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<p>At least from a faculty quality/research perspective, the top publics are actually quite strong in the humanities as well. Many people seem to accept publics can be stronger in the sciences/engineering than privates, but not in the humanities… but people tend to forget that it costs a lot less to have strong humanities programs than science/engineering programs.</p>
<p>Re: Post #200: “Haha, I doubt too many people on this forum would consider the University of Delaware all that prestigious, but come out with a Chem Engineering degree from there, and I don’t think anyone will look down there nose at you with the job prospects you will get.”</p>
<p>Exactly. While I don’t consider Delaware a “public ivy” in the sense that it offers as good an education as an elite private uni across a range of disciplines, it is top-notch in ChE.</p>
<p>There are few fields of study for which a given student is always going to get a better education at an elite private university. In many situations, a public university potentially can provide the better education in a certain field.</p>
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<p>I’ll say again, the problem is that the UCs are actually making up their numbers. There is no basis for this. If UC-Berkeley truly accepts students from the top 12% of California schools, then its even less likely, as 1/6 of those students would not be in the top 10%, and that sixth would have to be outnumbered 99-1.</p>
<p>They’re lying. That’s the bottom line. They don’t know what their statistics are, and so they are just completely lying.</p>
<p>@ JWT86</p>
<p>“At least from a faculty quality/research perspective, the top publics are actually quite strong in the humanities as well. Many people seem to accept publics can be stronger in the sciences/engineering than privates, but not in the humanities… but people tend to forget that it costs a lot less to have strong humanities programs than science/engineering programs.”</p>
<p>I do not know a whole lot about that. My statement was more to emphasize that getting an engineering degree from a top public (or more average public schools) can leave a person better off than one from high caliber privates than to bash on top public school education of humanities. Apologies.</p>
<p>Re: Post #200: “Economics, Linguistics, Philosophy, etc. I am sure those schools are superior.”</p>
<p>There is absolutely no evidence of this. </p>
<p>“I am sure majoring in Economics at Harvard will set someone else up much better than my plans could…”</p>
<p>Quite possibly true, depending on what you want to do. Certainly, East coast IBanks have a bias to recruit from the Ivies.
My guess is that many of the Econ majors at Harvard are closet business administration majors. Though schools like Harvard and Princeton don’t offer undergrad business degrees, business has been brought into the curriculum through the back door in the significant number of finance courses offered. But look at the economic mess the “best and the brighest” have made of things. They’re both unethical and incompetent.</p>
<p>I think we’re arguing over stupid stuff here.</p>
<p>I think UC-Berkeley belongs in the public ivies if such a thing existed. I think all of us can agree that it would be in the top 5-10 public schools.</p>
<p>Let’s just agree to disagree on the small stuff and agree to agree that UC-Berkeley is a prestigious university along with other public schools like Michigan, Virginia and that a degree there is going to set you well off in life.</p>
<p>Zapfino</p>
<p>Read post #204. The point of the statement was not to take away from humanities at publics as much as to emphasize the excellence of engineering at many of them. “I am sure” was not as much a statement of certainty as an acceptance of what RML said based on my lack of knowledge on the subject of humanities at public schools. Once again, apologies. Please take the statement as I meant it, and now have clarified for a second time.</p>
<p>coastin, no apologies necessary…you’re quite right that many public unis are excellent in engineering, probably better in many cases than elite privates. </p>
<p>My whole position in this thread is in support of the notion of “public ivy” and, for students of comparable ability, some public universities can provide an education as good as or better than an elite private university across a range of fields.</p>
<p>hawkette, ARE YOU KIDDING ME?</p>
<p>yet more of your wacked out comments.</p>
<p>geesh, so now you are saying that it is a better policy to not submit the bottom 30% of the SAT scores for the incoming class as Notre Dame is doing, versus the truthful approach of submitting ALL of the SAT and ALL of the ACT scores for the incoming class as most universities do?'</p>
<p>truly truly amazing and even worse than your pathetic comments that students should go to Rice over HYPM becasue Rice has a good baseball team.</p>
<p>finally broke a brain vessel I see.</p>
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<p>Coastin, my guess is that Princeton would win the cross admit battle with UC Berkeley in engineering students by 80/20 or even 90/10, even though UC Berkeley has an overall higher ranked undergraduate engineering department.</p>
<p><a href=“from%20a%20Princeton%20ChE%20alumnus%20that%20also%20was%20admitted%20to%20UC%20Berkeley%20ChE”>I</a>*</p>
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<p>^^^ JA12,
