<p>I agree that it's useful to pick up some more conventional skills if one is also studying Film. Being able to write well, analyze well, think well is almost always an asset. Knowing something about a subject or three is next on the list.</p>
<p>BHG, I wouldn't discourage your child from investigating film study as I'm sure you'll find that most American colleges offer either film majors or the opportunity to take film courses in other departments. Just make sure that whatever school s/he chooses offers a range of options as it's still very early in the game for him/her and change is normal.</p>
<p>Film can mean two separate but related disciplines -- making them and studying them. The first, which includes video and digital imaging, usually falls in the art studio area, the second in humanities although some schools have a joint theory and practice department. NYU and USC are world famous for turning out industry super-stars, but many other LACs and universities are expanding their film offerings. For example Wesleyan offers a Film Studies degree and Brown has a department called Modern Culture and Media. At Williams, you can take film making and video courses in the Art Studio department and film study classes in Comparative Literature but you can't get a major in film per se. At Swarthmore (I think) you can major or minor in Film and Media Studies but most of the course offerings come from other departments.</p>
<p>The daughter of a very close friend just graduated from Brown with a degree in film making and is now living in a garret or somesuch making totally unmarketable art-films and museum end-use (or end-useless) video. She has received a lot of recognition in art circles, but this is very different from actually making a living at it. This is true of the artist's life, in many media. On the other hand there's Spielberg . . . </p>
<p>Basically, the study of film either as a major or as an adjunct to another department is as multifaceted as the study of art. You can make it for art's sake, you can make it for money's sake (if you're lucky both), you can read about it, you can write about it, you can teach it, you can litigate it, you can enjoy it personally and go on to something else altogether for your life's work.</p>
<p>In today's media-hungry world the study of film is increasingly akin to studying literature or art history. It IS literature and art history. A film studies major involves a great deal of analytical and writing skill and can easily be segued into the same career path or graduate school as an English degree. In short, you can do everything or nothing with it.</p>
<p>Disclosure: I'm not the best person to be giving advice on this topic. My son and I have half-serious agreement: He can take any class that interests him EXCEPT film! I'm a movie-holic myself but have no patience for the over-intellectualizing films. Of course, I also read Thackeray for fun (and I loved Latin.)</p>
<p>The question is not hypothetical for me. This happened October, senior year, when older S was applying to college. He already had applied and been accepted to his safety as a poli sci major. Poli sci made sense, since he'd always been interested in politics.</p>
<p>When he asked what I thought about his majoring in film, I was surprised. S said he was concerned about having a major that might not lead to a job, but he said he wanted to do it because he liked the broadcast course he was taking in h.s. I said (with fear in my heart), "Go for it." </p>
<p>S applied to his other college choices as a prospective film major. I also encouraged him to apply to U of Toronto, which he was interested in because it is in Canada, where he claimed he wanted to live. I even reminded him that a classmate of mine is a prof there and her husband is some kind of filmmaker, and I'd put a word for him in with them.</p>
<p>Among places that S applied to was Syracuse's fine film school. A few months later, he got a postcard from Syracuse asking for his portfolio. I assumed that meant that he would not get into Syracuse. He calle Syracuse, and got off the phone looking happy. I learned then, that in his spare time, he was writing film scripts, and had a 60-page one to send to them.</p>
<p>Long and short: He got accepted to Syracuse film school and to all of his choices except his reach school. He never bothered to apply to U of Toronto because he was too lazy to do the paperwork after getting into his first and second choice schools. </p>
<p>S ended up going off to his second choice school, which didn't have a film major, but offered him a full ride if he majored in a subject that he wasn't interested in majoring in. S liked this school because they were a big power in a sport that he follows as a fan.</p>
<p>S kept writing films while a freshman, and even managed to get a Hollywod agent for one (I kid you not) but didn't go to classes. The college, which loved him, told him clearly that he could do independent studies in film, but he never followed up. After freshman year, S decided to leave because "college is a waste of time" and he was sure his agent would sell his script and S would be rich. The script never sold.</p>
