<p>I just finished my sophomore year of EE at Univeristy of Maryland, College Park. im got into Cornell for undergrad, but the cost was so great. now i am thinking about getting my master's there. i hear master's of science is FREE if you get in and be a TA. is that true? I really hope I can get my resume a boost by going there and hopefully even dabble in finance. thats after i get my masters and BS in EE.</p>
<p>any advice?</p>
<p>i hear master's of science is FREE if you get in and be a TA.</p>
<p>But are you guaranteed to be offered a TA position if you're a master's students? I doubt it. TA positions would typically go to all the phd students first i think. It can't hurt to apply though and find out if you can be a TA.</p>
<p>Cornell has almost no M.S. students - it's either Master of Engineering (MEng), a 1-year professionally-oriented degree, or PhD. And almost no MEng students receive financial assistance (or TA/RA positions).</p>
<p>To the OP:</p>
<p>I would say that if your ultimate goal is to get the MBA, then, frankly, you don't really need a master's in engineering. After you get the MBA, you're probably never going to want to work as an engineer ever again in your life, and hence your engineering master's is not going to carry much value. You might work as an * engineering manager *, but probably not as a pure engineer.</p>
<p>to sakky, thanks for the reply, ill take it into consideration. i think the master's is for more options in case i later decide I do not want to get an MBA. what I hear is the undergraduate education for EE is not enough since EE is evolving everyday.</p>
<p>and to john lennon, i see what you mean. i hear that most people go to cornell for the one year MEng thing, so I might have to look elsewhere if I want to get a free master's. i do know UMCP has a thing where master's students work 20 hours a week (easy IT / desk work where u can sleep or do hw) and you get 9 credits of tuition for FREE if you are OUT-of-state. i am in state, so it might be free tuition.</p>
<p>but yes, i guess if I get an MBA, the masters might be "not as valuable' but I am a purist. i don't want to be a manager that just tells people what to do without knowing what is going on :\ i wanna tell people what to do, but at the same time, be able to do it myself.</p>
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This would seem to be an argument for not getting your masters. You are basically saying that EE is such a dynamic field that what you need is more a general skillset and background than a specific set of classes (or the like). </p>
<p>A better bet than trying to get financial assistance for a M.S. or M.Eng. through a school might be simply going to work for a few years after graduating. If, after a few years, you feel your work experience (and understanding of the industry you want to come back to and manage) is enough for admission to where ever you want to go for your MBA, then you can go right for that (maybe getting the company to pay for it). Even more likely would, if you still wanted the masters in engineering and some work experience after that, be getting your M.S. or M.Eng. and having the company pay for it with your guarantee of a few years of service with them after getting it (given they pay you a competitive salary and all that).</p>
<p>hmm valid points john!</p>
<p>to respond to your quote of me, what i really meant was since EE has so many branches and sub-disciplines, i feel you don't know enough about any one field after undergrad. so i think i should go to grad school (masters) to get good in a field. maybe working a while will help me see what field is hot. but i don't think i want to work and then go back to school, just my personality... haha i like being a student =)</p>
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but yes, i guess if I get an MBA, the masters might be "not as valuable' but I am a purist. i don't want to be a manager that just tells people what to do without knowing what is going on :\ i wanna tell people what to do, but at the same time, be able to do it myself.
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<p>Well, not to burst your bubble, but that scenario you laid out is basically inevitable. As a manager, you will obviously be spending time on managerial tasks, not technical tasks, and so the fact that you're not touching the technical material inevitably means that you're going to lose your technical knowledge. That's the tradeoff you have to make. </p>
<p>As a case in point, during the early years of Microsoft, Bill Gates insisted on personally reviewing every single line of code that Microsoft ever shipped in its software, and would still write significant pieces of code himself. But later he just couldn't do that anymore because his managerial tasks consumed all his time. Bill Gates may have been the best coder in Microsoft during the early years but clearly not so lately, just because he's not actively coding anymore.</p>
<p>I am in a similar situation, as I am starting a PhD program (biomed eng) with the intent to opt out with a MS so I can earn a little money on the way.</p>
<p>I understand the logic that if you want into an MBA, one would be better off working instead of graduate school. However, my rationale is that to get into a good mba program, (top-20) you would need really good work experience. Especially if your undergrad is not a national powerhouse and your grades are not outstanding.</p>
<p>With a BS, there are good jobs available, but they are also pretty predictable: Quality engineer 1/2, R&D engineer 1/2, etc.</p>
<p>With an MS you could start out at a much higher level, and put yourself closer to the business/management side of the industry. Additionally, I think it would be easier to show an admissions committee that an MBA will be of immediate and substantial use.
Also it gives a chance to build a good alternative transcript, not just for gpa's sake, but also to take a few background classes in econ/finance.</p>
<p>Does this rationale make sense? Or is one really just better off working instead?</p>
<p>the average person in an MBA program is close to 27-29 years old. As a rising junior in college, I think I am more focused on getting into a master's program. It might be a good idea to take a few classes on business but I am in the hinman ceos program, umd-cp's entrepreneurship program and i hope through that I will be able to pick a lot about how to manage a business. </p>
<p>but i am sure i don't need to take business classes in undergrad simply im sure i can just get the books and read it on my own. even though i want to get an MBA, it seems pretty far-fetched right now. but i definitely appreciate the advice. </p>
<p>and to sakky, the only reason i want a masters(1-1.5 year program) is so i get an one-up against other people my age. im sure if i have a masters, as opposed to working right out of college, my increased knowledge would help put me on the fast track to management. hopefully :p</p>
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With an MS you could start out at a much higher level, and put yourself closer to the business/management side of the industry. Additionally, I think it would be easier to show an admissions committee that an MBA will be of immediate and substantial use.
