<p>I like USNews, but it makes it very difficult when trying to compare different types of schools. For example, a national university vs. a LAC. I liked the set up of Forbes, but I thought their methodology was a little odd. What's the consensus around here?</p>
<p>The only consensus your will find is that responders usually like the rankings that reflect positively on their favorite schools. Few will bother with analyzing the relevance of the methodology.</p>
<p>Hence the fans of public and research universities will tend to look with scorn at the USNews (which focuses on inputs and undergraduate education) and cling to the irrelevant research rankings a la ARWU or THES. </p>
<p>In the middle, you will find the “neither fish nor fowl” follies a la Mother Teresa rankings that pretend to “reward” social mobility. Or rankings that think that the almighty University of Texas at El Paso is a “better” school than Harvard, despite graduating a third of its students and accepting in the high nineties of all applicants. </p>
<p>If a personal opinion is what you want, I would suggest that the best tool remains the USNews and this despite its serious disinterest in integrity and transparency and its asinine inclusion of a peer and counselors’ assessment. Its best use is, however, NOT in the ranking but in the ancillary information that form the end ranking. </p>
<p>And, fwiw, the fact that it separates the schools is a bonus and not a negative. Although one has to wonder why they did not depart from the Carnegie classification by leaving the academies in a much more adequate category.</p>
<p>USNews rankings are largely based on reputation, which gets harder to measure the further down the list you go. The Times Higher Education ranking of world universities puts the primary emphasis on measurable metrics, specifically the number of times publications by faculty members are cited by researchers in other academic publications. The rankings are similar but far from identical. The Times Higher Education rankings also include non-U.S. universities. Here is a link to their most recent listing.</p>
<p>[World</a> University Rankings 2012-2013 - Times Higher Education](<a href=“http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2012-13/world-ranking]World”>World University Rankings 2013-14 | Times Higher Education (THE))</p>
<p>I don’t think the world university rankings are very helpful in determining where to go for a good undergraduate education. I agree with Xiggi that USNews, despite its flaws, is at least aimed at what a students is trying to find out. Another approach is to forget lists and look at some college guides, which provide more info.</p>
<p>And, of course, there’s always: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/978040-ranking-colleges-prestigiosity.html?highlight=prestigiosity[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/978040-ranking-colleges-prestigiosity.html?highlight=prestigiosity</a></p>
<p>Only CC would try to rank the rankings haha.</p>
<p>Ideally rankings would measure outcomes and educational quality. </p>
<p>US News barely even tries to measure either one. </p>
<p>Forbes tries to measure both, but the measures used are often laughable (e.g. RateMyProfessor). </p>
<p>No rankings are very satisfying because the important things are hard to measure, so rankings like US News use “Things That are Easy to Measure” rather than “Things That Matter Most”. (Of course, US News’ proxy measures basically reward wealth and fame, and most wealthy, famous schools are very good schools.)</p>
<p>The most commonly used outcome or educational quality measure (graduation rate) is a weak measure, because the most common reasons for failing to graduate are financial or family reasons. (Although graduation rate is actually a good thing to look at, not because it measures what most people think, but because it can be depressing and destabilizing for a student to a attend a college where their friends keep dropping out or getting left behind.)</p>
<p>The best college “rankings” are the ones you do based on your own gathering of information, visits, your interests…etc. YOU should be compiling a list of criteria that are meaningful to YOU…and ranking the schools you are potentially considering yourself.</p>
<p>In my opinion, that is the only ranking that matters.</p>
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<p>To be clear, the reputation index, which is (again) the weakest link of the rankings (if one believes in the value of the ranking part) represents 22.5 percent of the weights for the schools mostly discussed on CC. </p>
<p>The international rankings do indeed focus on research outputs, but through their “carefully” chosen criteria that include and exclude certain schools, academic subjects, and publications, are hardly objective. And, fwiw, they appear to rely extensively on … reputation. Like them or hate them, those rankings are very much in line with the typical academic research, which I call academic navel gazing. For the overwhelming part, this “measurable” metric is none other than research written by and for peers that is ultimately read and used by few outside a narrow world of academic publishing. </p>
