<p>I'm thinking some of you out there must have considered both colleges. My junior D is interested in both, but they are both relatively unknown where we live so it would be great to get some first-hand insights from either students or parents. The schools seem similar in terms of size, small town location, entering student scores and grades, and excellent merit aid possibilities. So what sets them apart? Is it Greek life at W&L? Does one of them draw more diverse students, including kids from outside the Southeast, and liberals, atheists, geeks, artists? How do the girls dress to go to class or social events at W&L? Is one or the other better for a student of history and politics/international relations?</p>
<p>I don't know that this matters for this fairly broad question, but my D is adventurous, kind, smart, social but not a party animal, intensely athletic, politically savvy, non-religious, and is rarely seen wearing a dress and pearls :)</p>
<p>Thanks in advance for your thoughts! I'll post this at the Davidson forum too, to get a good range of opinions.</p>
<p>Based on your description of your daughter, it will be difficult for her to fit in at either school. Liberals, atheists, geeks & artists are not common at these schools. Fraternity life & girls wearing dresses & pearls are the norm at W & L. Davidson has a large group of students who are very religious. Both schools know how to party with alcohol. Both schools are conservative & both have beautiful campuses.</p>
<p>Thanks coldwind. She is not herself all of the above (definitely liberal, though), but she likes being around a wide variety of people. Still, yours is a potentially useful bit of info.</p>
<p>My son seriously looked at both, but felt that Washington and Lee was much friendlier and welcoming. Even though we really, really encouraged Davidson for family reasons, he refused to even apply.</p>
<p>FauxNom,
We visited W&L in October on a Saturday and came across many young women in dresses or skirts which was very surprising to me in light of the fact that it was about 40 degrees. Not something we have seen at Dartmouth when visiting our older son.</p>
<p>I think it is a very friendly, but tradional/conservative school, with a significant Southern presence on campus.</p>
<p>I am a first-year at W&L from southern california, so before coming to W&L I had never heard of Vineyard Vines or Vera Bradley and pearls were something only worn by royalty and old-fashioned celebrities. I'm also pretty liberal and very into theater and artsy things (although I'm Christian, so the athiest thing doesn't fit me). Having said that, I could not imagine being anywhere other than W&L. I absolutely love it, and while it is true that many girls wear dresses and pearls to class and there's a very strong southern presence, you do not have to be that way to fit in. And while it's also true that the school has quite a conservative leaning, the College Democrats are a very very active group on campus. I saw just as many Vote Democrat shirts being worn around election day as Vote Republican (if not more). So, dont let the stereotype of W&L scare you away. I almost did and I am SO SO glad that I didn't. </p>
<p>W&L is a fantastic community, very friendly. And the town of Lexington is adorable. Unfortunately I don't know too much about Davidson so I can't really compare the two...sorry! Those are just my feelings on Washington and Lee. Hope it helped!</p>
<p>Thanks, all! It does sound like a very friendly place. I'm glad a SoCal girl can thrive there, Yadlin. </p>
<p>Maybe I should ask this as a followup: if we visit for just one day/night in April, what should we do to get a sense of the Southern/traditional/conservative influence at W&L? Having never been to the south, it's hard for us to really understand this in the abstract.</p>
<p>W&L definitely retains a lot of its preppy southern culture, which I think is great. If you are planning on coming in April, make sure it's not during our spring break. Check the calendar before you make any plans. Derby Days is held the week we get back from spring break, so that is a week of various events and competitions between the sororities. Not exactly a typical week, but one in which our Greek spirit is super strong. Anytime during spring term will be a good opportunity to see W&L.</p>
<p>We've looked at both for my son. I don't agree that W&L is more selective than Davidson (which is considered the Southern Harvard.) Both are excellent, small, southern liberal arts colleges. The town of Davidson is terrific and very Norman Rockwell-esque, the campus is so near Lake Norman that there is a school recreation area on the lake with boats, etc. to take out at your leisure, and it is about 20 minutes from downtown Charlotte, a mid-sized city. My son really liked the students and friendliness of everyone he met, and he's been 3x so it can't be a fluke. He is an athlete and about 60% of the students there are involved in athletics. Davidson is a D-1 athletic school, W&L is a D-3.</p>
<p>W&L is southern, but doesn't heavily recruit from the deeper south so I feel there are a number of mid-atlantic and lower-northern-state kids there. It felt more preppy than Davidson and more Frat-centric. Davidson has fraternities, but no sororities (they have what they call "eating houses" for women.) I think Davidson's self-proctored exams are a plus. Davidson was a men's college until the late 1970s, and even though women are an equal portion of the student body, I think there is still a bit of a "men's club" feel to it. The Honor Code is very big at both schools. Either school would be great for history/poli-sci, but Virginia's proximity to DC might give it an edge.</p>
<p>Davidson felt more relaxed in dress and attitude, while W&L felt a bit more formal. I think they are both more conservative than liberal, but not so much that a liberal would feel out of place. My son is quite liberal, and Jewish, and felt comfortable at both places.</p>
