<p>Just for reference, does anyone know about how many voice majors were accepted this year at Rice?
I know that CIM's viewbook has numbers listed for each instrument and voice, but they have the total numbers and the "usual" number of openings each year.
If anyone knows, or can hazzard a good guess, on the "real" numbers at both schools, I'd be interested to know.</p>
<p>At the meeting following auditions, the admissions staff said that the number changes each year, but that they expect to take 3 to 5 voice students this year! That’s right, 3 to 5! Good grief. Another guy got up and said 3 to 6. But either way, it’s not very many.</p>
<p>I’m suspecting that’s yeild, right? Do they accept more than that in hopes of yielding that many? I’m not sure.</p>
<p>OK- so Rice sends out about 15 acceptance letters hoping for a yield of a class of 3-5?Thanks, SinpleLife!
Does anyone know the answer for CIM?</p>
<p>I really doubt they send out three-five times more acceptances than they have spots. That would leave room for huge enrollment problems. I would think more like 8 acceptances and 5-15 waitlistings?</p>
<p>Sounds more reasonable, but what would happen if say, even 8 of those kids accepted?</p>
<p>They would be overenrolled and it DOES happen. The year DS was accepted as an undergrad…12 students accepted admission on HIS instrument…the school sent 12 acceptances and EVERYONE accepted. Unbelievable. By the time they were seniors, there were only 4 left…but honestly…they had a huge issue with instrumentation that freshman year…providing playing opportunities for everyone. They really had to think “out of the box”. The school made it work…but I think they were VERY surprised. They expected four and got 12. The following year, they accepted NONE on that instrument.</p>
<p>Many studios at a variety of schools now send out acceptances in waves, requesting rapid replies, so they can control enrollment. For six spots, they send out six acceptances in early March, three enroll, and they send out three more in late March, and maybe one or two more in early April.</p>
<p>That practice does not always work out because many students will not have all their acceptances and financial aid numbers until well into April. Requiring someone to accept by late March is a violation of the NASM agreement that says all students have until May 1 to respond. Schools can certainly send out acceptances in waves and they may get some positive responses back on the early side, but they could still wind up with much higher than expected yield on May 1.</p>
<p>BassDad, you’ve brought up something I don’t really understand. How do schools get away with violating the NASM rules? Rice, for example, generally a model of humane treatment of applicants, asks for a reply within two weeks of acceptance, at least for grad students.</p>
<p>The year DD was accepted at Rice they sent out 8 and got 4 freshmen. Last year I believe they offered about the same and that they got 3. Looks like that’s their typical. If they did get 8 acceptances it might affect a little bit of studio time but it would still be manageable. If they all survived to junior/senior year it would affect casting. I think 100% yield is so very rare though that I woudl not worry about it. </p>
<p>Sorry don’t know about CIM</p>
<p>Grad students are different. It’s not the same rules.they send acceptance out differently. Rice uses the regular May 1 for undergrad.</p>
<p>From the 2009-2010 NASM Handbook available at </p>
<p><a href=“http://nasm.arts-accredit.org/site/docs/Handbook/NASM_HANDBOOK_2009-2010.pdf[/url]”>http://nasm.arts-accredit.org/site/docs/Handbook/NASM_HANDBOOK_2009-2010.pdf</a></p>
<p>ARTICLE III - FINANCIAL AID</p>
<p>Section 2. Financial aid shall be awarded according to the criteria established by the member institution granting the award.</p>
<p>Section 3.
A. The acceptance of financial aid or the signing of a declaration of intent to enter a given institution to begin a specific degree or program of study shall not be binding if signed before May 1 of the calendar year of matriculation at the undergraduate level, or before April 15 of the calendar year of matriculation at the graduate level.</p>
<p>B. A student shall be notified of this policy when an institution makes an offer with a response deadline prior to May 1 for undergraduate-level programs and prior to April 15 for graduate-level programs.</p>
<hr>
<p>In other words, they are allowed to ask you to respond sooner than May 1 (for undergrads) or April 15 (for grad students) but they are then supposed to tell you that you can change your mind without penalty until those dates. Even if they neglect to tell you this, they have agreed to abide by this practice if they are NASM accredited. In theory, if you agree to attend and then unilaterally withdraw that agreement within the specified time frame, there should be no hurt feelings or ruffled feathers. In practice, that may or may not be the case. Therefore, if you are being pressured for an early response, you can tell them that you will attend. If a better offer from a different school arrives later, you still have options.</p>
<p>However, Rice along with other notables such as Julliard and MSM do not belong to NASM and are not bound by the agreement. I would guess that they want the answer because it is a small program and the graduate student yield needs to mananged more effectively than undergrad due to casting and preformance opportunities.</p>
<p>Quite true, Singersmom07. There are lots of music schools that are not NASM members for one reason or another and hence are not bound by those rules. Just about all schools will be accredited by some organization or other, however. If someone is having these kinds of issues with a non-NASM school, it could be worth doing some research to find out who granted their accreditation and whether or not that organization has any rules, guidelines or best practices similar to those in the NASM Handbook.</p>
<p>In addition, some schools that are not NASM members adhere to the College Board’s Candidate Reply Date Agreement (CRDA), at least for undergrad admissions. Even some of the ones that do not adhere to CRDA will grant extensions to the CRDA date of May 1 if an accepted student so requests.</p>