<p>If the above is important and relevant to the teenager looking at the next four years of learning and … fun remains entirely debatable. On the other hand, there is little debate about the fact that the international rankings are mostly relevant to the graduate education.</p>
<p>In the end, one should not blindly look at the RESULTS of the rankings, but rather use them as a tool to define the criteria that are important to the APPLICANT. For many, those criteria are none other than selectivity and expected support during the four or five years of undergraduate education.</p>
<p>I would say that Forbes is definitely better than US news.</p>
<p>I’d advise you to consider rankings of the factors that are most important to you. </p>
<p>There is a ranking about which colleges produces most PhDs in each discipline; it’s a list of 30-50 schools per category I believe. As I want to become a researcher, to me this ranking was invaluable. </p>
<p>At times, the college p r o w l e r rankings and the Princeton review rankings can tell you a lot about schools as well. They don’t attempt to measure everything about a school, but they have rankings in certain categories. On college p r o w l e r, you can create your own ranking by regulating the importance of about 20 different college qualities (like academics, party life, facilities etc.). </p>
<p>I would recommend that to every student and parent out there :)</p>
<p>My personal view is that for general rankings, you can’t do too much better than ranking strength of student body by SAT/ACT scores. Beyond that, I think it’s more important to look at specific fit.</p>
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<p>Of course, one could say that, but it becomes a lot harder to justify … why Forbes might be better than the USNews. And, especially after looking at the DIFFERENCES between the outcome of the two rankings. </p>
<p>For example, how many schools listed in the top 50 Forbes rankings are absent from the top 30 universities and top 20 LACs? And then look at the reasons behind the differences.</p>
<p>I agree that the best rankings are the ones that you make yourself. If success after graduation matters, % of Greek life, ease of changing majors, extensive core versus minimal distribution requirements are more important than how many prep school kids attend the school, you will not find those being ranked the same way.</p>
<p>I tend to not be impressed by any of the rankings, but I figure it’s better to be on them than not.</p>
<p>And why aren’t the Masters Universities listed amongst the others by USNews? There are some terrific schools on that list (my daughter’s alma mater included). It’s not on the LAC list, and it’s not on the university list. But it’s a great school (that flies under the radar screen). </p>
<p>We had no books or articles about rankings when our kids were crafting their application lists…none. They both went to terrific schools that met THEIR needs…and that is what matters.</p>
<p>Thumper, the different categories should not matter to the people who use the rankings correctly. In a way, this actually should help the schools that excel in their own category. Would schools such as Trinity and Southwestern in Texas, or your D’s alma mater benefit from a placement on the second pages of the universities or LACs? </p>
<p>I happen to think that being ranked at the pinnacle of regional universities is better than being in the middle of the national rankings. But again, that should not reeally matter to anyone who can look beyond the numerical ordering. </p>
<p>But that is just my opinion. :)</p>
<p>None, I used to look at USNews and then I discovered that the difference between a regional and a national ranking was not where a school pulled it’s student body from but what kinds of degrees were offered. So, a national LAC gives most of it’s degrees in liberal arts fields. A regional LAC gives most of its degress in other fields (e.g. business, education, social work, mass comm). BUT it’s still an LAC. Ok, made no sense, and I haven’t looked at a rankings since.</p>
<p>Xiggi, I totally agree with you. These schools should have their own category. My issue is that when folks look at the USNews rankings…the Masters Universities are not usually considered. When folks post these rankings…even on this site, they post the universities and LACs. Too bad. Trinity in San Antonio, and Santa Clara don’t even get a mention. Ditto the rest of these Masters universities (betcha most folks here can’t even tell you what “masters university” means).</p>
<p>I never heard of these schools before joining this forum. DD considered both.,and graduated from SCU.</p>
<p>what do you think of the methodology of this?
[College</a> Rankings - The Best Colleges](<a href=“http://www.thebestcolleges.org/rankings/]College”>http://www.thebestcolleges.org/rankings/)</p>
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<p>Agree. And I didn’t know about the “masters’ institutions,” which seems an odd category unto itself. For the most part, people who are searching for an undergraduate institution seem to care most about what is available to undergrads, not what other degrees are offered as well.</p>
<p>… Which explains why the category that garners the most attention is composed of schools that grant terminal degrees. </p>
<p>Or why some believe rankings that are almost exclusively based on graduate programs are the most important.</p>
<p>:)</p>