<p>S moved to a city big in the entertainment field and considers himself pursuing dreams of being in the music field. Now and then, we parents point out gently that S could go to college an arts-related school to pursue his entertainment-career dreams, but S says he will do things his way.</p>
<p>I think that there are lots worse things than being a film major in college. I am very glad that when S said he wanted to major in film, both husband and I encouraged him to pursue his dream.</p>
<p>I startedcollege as a film major and made it about 1 full semester before I changed my mind. First off it needs to be known that I hated the major and learned that I really did not have the passion for it that I thought I did... However I had a teacher give me some really interesting advice about the major. The professor tought a screenwritting class, and actually left the school (it is a CC, so not a big university) following the semester I had him, because one of his films actually (not oging to say the film for his sake, but I can promise many people on these boards have seen the movie) became huge. He told me that if I have talent and if I'm going to make it in the industry, a college degree won't really help. He said that the degree is pointless for film, and recommended that unless I truly love it, get out of the major.</p>
<p>Thanks for the stories and ideas. Sometimes when kids hit you with something a parent feels rather lonely, like they are the only person in the world who has to deal with this grief. It's nice to hear there may be an up side. We have a way to go here as he is a h.s. junior.</p>
<p>BHG:</p>
<p>As you may remember from some of my previous posts, my son wants to major in "FILM." Yes, that brings tremors to my heart as well. There are some important things to read, and there are some tremendous resources on this board. For example TheDad has no small amount of knowledge about USC and UCLA and how the two drastically differ.</p>
<p>One very important short item to read is: <a href="http://filmmaker.com/reviews-712.html%5B/url%5D">http://filmmaker.com/reviews-712.html</a></p>
<p>This is an argument AGAINST having a film degree.</p>
<p>Another resource is: <a href="http://www.tomedgar.com/fsc/%5B/url%5D">http://www.tomedgar.com/fsc/</a>
Tom Edgar was one of the authors of Film School Confidential. While this website and the book itself is about graduate film schools, it gives some very important insight into the USC approach.</p>
<p>When my son told me he wanted to go into "FILM" I wasn't too surprised. He's been making films since he was 8 years old: live action, computer animations, and stop-action animations. We fed that interest with computer power and software and digital video cameras and summer workshops, so I guess you could say that we might have some share in the blame. He's been very successful with his films, making money with weddings and getting a scholarship with one of his documentaries. (Note: I'm using the word "film," even though what he is doing is digital). At one summer workshop at DigiPen in Redmond, Washington, my son's instructor chose his animation of a character study to show at the final meeting of students and parents. He also told my son that with his talent, he HAD to make digital animation a career. However, once he started making some documentaries and his first fictional movie with his own crew, he was really hooked.</p>
<p>But with all of this, I still don't think that FILM is a great major. However, there are some schools that have the philosophy that the heart of a film degree is a strong liberal arts education. These are the schools to search out.</p>
<p>Another thing that soothes my worries about this whole thing is that my son is also very technically oriented, and math and science are very strong interests as well. He's currently taking AP Calculus and AP Physics and is the president of the school's astronomy club and president of the technology club. He makes money these days by creating web sites for businesses - and we're talking fairly complex sites with databases, forums (like this one), Flash animations, and so on. He does a lot of programming ("just for fun") and has written two tutorials on calculator programming that are featured on one of the largest calculator web sites. These get almost 200 downloads a day.</p>
<p>Anyway, this is not meant to brag, but to show why I'm not too concerned about the film major. If he's successful, I see him having his own independent business, rather than going into the Hollywood machine. If he's not (or changes his mind), he's got the skills and interest to have his own technical business.</p>
<p>Let me suggest two more things: First, if your child is also interested in the technical aspects, look at things like RIT's program in photo sciences.</p>
<p>Second, take a look at Ohio University's fantastic program in Telecommunications, with specialities in Video Production, TCom Business, Audio Production, and other tracks. Not only did it look good on paper, but we were even more impressed with their facilities and equipment when we visited. This is not FILM per se, but does involve all of the production and editing that seems to be of interest today. And they have some fantastic internship relationships as well.</p>
