When I look at various school’s admission profiles, I tend to pay attention to the middle 50% stats. Who makes up the bottom 25%? That is, the admitted students who don’t measure up to the norm for that school, lower scores, gpa, etc? Who are these people, anyway?
<p>URM's, recruited athletes, and legacies.</p>
<p>developmental admits (i.e., students whose parent will contribute large sums of money to the school) international students (often, low verbal, high math scores), legacies, athletes, URM's, girls (if a lot of boys in the school) or boys (if a lot of girls in the school). </p>
<p>Also - and this is forgotten - people who have something to contribute to the school over and beyond standardized test scores and grades: artists, poets, musicians, fundraisers for charities ...</p>
<p>what is a URM</p>
<p>Underrepresented minorities. And all of these people are wrong. The correct answer is: human beings</p>
<p><b>And all of these people are wrong. The correct answer is: human beings</b></p>
<p>Oh no, my toaster's chances are ruined. :(</p>
<p>(Err, sorry.)</p>
<p>I thought human beings were a given, but I'm sure some ewoks and wookies are thrown in for diversity</p>
<p>also some strong candidates will have unbalanced scores ... engineers with 800M and fairly low verbal SAT , for example, might be a strong engineering candidate.</p>
<p>I think 3togo may be closer to the truth. Yes, URM and athletes may be a block at some schools, and legacies at smaller private schools, but if you look at State U's, for instance, the sheer numbers tell you that the general pool is part of the bottom.</p>
<p>Besides, you see class rank percentage and SAT quartiles separately. What you don't see is that the kid with the bottom class rank percentile probably has good SATs, and the kid with lousy SAT's may be learning disabled with great recs, for example.</p>
<p>please stop generalizing the test scores of URMs, legacies, and athletes. a lot of them can whoop your scores anytime (our school's average SAT score is 1480 and we have tons of legacies and athletes, e.g. out of last year's 12 Harvard admits, 10 were either legacies or athletes; their avg. SAT score prolly hovered in the 1500s). what an incendiary question.</p>
<p>Lots of interesting replies. This wasn't meant to be a controversy! I really just wondered because a friend of mine has applied to ND and is below the mid 50% on everything. But, he's got lots of (catholic) church activity,other good ec's, great recs, and says he's got a great essay. Just wondering if they ever admit the just plain good all around kid, or just the standouts. He hardly told anyone he applied because he knows its a big reach.</p>
<p>fwiw: a vast majority of kids accepted at ND (and Stanford, for that matter) were varsity athletes in HS.....if your friend was not, his chances aren't very good w/o great grades and test scores.</p>
<p>taurus, your school is obviously not a typical school so you can't compare it to the whole applicant pool.</p>
<p>My friend got into lehigh early and his SAT's were definetely below thte 25%, but it was probably the fact that he would definetely attend that got him in (plus he's a cool guy).</p>
<p>On a side note, I hate how your location always stretches out the screen thethoughtprocess</p>
<p>thethoughtprocess, i realize that. i was making that point to show that the generalization doesn't always apply. and i was just slightly irritated that people were quick to say those things without stats to back them up.</p>
<p>bluebayou: my d was admitted EA to ND. She is not a varsity athlete, nor does she have top notch SAT scores (mid 50's range). She met plenty of other EA's at a recent open house who were not athletes either. I think your statement was a bit of an overstatement.
running1605:Great ec's and rec's could go a long way if his GPA shows his potential.</p>
<p>taurus, it looks like you go to Thomas Jefferson. Am I right?</p>
<p>Got your butts wooped a last week by Exeter ;p</p>
<p>I am well aware that many athletes, legacies, and URM's perform extremely well academically. I'm not saying that they're not qualified. Most of them certainly are. However, the sad truth is that the standards for admission for these groups is lower than for other applicants. The dean of admission at Penn recently said that a URM with a 1350 on the SAT could get into every Ivy, while a white or Asian kid with a 1600 has no such guarantee.</p>
<p>ForeverZero, I actually think thats better in a way, let me explain:
An Asian who grew up in an academically-intense surrounding can score a 1600 has academic goals and a supportive environment
A hispanic with a 1350 may not have a supportive environment and instead has a great deal of potential which is untapped (this completely depends on socioeconomics though)</p>
<p>The Asian who ends up going to a non-Ivy school will definetely be succesful in undergrad school, and will go on to a great job and great grad school regardless</p>
<p>The minority from a less-advantaged background will go to the Ivy-level school, and will reach his/her full potential in such a supportive environment. If he/she went to a state university, he or she may not have known his/her full potential and wouldn't have reached it.</p>
<p>If the Asian 1600 SAT student went to a state university, it wouldn't make a difference because he/she is just as capable of succeeding at life because of the background, whereas this cannot be said of the underrepresented minority with difficult background circumstances.</p>
<p>just an idea.</p>
<p>cgmom:</p>
<p>Congrats to you D. That's awesome. :)</p>
<p>I'll have to go digging for the sources, but it is something that I have heard and read more than once over the past few years. I didn't mean to imply that the acceptees were stars in the athletic competition (they could be bench warmers), but their adcoms have a clear preference for kids who participate in athletic endeavors during their HS careers. The number I've heard was well over 50%.</p>
<p>btw: as you probably know, ND has one of the best collegiate intramural programs in the country -- ND is the only school to have full contact, w/pads, intramural football. I'm just guessing, but those kids HAD to be athletic in HS, or it would be difficult to field such a program in South Bend.</p>