<p>Well,that certainly explains something that I’ve seen taking place this year. One wonders why they would even go through the machinations considering so many responses hinge upon the FA offers? There are several of my D’s friends who didn’t bother to file the FAFSA as the family income was far too high to qualify for any need-based aid and the skills not honed enough to get any merit-based aid, but I have to believe that the great majority of students today have to have at least some monetary assistance. If that’s the case then, Fiddlefrog (maybe you know since you had the first answer) do the kids who received those “early” acceptance letters get priority of any sort if they do indeed,need to wait until they see the FA award? Or are they supposed to accept not knowing what, if any, FA award will be coming their way?</p>
<p>Mezzo’sMama, I’m not sure if you’re talking about grad students or undergrads. I can speak of undergrads. </p>
<p>Undergrad Shepherd students did not receive any rolling waves of acceptances. Rice put out Shepherd acceptances via email on Monday, March 30th. They then mailed notifications, which came on April 1st or 2nd for us. Shepherd notifications came well after the rest of the Rice undergrad applicants were notified. </p>
<p>The deadline for acceptance is May 1, like at other schools. Financial aid notifications came with notification of acceptance. Merit aid was awarded at that time, at least in my son’s case.</p>
<p>Thanks, SimpleLife, that makes sense and there are a few schools who went right down to the wire for sending out their acceptances for undergrads. I was actually referring to the few schools-one in particular- who always goes after a few kids very, very early in the audition season, but has no news about FA until April. They can’t be the only school that does that- which is why I was wondering if those kids are “flagged” in some way in the system and are still in the "preferred "pile when the finally make the decision? In other words, if there were 5 openings and 5 accepted, and then one of the “favorites” accepted, would there still be an opening for him/her, or would they then be placed on the “wait list”. Do those that are the “chosen” early in the game retain that status until May 1st?!</p>
<p>I doubt Rice would make its grad students give them an answer before getting the Rice FA numbers. From what fiddlefrog is saying, however, the grad students may not get to see all offers of admission or all the FA numbers from some of the other schools to which they applied before having to say yes or no to Rice. I would expect that schools who admit in waves would communicate first with the most highly desired students, who thus have the best shot at merit aid both there and elsewhere. If those students have no protection of the sort NASM or CRDA offers, that can put them in a difficult position.</p>
<p>In the case of one highly desired student responding late, I would hope most schools could find room for one student more than their initial projection. Without knowing what school we are talking about, though, anything is possible. In any case, it would behoove the student to keep the lines of communication open with the college that admitted them early, so that the college knows they still are interested (if that is indeed the case.)</p>
<p>Oh, I think I get your concern, Mezzo’sMama. I think I may even know which school you are talking about.</p>
<p>I think you and I both agree that if it is a NASM school, the student has until May 1 to accept the school’s acceptance offer, right? So that’s not a concern for you.</p>
<p>But if the school is NOT NASM, you’re wondering – if that school accepts your student, but your student doesn’t accept their offer right away because she is waiting on FA info, is the offer still good even after other people fill up their projected slots? And if so, until what deadline?</p>
<p>Did I get that right?</p>
<p>I would think that a deadline for acceptance would be either in an acceptance packet or on the school’s website. If a student was accepted, I would think that student could accept their offer right up until that deadline, whether or not projected slots filled up with other prospective students. How could they possibly rescind an offer that they already made? I think all schools allow for some error in manipulating their yield, and so they award acceptances accordingly, knowing they may get a few more or less than anticipated.</p>
<p>You’ve got it, Simple Life- and I’m sure that you do know which school I have in mind! I’ve seen at least one web site which states that “although students have until May 1st to send their intent to enroll forms, students should be aware that studios may fill up and required classes may also fill, as all forms are processed in order of their arrival.Those students who get their papers in later will be placed on waiting lists but must understand that there may not be room for them in which case they will be placed on waiting lists”.
I can understand why NASM regulates as as they do since the setting of standards make things easier to be fair to everyone. Some of the older schools may find themselves short of students in the future if they continue to “coast on their name” and impose arbitrary deadlines which take an already tense time and make it even more stressful. I sure hope I have this all figured out within the next 4 years- just in time for the grad school applications!</p>
<p>Mezzo’sMama, I know you were mainly looking for information on that “other school” at this point, but I did hear some official numbers from Rice today, if anybody’s interested. </p>
<p>The word from Shepherd admissions is that they were aiming for an undergraduate enrollment of 4 or 5 voice students in the fall. They accepted 8 undergrads for those 4 to 5 spots. 191 undergrads auditioned for those 8 spots. Finally, they accepted 15 voice students total, meaning 7 grad students were accepted.</p>
<p>Interesting stuff.</p>
<p>Any undergrad voice students here leaning towards attending Rice next fall?</p>