<p>Sorry this is so long, but this is a subject near and dear...</p>
<p>-Bob (digi)</p>
<p>Hey, I don't know why people are beating up on Latin. I am learning Latin for fun! Anyone have any ideas on good books for a beginner? :)</p>
<p>Is there a "Latin for Dummies?" Don't laugh - some of the Dummies books are EXCELLENT. I found the "French for Dummies" very useful, and "PERL for Dummies" (PERL is a programming language) was one of the best introductions to PERL I could find!</p>
<p>Thanks, digmedia! There is a "Latin for Dummies". :)</p>
<p>Our suburban high school has a strong mass media program with several kids admitted each year to Tisch, some to California schools, and others to colleges with recognized film production programs. One of my kids did not take these high school courses but,
being a big movie fan, decided junior year of high school he wanted to pursue film. So he enrolled in a summer media production course at a top university where he was later accepted to its film/tv/radio department. The school provides a strong liberal arts education so he is taking distribution requirements with students from across the university. He loves the film production courses and spends many weekends working on his own projects or other students' film projects. We are delighted with his passion for film and film production because he found the last 1 1/2 years of high school boring and slacked off. We believe that as a youngster he was hyperactive and borderline ADD but have observed, similar to SBMom, that working with equipment helps him focus better. He also loves to shmooze and work as part of a team which is important in many aspects of film production. Even if he is unable to land a job in film, we are thankful that he is motivated now. He found a summer internship at a NYC company; he found this on his own and did not receive school credit for it. He was paid minimum wage and helped out on some shoots. Even though the company did not do what he specifically was interested in, the summer work was educational and he learned a lot. He is in LA now for a three months' internship arranged by his university. We are thrilled that he recognized his interest in film and has been able to pursue it.</p>
<p>Before his freshman year I think I bought S "The Idiot's Guide to Learning Latin."
Yesterday he told me that even if he wins a BU Latin scholarship--and he thinks he has a 5% chance --- he's going to refuse it, because he would be required to take a Latin course every semester for two years. He's ready for Italian.</p>
<p>Last year we had dinner with a couple whom we hadn't seen in years. His older son had graduated with a degree in "film criticism." His wife, who had known the boy for years, is a well known movie afficianado. I mentioned that it must be fun to discuss film with him. She commented that he "restricts his criticism to films that no one sees and never sees commercial films of any sort!" He writes during the day for a small counterculture paper, and manages a health food store at night. </p>
<p>I think it is great when a HS can support a range of of esoteric courses . So long as they are doing the full range of AP/IB math/sci/lang/ss/eng classes, I think it is fabulous when they offer such courses as "electronic music" such as our school does. I have known kids who had found no nitch for themselves who have taken this course (they are inevitably also kids in rock bands) and realized that in order to really make electronic music you have to understand physics , and then they realize they have to do some more math and well...you get the picture. </p>
<p>Furthermore, sometimes top top students take these courses and then make very interesting college and career choices. My son's best friend (top 5%) is studying music engineering- it is a double major with music and computer science, and he is working darn hard in University. He knows exactly what he wants to do. </p>
<p>Son #1 took classes in technical theater, electronic music, etc in HS on top of 8 AP/IB classes. They were his respite and just a great break for him, plus he now has a really fascinating set of interests and skills! In fact, given that he wants to be an English major/writer- I think these were just the sort of classes he should take (along with physics and calculus that is!!)..</p>
<p>What would I do? I know based on the lack of jobs ( although they are there) that she would have a tough time. However, I don't believe in stifling intellectual curiousity. I would probably tell her that getting a job in that industry is slim,but if she really wants it then she should do it. However, I certainly would encourage a double major or a strong minor in something else.</p>
<p>Moreover, certain schools have a much better track record with the film industry than others, and my daughter should be aware of this fact. The top schools would be Yale, NYU, Emerson, UCLA, and USC. RIT has a tremendous program in immaging science too. Some of the Art schools might have some decent connections such as RISD and PRATT etc. However, if she doens't go to one of these schools, her realistic chances to get into the industry are really slim! </p>
