What about the money?

<p>We continue to be so very sad about what has happened, and we feel alot of loyalty to Tulane even though S is only a freshman.</p>

<p>However, I am wondering whether I need to be concerned about the issue of tuition based on the American Council on Education statement attached to Pres Cowen's semester cancellation announcement.</p>

<p>S will now be attending a massive, state university where he is entitled to free tuition as a resident (Hope scholarship). I had already paid for the semester at Tulane and in spite of scholarships, it was still several thousand dollars.</p>

<p>I expected to be able to apply the paid semester's tuition towards S's spring semester at Tulane. I feel pretty strongly that I should NOT have to pay the same amount this semester---that Tulane either will owe me a refund if S stays at the state school, or apply that tuition to the spring assuming he returns to Tulane.</p>

<p>If he was attending another more exclusive private college, with comparable tuition, perhaps I would agree that the tuition could be considered equivalent. But that's not the case for us, and I suspect for many others who had to scramble for a quick last minute solution.</p>

<p>I am hoping that it will not be a problem, but I'd really like some perspective from others who know the school and the administration better than a newbie parent. </p>

<p>Comments?
(Cross post)</p>

<p>While your concern is very real, I think you need to give them some time to sort it all out. It's going to take months to get down to level of dealing with the needs of individual students and parents on an organized and coordinated basis. Meanwhile, your kid is in school, which is great!</p>

<p>Curiouser, My H and I were talking about that last night. I showed him the comments that I read. I just do not see how they should be able to keep your money when you are going to a public instate school. Same for someone going to a local community college. Obviously, thatt is not the same as going to Tulane. I think you are going to need to wait, but you won't be the only one wanting to apply that money for the spring. I do feel so sorry about all the circumstances for Tulane, but I also feel that you are entitled to get what you paid for. I would hope that Tulane will do what is fair for all.</p>

<p>Believe me when I say that I am not speaking from a position of wealth, but let's remember that it hasn't yet been a week. I trust Tulane to do what is right for its students. We are headed to Cornell trusting both Tulane and Cornell when they tell us all will be well, even to the extent that when my son asked Cornell, "What if when we get there, the housing you find for me is something my family cannot afford?" and they said, "That won't happen," we're just going with it. We have to. Let's give them all a chance. It seems they're pretty much taking chances on us right now, too.</p>

<p>After reading Scott Cowen's message to Tuklane employees, I realized their problems are immense compared to making sure my accounts receivable page is taken care of. Curioser, I understand your concern. The school my son is at is $4,000 less a semester, but it is a prestigous private school, and with the treatment they afforded us, I don't complain. However, with that said, I really feel Tulane will step up and do the right thing. It's just that now they are trying to find employees to get their paychecks to them and help them recover their lives.</p>

<p>I think the reason we may look impatient to others is that this last week seems to have gone on forever. I have a hard time remembering what day it is. Just a little over a week ago, my son's biggest concerns were making good grades this semester and applying for a job on campus in one of the labs. Then, in one weekend, everything changed. Hang in there. We'll get it sorted out.</p>

<p>I think that Tulane has acted honorably 100% through this, and it will all work out. Yes, it's very tight financially right now -- despite scholarhips, Tulane is still expensive and now a second set of R&B charges and more travel expenses and new clothes and new books (there is a $550 charge on my credit card for Tulane books) -- but it will all work out in the end. </p>

<p>Tulane has 1000s of students and employees, probably many of whom have lost most of their possessions not to mention, for the time being, their August paychecks. We need to relax and count on this taking months to sort out. </p>

<p>In the meantime, Willamette has an ID packet ready for dd, sheets on her bed, a roommate who was delighted to talk with her last night, and an advisor ready to meet with her Tuesday morning. I do feel pretty broke, but also pretty lucky.</p>

<p>I have another question which no one has addressed and that may be because, unlike me, no one else has misplaced their tuition refund insurance info. Does anyone know -- does it state whether it applies in cases of acts of God or natural disasters?</p>

<p>Stanford has said that it will allow the displaced students it takes to attend for free, knowing that they have already paid to their NO school. They said they felt it was important that the NO schools be allowed to keep the money to use for rebuilding, and at the same time the students should not have to pay twice. Hopefully other schools will do something similar.</p>

<p>As the parent of a Tulane senior who is at home attending one a state universities this semester, and paying tuition to do so, the latest posted on the Tulane website regarding tuition policies does not look like good news. It looks like Tulane is planning to keep the fall tuition of everyone who is attending classes anywhere. While I am trying hard not to over-react to this, I am dismayed. Can it possibly be legal for them to keep tuition fees paid for a service not delivered? For students who are attending comparable (and comparably expensive) private institutions who are effectively donating the service, I understand how the plan works. However, as the parent of three children in college, I cannot see how I can afford to pay Tulane prices for state university education. It looks like our option may be withdrawal from Tulane and trying to get readmitted for the spring. Am I missing something? Would love to hear others' thoughts on this.</p>

