other thing that doesn’t make sense about this partnership for prospective teachers with MHC is that the application for the program is to be made in junior year for a program that will be engaged in senior year. Wrong way to do it. Methods courses should be taken in junior year, so that you are ready to do student teaching in the first semester of senior year. Think about it. This is your professional training. What you most need to know is how to get a school year started, how to establish a tone in your classes and hoe to set expectations fo your students. You can’t learn that when you student teach in the 2nd semester, which is what this 1-year program with MHC is set up to do.

Taking education courses at UMass would put you back in charge of planning your courses and it would give you the flexibility to distribute your education courses over junior and senior year. The MHC option has the feel of a cram course for students who decide at the last minute that teaching is the best career path for them. Not a good way to go. Definitely not best practice.

BTW, the reason that Vassar has a well established Education Dept is the same reason that MHC has one. Vassar was for most of its history a women’s college and their history of preparing teachers dates back to the days when options for women were limited. Teaching was at the top of the list for college educated women. Colleges for the sons of the wealthy, like Amherst, Williams, and Wesleyan were preparing young men for careers in business, finance, law, and medicine. They weren’t training school teachers.

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NYreader, do you have any support for saying that most people come to Amherst? I’ve been told just the opposite. The sheer size of UMass opens up a breadth of courses for students at the LACs to fill in the gaps where there aren’t courses to meet their needs or interests.

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@nyreader thank you for your input! good to know about the consortium - I also got the sense that usually it leads to a lot of students from the other schools coming to Amherst, with some, but less, from Amherst going to the other schools. I’ve also heard the networking is really good at Amherst, and that it is a great school to have on your resumé for grad school!

@Bill_Marsh I really appreciate this perspective. I didn’t really look at in within the context of the larger scene, though it’s a great thing to consider. In terms of teacher prep, it looks like Amherst is starting a brand new Education Studies major (what I meant to refer to in my original post). It doesn’t look like they have specific faculty there, but they rather draw from sociology/anthropology professors (and some from other areas) to create some courses. Thanks again for the detailed response.

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My direct info is definitely out of date, but was 100% true then, and is consistent with what I’ve heard from friends with children who have gone there. I guess I’ll frame it this way – many students from Holyoke, Hampshire, and Smith came to Amherst for courses that were actually available across all schools. If Amherst students left campus for classes, it was almost entirely to UMass for very specific courses that Amherst didn’t offer. But since most students chose Amherst for the classes they DID offer, that was relatively few advanced and specific electives. Again, things may have changed more than I realize.

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This is a tough choice. Have you been able to connect with current students in the education programs and performing arts groups at both schools? I’m tagging current Vassar parent @elena13 and Amherst parents @purplemama and @RosePetal35 who may be able to help.

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I contacted someone from Vassar who had a friend who did the ed studies, and he said it was really great there. Amherst’s is brand new so I don’t think I could reach out to any student. I am planning on reaching out to a faculty member about it though. Thank you for all the help and tags!

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Yes, Performing Dude, I’ve found the new Education Studies major. My apologies. I assumed you were talking about a more traditional Education Department. It appears that the Educational Studies major at Vassar is also relatively new? Do I have that right?

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You don’t go to Amherst College, to take a bunch of classes at the other colleges. You cherry pick the best and most appealing classes to you at the consortium and if you really want to make it work, you do that. My goodness though, what a great option!

Now, what is this talk about Vassar? (using my mammoth mama voice) You are a mammoth. Stop second guessing yourself. You found your people. That is just as important as all the other things. Now go put your purple shirt on and tusks up! And well, do whatever you feel in your heart is right for you in case I’m wrong :purple_heart: :wink:

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Hi, I first wanted to congratulate you on your acceptances! I recently committed to Vassar and thought I would chime in and give you some information I learned by talking to a few current students there. Every student I talked to emphasized that Vassar students are always open to trying new things, are very accepting, and are open-minded. You mentioned that you would like to explore a variety of things, so I thought this information might be relevant. They also all emphasized that Vassar’s alumni network is very strong and has been very helpful for them (although I am sure Amherst’s alumni network is also very strong). I would definitely recommend reaching out to current Vassar students (potentially in your intended major) to get a better sense of the environment, both academically and socially. The students I spoke to were all very kind and willing to help. It helped me a lot in making my decision. I hope this helps and good luck with your decision!

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Hi Dude! I had a feeling that Amherst was not a done deal for you. Of course I could be wrong but I get the sense you are having a tough time turning down Amherst’s higher prestige. I went through a little of that before deciding on Wes over Swat. Both Amherst and Vassar are prestigious and will set you up nicely for an even more prestigious graduate school. Amherst has the better college town definitely but imo the campus culture is most important. That’s where you’re going to spend most of your time. Go with your gut. I always got the sense you were most excited about Vassar but that you were understandably excited to get accepted to a top LAC like Amherst. Whichever you choose, you will find your happiness. But I can see you having more of a blast at Vassar. The vibe I always got from watching YouTube videos about Amherst is that it is very intense. Opposite vibe at Vassar. (Similar to my decision between Swat and Wes.) They both appear to have strong alumni networks. They’re both academically rigorous. Amherst has more resources and seems to have more of a preppy/jock culture while Vassar is more eclectic. It’s a tough decision. You can’t go wrong because ultimately you’re going to choose based on your priorities. They both present different experiences but once you’re there, you will acclimate and it will become your new home. Let us know your final decision. Whichever school you choose will be lucky to have you. All the best to you!