<p>Yay - I love getting more input on this! We know one Davidson student and no W&L students, so it really helps to get the comparisons. The Davidson student turned down Harvard and a few other great schools, and is absolutely happy to be at Davidson. It's easy to see my D being happy there. If it were DIII, I'm pretty sure she'd be chatting up the coach for her sport. </p>
<p>But W&L sounds so interesting - I assume the Johnson Scholars program has generated a lot of interest from outside the area, and it sounds like community service is also valued, so that's a plus. We're still trying to figure out how to fit in a visit. D has exactly one weekend this spring that is free of sports commitments, and it happens to coincide with finals/break at W&L, so we might need to continue gathering information through the grapevine. I'd love to hear more!</p>
<p>the "selectivity" factor is statistically insignificant. W&L and Davidson are pretty similar in the stats. Also selectivity really has more to do with number of applicants and slots available. W&L sends out far more literature than Davidson, and the extra marketing leads to more applicants, therefore more rejections which "reads" as greater selectivity. IMO, when two schools are so close in numbers, all selectivity means is better marketing.</p>
<p>Both schools are excellent, with high degree of rigor. They attract similar students.</p>
<p>*I didn't know that W&L had self-proctored exams. I missed that, but am glad to hear it! :-)</p>
<p>...so w&l has more applicants, which means they take a smaller percentage. which means they are more selective. uh, self-proctored exams are part of the honor system, which pretty much defines w&l. you might want to look into that</p>
<p>Honor system also pretty much defines Davidson as well. Glad to hear both have self-proctored exams. Duly noted. </p>
<p>Selectivity as a ratio of total applicants to accepted students is one measure, and isn't one that can be influenced by an applicant. It's a measure of the school's marketing campaign and popularity.</p>
<p>Another measure is GPA/Tests scores for accepted students, and it's a better measurement to consider. W&L has what appears to be a slightly more selective range of test scores, but since the SAT allows a 30 point margin in either direction, the small difference in test scores between the two schools is statistically insignificant. They attract and admit similarly talented students, so one can't really say that W&L is more selective using this measure.</p>
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Davidson has the reputation of being a real "grind" school, and I'm wondering if the same is true of W&L.
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<p>My D tells me she's getting an A calculus --at least for now, and she's involved in quite a few things. Interestingly, she didn't get an A in Calc in high school. She says her professor is just so much better than her high school teacher that she is really understanding it now. In fact, she mentioned she might want to take few more math classes now --- this from someone who came in dreading having to take more calc. I don't think she feels W&L is easy, but she seems to have a pretty balanced life between academics and everything else she wants to do. That sort of thing just depends on what type of student you are. </p>
<p>As far as comparing W&L to Davidson, much of what Quillgirl says about selectivity is correct. However, given the fact that, on CC at least, Davidson seems much more heralded, you wouldn't know that W&L actually accepts a lower percentage of applicants, or that the stats of admitted students is slightly higher, even though not meaningfully so. You wouldn't generally know how good W&L actually is compared to Davidson because many automatically assume, wrongly, that Davidson is the best LAC in the South without doing their homework. So in that sense, I think W&L has an added feather in its cap because by comparison, Davidson comes off a little overrated in some ways. But that's just my opinion. Davidson is definitely a fine school and I certainly have a lot of respect for it. </p>
<p>I've visited Davidson a few times as two of my kids applied and were accepted. Both decided to go elsewhere. The one at W&L just liked the atmosphere better at W&L than Davidson; the students, the town, the campus, architecture, its history, etc. She just found it more appealing. She liked that W&L has an accredited business school and its own law school, which is very unusual for small LACs.</p>
<p>Davidson was my D’s first choice for two years as she wanted a small LAC in NC or VA. She didn’t even consider W&L until she heard of the Johnson Scholarship. She returned from the Johnson Scholar weekend in 2013 SO happy, ultimately decided to go there once awarded the Johnson. I can say that as our family is “left-leaning,” I was wary of the school’s conservative reputation; however, after a full semester I can report that my D is truly happy. Her hall of about a dozen includes young women from Boston, NYC, San Diego, Montreal, Florida, Colorado, Oklahoma and then, obviously, other southern states. The campus is “super friendly” and she loves the town. The pre-orientation trip of a week-long hike through the Applachians was a a tremendous success. (Other pre-orientation trips included leadership in DC & service throughout the southern states.) </p>
<p>Coming from the Florida public school system, she has found the classes challenging; but, she seems to be able to balance the coursework and still have an active social life. Her faculty advisor is amazing and her professors engaging. I was also concerned about the high percentage of Greek students at W&L, but now realize that its Greek community is not what I had experienced at a large football school. I would not have considered my D the sorority “type,” but she loves it at W&L. During rush in January, she knew that there were young women in each sorority that she would be happy joining. There are many other ways, of course, to be involved and seems most students take full advantage of what is offered.</p>