<p>I would also point out, as an example, a friend who majored in film at Univ of Maryland Baltimore Campus who couldn't get a decent job in the industry for love or money.</p>
<p>However, the bottom line is that it must be her decision. I don't want my daughter to EVER come to me and say," you screwed up my life by making me major in a subject that I detest." I don't want that responsibilty! It has to be her choice in whatever major. I can only make subtle suggestions.</p>
<p>Anyway, that is my 2 cents on this issue.</p>
<p>I would encourage my child to follow their desires, I would suggest they consider a University or college that offers a variety of choice majors because I think it is good to meet people with diverse interests. I would also remind my child that students often switch majors as they are exposed to new ideas at school. I think a college that changes you and your desires by opening doors you didn't know existed is wonderful.</p>
<p>I have known many law school graduates that ended up selling life insurance and real estate for a living, but who had no life. I would rather have an artist child who was enthusiastic about their craft, than a shoe store manager who settled.</p>
<p>It would never dawn on me to suggest to my daughter that she needs to be preparing for a specific career while in college or that she shouldn't major in something that doesn't have a one to one correlation with a career. At the moment, she's planning to major in some interdisciplinary history subject and is considering minoring in .... Latin. She does have a list of possible careers that she could end up in after graduate school, and there's always the possiblility of law school. (She came up with the list of possible careers because it was a question on her college application.) But we've never looked at college as a way to prepare her to make money; it's a way to prepare her for living what I think of as the good life--a life of thought and of critical reading & thinking and of knowing how to learn.</p>
<p>I guess I have a different feeling about a kid saying he wanted a particular college major than some of the initial posts on this thread. While I do understand how some might want their kids to get a practical degree or whatever, I would not care WHAT my child's major was. I just would want them to major in whatever interests them. Maybe I am foolish but I never thought of it any other way. I guess when I first read the thread, I was not sure what the question was really about. I truly do not care what major my kids pick, nor would sway them. I might discuss their interests and the possibilities of what you can do with those interests. If my child said he/she was interested in film, I think the next thing would be to explore the field as much as he/she can before college, particularly if applying to a college where one must declare this major ahead of time (apply directly into such a program). To do this, I would suggest summer programs, independent studies, local college classes, internships, job shadowing, etc. If the child feels pretty sure he/she loves this field, I would gather many resources to learn more about it. Then research college programs. I would discuss if he/she was ready to commit at age 17 to apply directly to a film program such as the one at Tisch/NYU or to choose a college that has a film major in a liberal arts setting (Columbia, etc). Also, there are many careers, as others pointed out, where such a degree can be used. There are so many facets to this field. Also, the student would be getting a liberal arts degree as well. This major could be a jump off point that can go in many directions. If anything, in some ways, it can be a more "practical" major than some liberal arts majors. </p>
<p>But for me, the only important factor is to study what you love. The rest can follow. I suppose if some might be concerned that their kid wanted to study film, then they surely would be concerned to have a kid like mine who is pursuing musical theater which is a field that is a hard one to make it in. But I never questioned this pursuit. I am not worried about its "practicality" or stuff like that. I feel my kid will get a college education (you always have that) and will pursue her passions, go for it, and if she never makes it on stage (after trying), there are many corollary things she can do such as write, direct, choreograph, musical direct or even teach......or do something totally different some day. </p>
<p>I guess my reaction is that whatever my kid wants to study, support it, be resourceful in learning more about it, encourage study and work experiences in the field, find college programs to explore that passion, and then see where it goes. While that is my take on it, I realize others might feel differently in terms of guiding kids to pursue certain fields or not. I personally would have no problem having my kid be interested in majoring in film.</p>
<p>Well, it worked for Spielberg . . . </p>
<p>I would be a little taken aback if my S said that as well, but on the other hand it's always good to see teenagers discover a passion for something.</p>
<p>I totally agree with you soozievt
I don't think film is any stranger than computers , psych or math. IF students have classes in high school that encourage an interest that is EXCITING!
