To get back on topic, I think I’d consider the availability of abortion as another health issue along with the others when looking at colleges.
My S23 has health issues. These shouldn’t be an emergency problem while he’s in college, but we’ve had an average of 1 emergency visit for this per year lately, so best to be safe. Our small city has a decent hospital, and his fancy specialists are an hour away. That works just fine.
All but one of his college options are in good-sized cities. The other one has hospitals in town and a medical school about an hour away. I wouldn’t be comfortable with him going anywhere more remote than that.
Because he’s a boy, that will be okay. Some of his schools are in states that protect abortion. The ones that are not are all close enough that we could go pick him and a female friend up and be back home the same day. We live an hour from abortion care. I’m not sure how I’d (or he) would feel about his list if he were a girl. We will certainly be having a deeper conversation with him about all this before he makes his final choice.
Luckily for our particular situation, it doesn’t change his school list, but that was made with his other health issues in mind anyway. I see the abortion care as yet another thing on the list. This will become a huge problem for so many people, and most parents haven’t had to worry too much about their kids being near the fanciest hospitals at college. So that means even considering health issues carefully is a whole new extra factor for most folks. It sucks!!!
Definitely a concern. As I said, we could have him and his partner whisked away to our home in one day of driving. There are many abortion clinics within an hour of us. We already have Plan B and C on hand and have been having the contraception convos with our kids for years already. Will be having more convos before we send him off to college with appropriate supplies in hand (including Narcan).
I think that it sounds reasonable and practical that one could pick up a person in need of an abortion and get them to a place it is offered safely. Or get an Rx to someone in a timely manner.
What bothers me is 3 things:
urgent medical care for miscarriages, ectopic pregnancy, hemorrhaging that is delayed or not immediately available while doctors sort out legal and liability questions. This includes IUD malfunctions, reactions to hormonal birth control, etc. I do not want my daughter or any woman to be at the mercy of a scared or confused doctor in her moment of greatest need.
increased tracking of people who might leave the state for such things. While this is all speculation right now, I have learned not to scoff in disbelief at the lengths to which certain elected officials will go to their exert power and rile up voters. Prepare for the worst here.
increased interest in reducing access to birth control, increased interest in policies that discriminate based on race and sexual orientation, increased surveillance, increased interest in open carry gun laws, increased interest in bringing Christianity into public spaces, etc.
Under most circumstances, I’m not really one to be alarmist. But the writing’s on the wall here.
But to stay even more on topic, I’m interested in we parents’ reactions to these things as it pertains to colleges.
Here’s one thing I am absolutely certain my family will do. If we choose to discard colleges in anti-abortion states - and as I posted earlier, that decision hinges on midterm results - we will be declining acceptances specifically b/c of the state’s policies and making it crystal clear to the colleges that that is the reason.
I agree with others who say that there will not be a massive drop in applications to traditionally huge-merit-awarding colleges in anti-abortion states - the money is very hard to ignore. But even small voices will be heard if there are a number of them.
A friend of mine in college, a boy, was a victim of sexual assault that resulted in a pregnancy. He and the girl were wasted drunk at a party, making out, she wanted to have sex and he didn’t. She went ahead anyway, and it resulted in a pregnancy. Her parents forced her to keep the baby and forced him to pay 50% child support. This was in blue Washington State so it could happen anywhere, but my concern now is that in the scenario you’re describing if she had wanted an abortion and his parents helped her get one, what happens to them criminally? What bounty is placed on parents or friends who help someone leave the state? Or to someone gives Plan B to a friend? My daughter will be going to a red state (IN) next to our currently blue state (IL). Of course I hope she would reach out to us if she needed abortion care, I’m not as worried about that itself, but what if Indiana goes through with making these very strict laws and she gets in trouble for giving a friend Plan B? Or taking it in IN herself?