There might be many academic and nonacademic reasons that a UCB/Princeton cross-admit might choose Princeton. Nonetheless, do you think that your education in ChE would have been worse, the same, or better had you gone to UCB? Or, is this comparing apples and oranges, since the two programs might have different goals/purposes?</p>
<p>sakky, this statement by you says it all, particularly because the majority of UCB ChE got jobs outside the Bay Area.</p>
<p>you very specifically state that the bulk of UCB ChE’s will work in the bay area, which is patently false.</p>
<p>so please stop your nonsense, you were simply wrong and leave it at that.</p>
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<p>Which school some HS kid selects has little actual influence on which school has international prestige. In that arena UCB can hold it’s own with anyone.</p>
<p>zapfino, it would be hard to imagine a better ChE education for me outside of Princeton. Small classes, top professors, close working environment with those professors, pleasant and brilliant classmates. A team approach to studying. My independent research advisor was one of the best in his field in the world, the results were published and the Junior year, Senior year and graduate courses that I took in ChE were great. It was a long time ago, however, and the Princeton ChE department was among the top 3 at time with most classmates having chosen Princeton over MIT in ChE. In fact, the reputation of the department was such that our professors let us know that all we needed was a 3.0 GPA in the department to attend MIT’s prestigious graduate ChE program after graduation, if we chose to pursue that path.</p>
<p>This is just me, however - which was a very special experience. I would imagine that, for others, they would have received an equivalent ChE education at UC Berkeley.</p>
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<p>Re: Post #213:
Objectively, UCB has very high prestige derived from its graduate and research accomplishments. Subjectively, the perception of its prestige depends on the audience. That will vary across groups and regions.</p>
<p>I am not surprised by that JohnAdams, but like zapfino pointed out, there are many different reasons to go to this college or that, a good amount of which have nothing to do with academics. I would rather go to Villanova than Berkeley, but that is mostly because Berkeley is over 2,000 miles away.</p>
<p>Also, your argument with sakky has become an argument of the meaning of the word “bulk.” The majority of chemical engineers may work outside of the bay area, but do a greater amount than those who work in the bay area work in a single other place? I am not positive, but I am pretty sure this is what sakky is saying in response to you. Bulk does not mean more in the bay area or out of it, but bay area, or other individual areas. That was what I got out of it atleast.</p>
<p>coastin, please…</p>
<p>the sakky post on the “bulk” was made to show that the average UCB ChE salary was overinflated due to the “bulk” of its students working in the bay area. This is an absolute false statement. No more no less. If your review the location of where their students from the top 100 engineering programs in the country received jobs from, you will not see a large discrepancy in cost of living index compared to those of UC Berkeley, and this is the point that goes against what he was claiming.</p>
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<p>coastin, I agree with you regarding other reasons than academics, but I was only responding to the question that was posed to me. </p>
<p>If you want to discuss non-academic experiences, then, in my opinion, my experience at Princeton would be much much more overwhelming than what I would have gotten at any other college, and in particular UC Berkeley - but that is just me. </p>
<p>By the way, you might hear the same from most Princeton alumni - they just are very appreciative of the experiences that they went through in those 4 glorious years at Old Nassau.</p>
<p>[uqote]I am not surprised by that JohnAdams, but like zapfino pointed out, there are many different reasons to go to this college or that, a good amount of which have nothing to do with academics. I would rather go to Villanova than Berkeley, but that is mostly because Berkeley is over 2,000 miles away.
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<p>Ah I see. I couldn’t say too much intelligently about that so I’ll let you two discuss it. I did not mean to bash Princeton either. I went out of my way in an earlier post to say it was an excellent school, one that is beyond my standards and capabilities. However, I was responding to a post stating the superiority of the top private schools over the top public schools, no questions asked. Someone said you were a a ChE major at some point, and you seem to have a pretty decent knowledge about it to argue about such in depth topics as you were with sakky. Tell me, would I be better off going to the University of Delaware, Harvard, or Yale for ChE? This answer is obvious, and I could put in MANY more schools in place of UDel, as I am sure you could. This was my point, that public schools in many cases and for many people are better than top privates. I did not intend to bash your alma mater, but rather to give credibility to others, deservedly.</p>
<p>coastin, that is a very good question, particularly since Delaware is among the top 10 schools in the country for ChE (and has been for the last 30 years at least), Yale is around #50 and Harvard doesn’t have a ChE Program.</p>
<p>by the way, I didn’t perceive anything that you wrote to be negative against Princeton - your posts were fair.</p>
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