I would love for my daughter to be excited about film. However as she is a freshman and had few electives, she likes her bio and spanish classes but I would love for her to be able to take some electives.
In college, I think the quality of the school is more important than which particular major the student eventually chooses. I lean towards schools with meaningful distribution requirments as I think it is useful in any field to have basic history/science/arts/literature/math etc, but as to major, that isn't my decision.
My daughter loves science and science education. She isn't attending a school with education degree program but will have to go to grad school for that. She does have a friend who is very interested in film however and even produced something for the Edinburgh film festival ( she attends Harvard) which is terribly exciting.
I think film is a wonderful field, and very broad, ( and personally I would be much more inclined to push a student in this area as opposed to working someplace like Microsoft- unless of course that is what really floats their boat but Microsoft?)</p>
<p>What is a practical degree in this era of globalization? The rise of the internet is truely going to be seen as large a shift as the Industrial Revolution. The network allows us to outsource intellectual work much like manual labor. It also allows consumers (and businesses) unprecedented access to information, including competitive pricing. When we go to the web to search for the lowest price for something, we forwarding the entire process of globalization.</p>
<p>So, what does that have to do with a film major/career? Many of the "safe" majors (in terms of jobs) are no longer that way. The outsourcing of intellectual talent (as well as other labor) is only beginning. Even MacDonalds is using networks now. In many outlets, when you pull up to the drive-up ordering screen, the person who takes your order is not actually in the restaurant. They're working from an order center, where thay can be much more efficient. The orders are entered into a computer for display in the restaurant, and one order-taker can do the job of two or three since they can service many restaurants and not wait around for the next car or during slack times. Soon, your MacDonalds order-taker may have a slight Indian accent. So what is safe? What jobs require "hands-on" people? Certainly medical. Perhaps education and (some) law. Entertainment? In not too many years, we'll actually have virtual talent. But constructing the end products for entertainment - cinema, TV, radio, music, and others - will still require people. Maybe film is not such a bad future anyway, for those with the passion for it.</p>
<p>And when film entertainment becomes digitally distributed - like music is now (much to the consternation of the recording industry) - the line between independent distributors and Hollywood will start to fade.</p>
<p>Excellent advice here. A few additional thoughts: the majority of college students change their major at least once, so it is very likely your son may ultimately change his mind. </p>
<p>Also, my parents thought I was nuts to transfer to a very expensive private university and major in "communications". The agreement I had with them was that I would take classes as many classes as possible that were "skills related" and could help me get a job after graduation. I also worked very hard at lining up "real world" internships every year. It all worked out fine (although I didn't make much money at first, neither do most recent college grads).</p>
<p>My daughter is looking at majoring in history - she is not interested in going to law school (I actually couldn't imagine a worse career fit). About the only job a history degree will lead directly to is teaching but I don't really see her doing that either. She is also interested in art and psychology - neither of which provides any clear guarantee of a job or even career direction after graduation. Last week she was talking about sociology or anthropology. It does send shivers down our spines --- but I have asked her to do the same thing my parents asked of me: major in whatever interests you but take at least some classes that will give you marketable skills and try to do as many "real world" internships as possible. </p>
<p>By the way, my ninth grader has mentioned the possibility of majoring in ANCIENT GREEK several times. Hope he minors in LATIN so he can order a meal in any ancient restaurant he stumbles across. :) But I'll give him the same advice as I'm giving my daughter whatever he eventually decides.</p>
<p>Sometimes you just have to trust that it is all going to work out.</p>