Also it gives a chance to build a good alternative transcript, not just for gpa's sake, but also to take a few background classes in econ/finance.</p>
<p>Does this rationale make sense? Or is one really just better off working instead?
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and to sakky, the only reason i want a masters(1-1.5 year program) is so i get an one-up against other people my age. im sure if i have a masters, as opposed to working right out of college, my increased knowledge would help put me on the fast track to management. hopefully
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<p>While I sympathasize with you guys' positions, I would say that it's STILL probably a waste for you to get an MS if you're eventually gunning for an MBA. Yes, an MS will get you a higher position than if you had just a BS. But more so than somebody with a BS + 1-2 years of experience? That's highly questionable. Nor can I agree that the increased knowledge you would pick up in the MS really put you on the fast track to management. I wish it did, but the truth is, it probably doesn't. The truth is, you don't really get tagged for management because you have strong technical skills. you get tagged for management because you have strong soft skills, and these are things you probably won't learn by picking up an MS. </p>
<p>Look, if you can get an MS without having to spend any extra time, then I would say to absolutely do it. Or if you can make a major jump in ranking from your BS to your MS school such that you get access to a significantly improved chance at getting top jobs, then that might work out well too. {For example, I know people who graduated from low-tier schools and entered master's programs at MIT and Stanford not because they really cared about getting the master's, but just because they wanted access to the MIT and Stanford recruiting. Heck, some of them didn't even bother to finish their master's after they got the plum job that they wanted.} </p>
<p>But otherwise, getting an MS when your ultimate goal is to get an MbA just doesn't seem to be a very efficient use of time. Like I said, once you get an MBA, you're not going to want to go back to working as an engineer.</p>
<p>thanks so much sakky. your point made a lot of sense. and yes, i bet if I did get an MBA, I would not want to do engineering anymore. a quick question, what are "soft skills", is that people skills? </p>
<p>I guess the only reason I am so persistent in saying I wanna get a MS or MEng is because I know if could get one for cheap and fast (almost free/one year) at UMD-CP, the college I am in now. It is ranked #16 in EE for grad. But like you said, undergrad and the school's name in general is not that represented. people always ask about the basketball team when I tell them I am from maryland. and also about the MS / MEng, I know it is much easier to get one than an MBA. I am afriad if I pass on the MS, and regret it if I do not get into a school for my MBA.</p>
<p>I am definitely considering top 10 / big name schools, such as cornell for my MS, for networking purposes in addition to academics.</p>
<p>I'm also an engineer who aspire to get an MBA degree.</p>
<p>As sakky stated, getting an MS degree could be a waste of time, but people who normally get top jobs or top MBA programs usually have stellar undergrad-GPA (3.5+).</p>
<p>I don't have that outstanding 3.5 + gpa, nor do I have a good gpa (little over 3.1). This would be a great disadvantage for good jobs. However, with insane amount of luck, I got accepted to a school's masters program which is ranked w/in top 5. Maybe it was my junior and senior GPA (~3.6)... I don't know... and I could careless since I got in.</p>
<p>Therefore, I am planning to go pursue an MS degree for a fresh start and to hopefully get a better job and redeem my grades from my freshman and sophomore years in college. (There are SO many ways to get a free MS degree). RAs forexample.</p>
<p>Maybe for people with a slow start in college like myself, this might be a better alternative... From my experience, the majority of college students start slow (drinking, crazy insane stupid but fun things)... hopefully this will shed some light for those who are like me : ). And hopefully this will work for me too!</p>
<p>What do you guys think?</p>
<p>I'm not sure what exactly you want to do with EE, but I'd argue 100% that actual work experience in an industry is many times more valuable than having a masters in terms of working your way into management. They don't care what kind of theoretical knowledge you've gained - they want managers who understand the industry they will be managing. You don't gain that sort of understanding in school - you'll learn all of the technical jargon that you'll need to be an engineer, not the practical knowledge you'll need to be a manager. Why do you think business schools almost unilaterally require significant work experience these days, and are unlikely to give anyone with a masters in an unrelated discipline any sort of boost (in terms of admissions) unless they've already demonstrated excellence on the job (through promotion etc)?</p>
<p>i guess my reason is i want an MBA, but i need a back-up as well. im in no rush to get an mba, getting a masters may delay it, but not hurt my chances.</p>
<p>Those are good points about management, but (at least for biomed) there are a lot of jobs that aren't available if you don't have an advanced degree. Also, I am starting school next fall after taking 2 years off, and the people from my major who went directly into industry don't seem to have advanced that much in a managerial sense. Some got great reviews after a year and higher salaries, and the majority used their experience to get a job at another company, again for a higher salary.
On the other hand, some older students I know got their MS and went in to higher positions, and they seem to work much more directly with management (CTOs, Development directors, etc.), which seems to be a key to progressing faster.</p>
<p>I should mention that I am not interested in getting an MBA so I can drop engineering and go into investment banking. I am more interested in getting into medical device consulting (product research and design). Therefore, I would think that you would have to show some level of expertise in the field beforehand.</p>
<p>It's funny, but I think a big problem for engineering/mba hopefuls is that its such a new pursuit that there is almost no one who can give firsthand advice.</p>
<p>"On the other hand, some older students I know got their MS and went in to higher positions, and they seem to work much more directly with management (CTOs, Development directors, etc.), which seems to be a key to progressing faster."</p>
<p>oooh nice.</p>
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what are "soft skills", is that people skills?
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<p>Generally speaking, yes. More specifically, they are things like the ability to communicate well, to lead people, to get people to do what you want them to do even if you don't hold any formal power over them (i.e. you're not their boss), the ability to sell (not just products, but also yourself and your own abilities - this is a crucial skill in interviews), the ability to size people up quickly, the ability to lead, etc.</p>
<p>hmm that sounds good...</p>