<p>Cantab,
I'm in the same boat. It just doesn't seem equitable, ethical, and maybe even legal, for this to be happening.</p>

<p>As the parent of a freshman, I was trusting that all the good will commentary made about Tulane would be true. However, unless I
see a change in policy, it certainly appears that they did not take the high road here. It's extremely disappointing, to say the least.</p>

<p>What I worry about if S withdraws, is whether they'll give him the same partial scholarship as before. I'm guessing not. In that case, even if he wants to go there (and I believe he still does), we can't afford it anyway. I don't really know what to do here.</p>

<p>worth reading:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/10/national/nationalspecial/10college.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/10/national/nationalspecial/10college.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>FYI: Tulane has posted a [url=<a href="http://emergency.tulane.edu/%5DFAQ%5B/url"&gt;http://emergency.tulane.edu/]FAQ[/url&lt;/a&gt;] on tuition issues (Sept 12th update). Some of the info may also apply to other Katrina-affected colleges</p>

<p>What wasn't answered for us is D is attending a school that is on the quarter system. If those quarter units are not counted as semester units by Tulane I am paying full semester tuition for only a quarter of school. Also since the units will transfer but not enough to cover a class requirement, she will probably to retake the courses at Tulane if she returns. Thus 18,000 spent on a quarter that will have to be repeated.
My D's feeling is to withdraw and then reapply for next fall if she decides to return. There are 11 freshman from Tulane at her school and quite a few are thinking they will try to stay the year and then go to Tulane next fall. They are feeling that they need to do that in order to transfer any meaningful units.
It would be more difficult to withdraw if there was a scholarship at risk. For us she ended up picking the most expensive of her choices.</p>

<p>Mom60, did the college your daughter entered assign her an advisor? My son had one assigned in engineering from day one. If so, have you been able to contact them through one of the yahoo groups posted on the web site? My son was able to contact his advisor and make some changes to his schedule per his advice. The FAQ stated that all courses would be transferred for credit. I didn't see an exclusion of quarter courses. Wish I could be more help.</p>

<p>alongfortheride- my D has not had the same positive experience as some others have had with Tulane. I don't know if it was because she was undeclared. She had no guidance other then the little booklet to plan her schedule. She was sent a notice regarding her advising group that they were meeting on the Monday the hurricane hit. It did not specify a person only that it was at Newcomb college. She was assigned a multi-class all female dorm and at move-in she was never even approached by her RA or the senior RA whose apartment was across the hall from D's room. We only found out the school was to close at 6 from one of the other RA's passing by who we stopped to ask a question regarding something else.
In contrast she has had nothing but helpful and positive experiences with her visiting school. Which also was very attentive all along through the application process. Tulane was the one school that she did not have any phone calls from. But she still wanted to go. So this is one more item that Tulane has neglected to clarify. If it is not done soon we will have no choice but to withdraw.
Talked with another Tulane student who was to attend a Univer of Ca which was on quarter system who has decided to take a semester off since she is not sure her classes will count for much. And she also doesn't want to spend her college savings on a quarter that might have to be repeated.</p>

<p>Re the quarter system: From what we have put together from various sources, a quarter credit counts as 2/3 a semester credit, so a student who stayed at a university on quarters all year and took 12 courses would have the equivalent of 8 semester hours ie a full year. That does not address the issue of each individual course in term of what it covers or its pertinence to a major. And of course it does not address the issues of students who only stay one quarter. Quite candidly, I felt that if dd attended the state school attended by one of her brothers, she would not cover the same material in a quarter that Tulane would cover in a semester and she would end up starting over from a content if not a credit standpoint. And I felt that if she went to Chicago with her other brother, she might well cover more in a quarter than in a semester almost anywhere else, so she would be ahead from a content standpoint but she wouldn't be able to get semester credit. Hence. a different school for her. It's quite a quandry.</p>

<p>I did find this while reading the transcript of the live chat Friday. I'm sorry that your daughter did not get the reception and advising that would have made this situation perhaps less confusing and uncertain. I'm hoping that someone from Newcombe is reading these threads and will correct the situation that created a less than wonderful start. My suspicion is that the RA's were preoccupied with the storm and the evacuation and did not manage to take care of other business in the meantime. Hopefully, in the future, ALL freshman students will be contacted by their advisors before the start of school. That certainly would have helped here - but then, hind sight is always 20-20. Here is that portion of the transcript:</p>

<p>How lenient are you going to be with taking credits from a school that is on quarters?</p>

<p>President Cowen: We understand the peculiarities of schools that are on the quarter system and have a way of translating that into a semester basis. We have done this in the past and would follow the same procedures in dealing with our student situations this semester.</p>