I agree with all of this, and with what @Wjs1107 said as well. My point is not to say that we don’t have to worry about it at all because he’s a boy. I think we’d be MORE worried about it were he a girl. Maybe my thinking is wrong. I’m not saying it’s fair by any means, but his own personal body is not affected by abortion laws. No one’s body in our immediate family is much affected, because none of us are capable of pregnancy (other than possibly some types of treatments for non-pregnancy related stuff).
Some people are pretty limited by what financial aid they can get. This includes my spouse and I, who are still paying both of our college loans. This also includes our kid, who has guaranteed free tuition at 2 different universities in 2 different red states, due to parent employer. For various reasons, that has been our only college savings plan, and our kid will be paying most of his college himself because our income isn’t sufficient to do much. We already paid for the equivalent of college in daycare expenses while we were both getting our PhDs with no family help.
It may be quite difficult for us to balance the tradeoff of: free tuition in red states with abortion available within 1 hour - 1 day drive vs our kid taking out more loans to go to school in a blue state. These are not easy decisions and I’m pissed that anyone is having to make them.
If it’s irresponsible of me to send my son to college in a red state–which it may indeed be, I’m not arguing otherwise–we can extend that thinking. If he gets someone pregnant in college, and she is at risk just by existing as a pregnant person in a red state, by that same logic, so is anyone he might date in high school in a red state. Should parents in states that forbid abortion move so that their children aren’t at risk? I don’t know the answer to that, and I’m sure many parents are already weighing these things with fury and heavy hearts. Is it irresponsible parenting to live in a state with no abortion if you could conceivably move? Parents with trans kids are sure dealing with an arguably worse version of this and it is horrible.
And as always, people with more money can buy their way into protection from these horrible laws by paying for travel or moving. If I had young daughters in a red state, I’d have to weigh these options with much more gravity. Which is not fair.
D23 and I were quite literally in the throes of pulling together her college list when the decision came out. I watched her strike about 6 schools off the list as a result.
I was just looking at the CDS for my D’s school of UNH. They put on the CDS that they will start a waitlist in the Fall of 2022.
Their incoming class is the biggest since 2018 (not huge numbers- it’s a medium sized school- last years class matched 2018). This was a school that tested throughout COVID, so much more strict than most schools. While I can’t say Roe is the reason this year, I can see them having an influx next year because of it. While they are a heavy OOS school, they are starting to retain more in-state kids. This a school that can benefit from what is happening.
I agree, it’s intentionally awful on a multitude of levels. And it will just compound disadvantages for so many people. My younger child is a boy, so I know where you are coming from. It’s interesting though that of the 4 friends I had in college who were involved in unplanned pregnancies, the only one whose life was forever changed was the guy. My female friends were all able to decide to terminate and went on to have good careers, and eventually families once they were ready. Seeing him go through that was really eye-opening, and now as a parent to a teen boy, it’s always in the back of my mind. It would be one thing if my friend had been in a relationship with the girl and it had been a consensual encounter. The situation was really sad. I don’t know the answers, either. We’re 2 weeks away from dropping our daughter off in a red state and hoping we’ve prepared her well enough. Bloomington is a blue bubble, but that won’t matter with what IN is trying to do over these next couple of weeks.
As I’m thinking about this more, I’m further pondering the implications for families of different means.
Many families here on CC have lots of savings that they will use to pay for their children’s college expenses. Those parents certainly reserve the right to spend that how they (and their kids) see fit, according to their values and priorities.
Our own kids (boys) have access to good tuition remission/exchange scholarships, where they can expect to pay anywhere from 0-15K tuition per year, depending on how competitive their applications are, and depending on the school. Both our kids will be paying for the vast majority of their college expenses themselves, with wages from work and loans. Their starting salaries will likely be at least as much as either of their parents currently make, and higher than the total loans they’ll need, so we don’t feel too bad about the situation.