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@PerformingDude - I think you really can’t go wrong with either amazing choice, and most likely you will be very happy wherever you choose. I agree with the above comment about campus culture, and at this point that might be where your decision should be made. Either school will be wonderful academically with lots of great experiences and support. Yes, Amherst does seem to offer more re the surrounding area. However, Vassar’s campus is so beautiful and there are always so many activities on campus that my D has never wanted to do much off campus (besides go into the little town adjacent to campus). There are opportunities for outdoor activities in the Hudson River Valley and you can also take the train into NYC on occasion. One semester my D’s playwriting professor arranged for the class to go into the city to see Hadestown, and that was definitely a highlight! Vassar does seem to be a bit more laid back and is filled with creative artsy kids. There are many opportunities for performing through lots of student run productions. My D has lots of friends in the LGBTQ community and I could likely arrange for you to talk to some students if you would like. Good luck and keep us posted!

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You should be comfortable & do well at either school, but Amherst College offers more due to the 5 school consortium.

FWIW: Did you apply to Northwestern University ?

I ask because your interests in politics, education, & theatre suggest that SESP (School of Education & Social Policy) might be a perfect match for your interests. SESP has an LAC type environment / community while opportunities for acting are plentiful at Northwestern University.

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@newcollegekid1 thank you for the perspective! I also talked to a couple of Vassar students and got a similar vibe. Definitely seems to be a very open-minded campus!

@leavingLI hey again :slight_smile: . I definitely appreciate that mindset of prioritizing the vibes of the school. I actually found myself clicking more with the Amherst campus and town when I recently visited both, though I’m not sure why. I did really click with a smaller group of Amherst admits, most of whom are LGBTQ+, who literally feels so different yet similar at the same time. And you’re also totally right to note the prestige as an underpinning motivation that should NOT be considered that much in this process. Amherst does have the reputation of being pretty athletic and jocky, but according to Amherst students/alums it isn’t as nearly as present as people make it out to be. It’s a VERY tough decision. Great to hear from you again!

@elena13 thanks for the reply! I agree that Vassar’s campus is absolutely stunning! Definitely appreciate the emphasis of the vibe at this point. And thank you for the offer of contacts. I’m actually at the phase where I think I’ve spoken to enough students and just need to make a decision!

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Thanks for the response! I did not apply to Northwestern, mainly due to my preference toward LACs (plus I highly doubt I would’ve gotten in LOL). It does seem like a great program though!

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My thoughts from your initial post are that you prefer Amherst but it’s tough to let go of other selective schools. You like many specific things about Amherst: the people, the diversity, the opportunities provided by the consortium, the majors, and the town. Most of your listed strengths for Vassar are fairly vague. It almost reads as though you had to come up with a couple just so you’d have an equal number of points to consider. If you like Amherst, it’s okay to let Vassar go.

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I definitely spent a lot more time on the Amherst research than my Vassar research. I don’t know, Vassar sounds like such a better fit for me on paper but for some reason I click with the Amherst crowd.

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FWIW, I went to Amherst and now my D will be attending next year in the Class of 2025. I thought it was an amazing experience - I didn’t experience any intensity or competition, but just support, even through very rigorous premed coursework. My best friends now are still those I met at Amherst - we have had pandemic book clubs and game nights, even 30 years after graduation! I have been so impressed by the future classmates my daughter is telling me about - it sounds like it’s going to be a wonderful community. I sang at Amherst and definitely think it lives up to its reputation as the Singing College. I did take one course at Smith and enjoyed it, but honestly I was so happy at Amherst that I didn’t find it necessary to go off campus often. I disagree completely with the prep/jock culture someone referenced above - that was not my experience, anyway. You can always find more or less intense or preppy people in any environment full of intelligent people, of course - but I think Amherst works hard to choose its students well and seems to come up with a class that is not only intelligent but values kindness as well. If you are interested in teaching, please know that so many of my former classmates have dedicated their lives to education - of youth, college students, grad students, and more. I am also so impressed by its diversity in recent years - that’s a positive change from back in my time, for sure. I love that frats were fully abolished before I attended and have not crept back into the culture. It seems like there are a lot of artists this year, so I think you’ll be in good company!

Obviously Vassar is great too; my D was also making this choice. I think one thing that swayed her was hearing that many Vassar students spend a lot of time off campus in NYC, which is great if that’s what you want, but less awesome if you just want a tight knit community that comes together every weekend. That’s not to say that Vassar is not close knit; again, you can’t make a wrong choice here. Good luck with whatever you decide - P

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This is such great info! Thanks so much!!