<p>alongfortheride and geena- I am sure that the credits will transfer at 2/3 of the semester unit. What is not clear is will they count her freshman english class and her having completed freshman english. I doubt it. So she will get credits but probably no courses out of the way. The best case scenario is looking to stay the full year at her new school. Unfortunately when we realized Tulane could not possibly open for the fall(several days before the announcement) I began making calls to the other schools she had been admitted to that had not already started. All that we called were willing to take her before any agreement was made with Tulane. Strangely but almost all her other schools were on the quarter system. Maybe it is a west coast thing. We acted quickly because we knew it was in her best mental interest to start college this fall. We never thought about the different in credits till she was at her new school. That is not Tulane's fault. I also wish she had had better guidance from Tulane and I think it would have eventually came.
I will say her new school has really stepped up and done a great job. D ended up with altitude sickness and bad dehydration and asthma not under control and ended up in the health center. That evening the Dr from the health center called to check up on her.</p>

<p>
[quote]
While I am trying hard not to over-react to this, I am dismayed. Can it possibly be legal for them to keep tuition fees paid for a service not delivered? For students who are attending comparable (and comparably expensive) private institutions who are effectively donating the service...

[/quote]
</p>

<p>It is an extraorindary situation indeed. Colleges elsewhere have agreed to forego tuition payments for these students, in order that to not impose additional immediate hardship, and so that Tulane and other colleges may keep the tuition revenue.</p>

<p>I think Tulane is being as fair as it can be, by considering all students to be Tulane students who are "visiting" elsewhere. Where they will be taking the high road, I assume, is to count all those credits (or as many as possible) whether or not they are "Tulane quality" or have Tulane equivalencies, in order that students will not delay graduation. It might be considered a 'service delivered' if they accept those credits as if they were taken at Tulane. Not accepting credits, not letting students count the semester (despite paying for it!) would be something else.</p>

<p>The alternative seems unworkable (well, I'm excluding the option of refunding all the moolah) --to, say, give refunds or discounts to students who ended up at a "lesser" place for the term. Who decides whether the student got a "Tulane quality" education for that term? How does one decide who got their Tulane-money's worth versus who didn't?</p>

<p>I understand how this doesn't feel wholly fair to you. If it were my son I'd have the same concerns. Tough situation, though--I don't know how Tulane could be fair to everyone. I think there are some losers in this deal, and students stuck at a sub-par place probably feel among them. Hopefully one term at a not-so-great place won't have an overall deleterious effect on your son's education, or on the overall value you feel you will get for your money over his entire 4-year (3.5 year? ) experience there.</p>

<p>Given their website, it sounds as though the a family concerned about not getting a "Tulane-worthy" education for their money should not enroll a student anywhere this fall term. Under those circumstances, Tulane will apply those fall tuition fees towards spring semester.</p>

<p>I do think hoedown has captured quite a bit of the complexity here. I have trouble viewing Tulane's approach, and the attitude which comes through in their statements, as anything other than taking the high road in extremely difficult circumstances. We need to remember that Tulane is a victim of Katrina, too, and that Tulane has a responsibility to its community of students, faculty and staff to work its hardest to rise from these flood waters intact and strong.</p>

<p>For the families whose kids are going to (as they see it) lesser schools or (as they know it) less expensive schools, I can certainly understand how you are feeling. Hoedown makes some good points about value still being received from Tulane and about the difficulty of deciding what is "equal," "better" or "lesser." We all had to evaluate fall-term options in such a hurry, with so many concerns on our minds (how quickly could we get our kids in? would there be housing? would they be behind in the coursework? what courses would they get and how comparable would they be? how would we get them there? etc. etc.).
Everyone had to make the decision which worked the best on all the different fronts for their family. Some folks may have chosen the "lesser" school from among other options; some may have had such a school as their only option - should these two situations be treated the same? I don't know.</p>

<p>Tulane certainly has provided the option hoedown ended with - which is to not attend anywhere this fall and receive full credit. They are not requiring anyone to pay for "services not rendered." They are saying that, if you wish to have Tulane credit for courses you are taking elsewhere, you will pay no more than your original Tulane tuition.</p>

<p>It does seem to me (but I may be wrong) that Tulane hasn't closed the door on considering how to treat these lower-cost schools and we can await further FAQ postings about their policies and/or use the call line (which I gather is difficult to get through on) with specific questions.</p>

<p>To me, Tulane seems to be working very hard to do what is equitable for the multitude of situations while also keeping its eye on the importance of doing what is right for the University. I'm not able to see that as "selfish."</p>

<p>From the livechat with President Cowen, currently ongoing, re those who are taking quarter classes. One questioner asked re her 14 quarter credits, which will convert to 9.33 semester credits. Dr. Cowen indicated that her tuition will be pro-rated, so that she will not pay full Tulane tuition for fall.</p>