S23 will probably attend school in a red state. This is not intentional, it’s just based on how we predict things will shake out with his particular situation. As I’ve said earlier, we are trying our darndest to mitigate the asinine abortion laws as best we can. Should we forbid him from attending college in a state without protected abortion? What about those uncertain states like Pennsylvania? He would do what we asked, but if he is on the hook financially for all of this, would it even be reasonable for us to ask that of him?
It’s so true that this is unfair to those who can’t buy their way into a solution they feel comfortable with. And it’s unfair to the schools that actually want to support the reproductive freedom and choices of their students. Their financial security may be put in peril—and it’s highly unlikely that a state government will cover their losses as a result of that state’s new laws.
As far as helping students who are economically motivated to choose schools in red states, we do have to vote people out of office. And maybe a student who attends school in an outlawing state can vote in that state, and make a contribution to that effort. Most Americans believe in reproductive choice. We can turn it around. But it’s a long game and our children will bear the brunt of it, sadly.
I admire those students who actually “walk the walk” by crossing colleges off in affected states, even if it means giving up a T20 or their dream school. I think the CC sample size definitely leans in one direction, and unfortunately, for every student crossing a college off the list, there’s likely 2 or 3 (or more) students behind them that will gladly take their spot - even some of those who are against the abortion bans themselves but don’t feel that it’s enough to tip the scales on their college choice.
Time will tell though - maybe the next few application cycles will show a decline in apps to colleges like Vanderbilt, Rice, Oberlin and Tulane, or even UPenn. It also makes me wonder what would happen if an election changes the color or political leadership of a particular state - will there be a mass-exodus of students in colleges there who are midway through their degree programs?
There’s also something to be said for students who believe strongly in their views against the ban but nonetheless go to a college in an affected state, and then do what they can
to keep the movement going in order to effect changes while there.
This conversation makes me realize that it’s the full-pay students who have the most freedom of choice. I wonder if that will financially impact schools in anti-abortion states. Will they see a relatively steeper drop-off of highly profitable full pay out of state students?
I suspect some there will also be some counter-balance, as conservative parents might specifically want to send their kids to a red state for school. But based on general polling that’s a minority group nationally.
My D23 does feel good about walking the walk but quite honestly she’s equally just basically fearful for her own health and access to any care she may need.
She actually has other unrelated significant health issues and like someone said upthread she also has to take those into account in terms of how close her access to care will be.
Students whose parents can afford fully pay have the most freedom of college choice in any aspect of college choice. If they have no other parental restrictions, their only limitation is where they can get admitted, while students with less than a full pay budget must also consider the cost limitation.
The colleges that are probably worried the most are those which are in states where abortion is getting banned (or much more heavily restricted than before) but which attract left-leaning out-of-state students. Yes, this means colleges like Oberlin.
It could also mean that some of the large-scholarship-offering colleges in the banning or heavily restrictive states may get fewer out-of-state takers. If the scholarships become larger or easier to get in the next few years, that could be related. Obviously, some students who absolutely need the scholarship money may still go there even if they have misgivings about the abortion limitations. But those who see the scholarship money as just “nice to have” may choose some place else.
It is less likely to have much of an effect on colleges that cater to local commuters, who may not have much choice in this matter after applying all of the other constraints they have on college choice.
I think there is going to be a lot of variability in the next few months/years. This came up in a discussion regarding grad schools as mine have already chosen their undergrads. There are absolutely specific states, I have zero interest in them pursuing. The way the laws are written in Texas specifically, I am as worried about my son as my daughter as there is zero due process and anyone can sue anyone for “aiding or abetting” - so him driving a friend to the airport to return home where they could obtain an abortion could be seen as aiding.
I will absolutely vote with my money - they’re adults and can choose differently if they so desire. But I do believe the more people refuse to support these laws, the quicker we’ll see change.
I don’t see U Penn being affected at all with NJ right next door. Many students will already be OOS residents, and with PA residents even if (and that’s a big if) travel could be restricted I don’t see how that could work in reality with the border there.
Oberlin could definitely have trouble - same with Rice, etc.