Yes and no. Learning planned abortion is indeed an elective. But learning to evacuate uterine or tubal contents in an emergency situation is something all OB/Gyns learn. But the important question is not do they have the skills to do it (any OB/Gyn is capable of a D&C) but rather WILL they do it in a timely fashion in an urgent situation. My colleagues in other states are already reporting changing care because of the new laws. For example, in the past, if the amniotic sac ruptured at 17 weeks, the woman would be offered the option of an immediate abortion without having to wait for any signs of infection to start, even if there was still cardiac activity. But now women may be sent home with instructions to carefully monitor for fever and other signs of infection while hoping for the pregnancy to pass ânaturally.â Deaths like Savita Halappanavarâs are going to happen here. This is the issue I worry about for my daughter as I send her to college. Death of Savita Halappanavar - Wikipedia
Exactly! It would be very scary for me if my DD had planned pregnancy in one of those states.
Yes, I think undergrad applications will be the short term test. The long term test may be faculty recruitment. Most undergrads do not start college with a plan to be pregnant, so may calculate that these new laws are unlikely to affect them directly. But faculty are often hired at an age where they are planning to start families (either themselves or their wives.) So they may not want to live where their access to reproductive care is limited (examples are abortion for ectopic pregnancy, bleeding, infection or fetal health condition, and IVF.) So recruitment may suffer. With the ongoing glut of PhDs, colleges will be able to find replacements, but the quality may suffer. ( I donât predict too many faculty will leave tenured positions, however, as they have put roots down and another such position will be hard to find for all but the superstars.)
Agree. My daughter is staying in CA to attend UCLA. But Kenyon was her second choice and we just recently talked about how she is grateful she chose to stay in CA where her bodily autonomy is respected and protected. Of course, if she had chosen Kenyon, we would have made it work. She is getting an IUD regardless, and she would bring Plan B and C with her. But itâs the emergency care that worries me.
As well as the perverted glee that some state politicians are taking in their pursuit of outlawing reproductive care and by extension, controlling women. The last gasp of patriarchy is vile. Itâs very difficult to want to spend any time or money in a state like that, even if a school you love happens to be located there.
We have talked to several families who are looking more closely at universities in Canada since the court decision.
With high school and many college students, plus those who canât afford to travel, my biggest health concern is the return to back alley or DIY abortions. If something goes wrong and they try to get help, then thereâs legal trouble, so I expect many would wait it out and pray.
Unplanned pregnancies happen both by consent and otherwise. When someone is in that âOh crapâ moment itâs tough to imagine theyâre going to thinking sanely about their options, esp if they donât feel they have anyone they can talk with.
Exactly why everyone should keep Plans B and C on hand.
This is really going to depend upon our elections, both this fall and who knows how many elections going forward. Both sides are promoting it as a top issue in commercials, etc. Unfortunately, the election is after the current class will start.
I donât think that many schools will feel the impact of fewer applicants. Weâll see. For most people, itâs not a game changer. CC is very unlike the overall demographic.
People might not like it and chose not to apply, but many will still apply. Some will also hope that schools provide measures. Or theyâll determine that if something unplanned happens theyâll go to a local state or come home. Another entire cohort will see plan B & C as the means to circumvent any legal changes in any state.
This isnât that pertinent to this conversation exactly. But it is.
My daughter is of the age where they have many friends who are finishing medical training. At their age, many are also planning their families.
It seems to be a conversation point among them to practice medicine in states where they donât have to worry about fertility issues.
Because so many of my daughterâs friends are going through fertility treatments right now and they are very concerned about that and prenatal care.
Itâs already difficult to recruit good physicians to some (most) rural areas. I predict itâs going to get harder.
I agree. The existing brain drain will only worsen as people make educational and professional choices based on which state governments exercise authoritarian policies (itâs very clear that abortion is just the tip of the iceberg here).
With all due respect, in most circles this would be described as a âpro-choiceâ stance.
No one thinks abortions are easy and trivial. What women want is the ability to choose to get care if the have an ectopic pregnancy, or have severe complications, or yes have valid reasons why a pregnancy would not be healthy for them physically/emotionally/mentally.
I think many many people feel as you do. I do not know anyone who thinks abortion should be outlawed in every single case, except some right-wing politicians.
Interesting. In my circle itâs not. Pro-choice around me means anytime/any reason for an abortion. Pro-life means no exceptions (our local politician even says so). Iâm in a third group who leans more Pro-life with exceptions as I mentioned. I donât know if there are many in my group or not TBH. I tend to not discuss the issue much when the two sides are having their conversations.
âPro-choice around me means anytime/any reason for an abortionâ
Thereâs a difference between what pro-choice folks may believe for themselves and what they believe should be dictated. Do I believe it should be used flippantly? Do I believe a woman should get an abortion at 30 weeks just because? No, but I also donât think most women choosing to get an abortion use the choice flippantly or make the decision for a late term abortion without good reason. However, the decision should be left up to the woman and her doctor based on individual circumstances- you canât allow legislators and Politicians who have no idea of all the different complications that could arise stipulate pre/defined exceptions. So in practice yes that means anytime/any reason for an abortion as decided by the woman and her medical team based on her individual circumstances which are not my business.
Regardless of how terms are defined, I agree with this totally. I personally am mostly Pro-Life as stated before, but I see the way to reduce abortions coming from other methods, including better sex-ed, etc, rather than changing laws. Iâm very encouraged seeing the stats from the NYT graph I posted before (post #59) showing far fewer abortions now than decades ago, across all age groups. âSomethingâ was working before and it didnât require law changes.
By changing laws I think more harm is done to other lives and Iâm pro all life (of humans).
For college/living destinations Iâd be far more concerned in no exception states TBH. The greatest potential harm seems to be in those states.
Agree 100%. Also more availability of birth control. Free birth control would definitely reduce abortions.
Can we go back to the topic of this conversation before it gets shut down?