Ok, he apparently took a sabbatical and then it seems that they resigned as masters, the following May and he left. But this shows how it’s tough to rely on any one or few articles.
Especially when the goal is to understand the whole climate.
Also still amused by the pairing of schools that have protests AND suppress ‘free speech’.
My daughter was at Yale during the “Halloween Event.” She was barely aware of it. It’s not like those shouting matches have more than a couple of handfuls of students involved. The rest of the students are, you know, busy.
None of the Ivies has a politically hostile environment. Typically Ivies have been among the strongest backers of Free Speech.
Still both conservatives and liberals do need to be reminded that free speech means allowing people you disagree with speak. Recently, this has been more true for liberals, but historically, it has been true just as true for conservatives. As a young person, try to remember that speech that you/everyone likes doesn’t need protecting. The First Amendment protects speech that people don’t like.
The only time free speech should be a problem on a college campus is when that speech is creating a hostile environment by targeting certain students because of a group the are a member of. An institution of higher learning can’t function effectively when its students are being threatened.
As far as Ivies go, you might consider getting admitted to one or more first, and then narrowing it down once you are in. However, I would agree with others, that the Ivies where the average student tends to be the least politically active are probably Dartmouth, Cornell and Penn.
@monkey2001 Dartmouth, Penn, Princeton, Harvard tend to be more moderate in that regard.
Brown, Columbia, Yale tend to be on the other side.
Dont know much about Cornell.
Brown is certainly politically hostile for conservative students. I thought that was common knowledge.
I am defining “hostile” as students having legitimate and well-reasoned fears of significant social ostracization for holding a particular political belief (not including “fringe” beliefs such as ACTUAL fascism/Nazis or Communism).
A student who wants to do anything relating to Israeli - Palestinian politics should expect a lot of bigoted nastiness. This has been the case for decades at just about any campus (or anywhere else) that such politics is brought up.
When’s the last time some of you were actually on an Ivy campus, lol? See all those students headed to class, labs, the library, practice, performances, and more? You think theyre all either ultra liberal or beaten down by oppression? You’re trying to take an incident or two and blow it up to a personal crisis among any and all more conservative types?
Why?
Pick a topic. You assume only one side of any issue goes to these colleges, no one questions?
“Significant social ostracization?”
Based on what?
And you don’t think kids can hold ideas on the Israeli-Palestinian sitiation without something erupting?
There are extremists on any issue. Try to look deeper than anecdotes.
And not all students are out there espousing their beliefs 24/7. They’re there to learn and grow and they can and do.
Can we quit painting in such broad strokes?
When was the last time I was on an Ivy campus? I basically grew up on one!
I don’t know why we are focusing on the Israel-Palestine issue(s), because I did not mention that in my post, but I’ll bite. I find it interesting because my school, Michigan, had a huge student government vote regarding Divestment last month, and the discussions and community input were very tense and nasty (not respectful) - this has happened every year for the past 11 or so years. So yes, it seems rather difficult for a student to openly hold views on the matter without social ostracization of some kind.
But back to Brown. It is astoundingly liberal, and conservative students there will find little support. I am a liberal and willing to admit that. I have friends there and they admit that. I go to Michigan, and am willing to admit that we have severe campus climate issues surrounding hostility based on sociopolitical beliefs (although not as extreme as schools like Brown or Berkeley).
I never argued that the vast majority, or even majority of students engage in political discourse at any of the aforementioned schools. I am just stating that the many politically “loud” students will be overwhelmingly liberal, and likely hostile to conservatives. This can and often does have profound social consequences for those in the political minority.
No Ivy can be astoundingly liberal, by my definitions, and I work for one (one role being directly involved with students.) There will always be noisemakers. But to imply conservatives won’t find support (I assume you mean like-minded peers) is just off.
You did state, “Brown is certainly politically hostile for conservative students.” You seem to now be qualifying that.
Most kids are quietly going about their business, not engaging in hot topics. That’s not suppression, it’s focus. They find companionable friends, study groups, go forward.
And as had been said for UC Berkeley, if they spot a rally, they can walk around it.
This is an odd spin on the usual diversity complaints. There are many types on these campuses.
I’m not saying they won’t find any likeminded peers - I never wrote that. I said that the vast majority of those involved in political discourse (of which I never claimed were all students) will socially ostracize them. If the most vocal people on campus (who are often also in influential student leadership positions) do that, you cannot pretend the social implications do not exist. Also, not all Ivies are the same - I think you are now, as you said, “painting in broad strokes”. I never classified all Ivies as astoundingly liberal - I was just talking about Brown. I’m not the one making generalizations here.
I’m not buying it. The only difference between Brown and places like Yale and Dartmouth (and to a certain extent, Trinity in NESCAC) is that those latter schools have longstanding alumni connections at some of the most influential conservative media and think tanks in the country (National Review, FOX network, American Enterprise Institute, etc.) and they are magnets for up and coming conservative gadflies. At almost any other college in the northeast, if you limit your social circle to the same people who run for student government, you are cutting out 90% of the student body. That’s on you. That is your decision.
The Princeton Review has a list of the schools with the most liberal students. Only one Ivy League school made the list and I suppose it surprises nobody in this discussion. https://www.princetonreview.com/college-rankings?rankings=most-liberal-students
I cannot believe you are claiming that is the “only difference” between Brown and schools like Dartmouth. Brown and Dartmouth are VERY different schools with VERY different cultures and campus climates.
Also, you are wrong to assume that the “most vocal” students necessarily equates to those in student government.
^ I agree. The only similarity between Brown and Dartmouth is that they are both smaller, more-undergrad focused schools. The culture, vibe and student experience are vastly different.
@yikesyikesyikes - I was paraphrasing you:
Student leadership positions does not necessarily mean student government…
Along with the SGA (or the school equivalent - at Michigan it is called “Central Student Government” or “CSG”), many colleges have influential student groups (for example, at Michigan: IFC, Panhel, Dance Marathon or “DMUM”, and MUSIC Matters).
That is what I meant by student leadership positions (the exact organizations will likely be different at Brown than Michigan, but you get the point).
^Well, with all due respect, no. I don’t get your point. You also wrote that it wasn’t a matter of conservatives finding “like-minded peers”. Are you saying conservatives can’t belong to more than one student organization? Is there any evidence to support that?
This thread has become awfully hostile. :))
But seriously, I was just asking a question. I really don’t understand why any discussion on this website gets so heated. And furthermore, my previous threads are not related to this one, so please do not bring them up, as they are irrelevant. Me being a HS sophomore does not take away my right or ability to inquire.
And as far as what ‘hostile’ means, I am referring to an environment in which students whose political views do not agree with that of the majority would likely be subject to unfair or harsh treatment.
Based on this, I would estimate UPenn as closest to what you’re looking for, but you can draw your own conclusions.