<p>Ugh the above comments about law schools sound absolutely terrible. So why do people still go to non-T14 law schools? Simply because they are misinformed about the job market or because they really want to study law?</p>
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<p>Some of the physics majors I know went into well paying non-physics jobs after graduating from significantly less prestigious universities.</p>
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<p>What school? That would make about 50 or 100 per graduating class (depending on whether students are declared as freshmen or wait until junior year). How big is the graduating class?</p>
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<p>If you believe that physics is so bleak, then why are you majoring in it? Even at this stage, changing to engineering is likely an option. You could also add some CS courses to your program of study.</p>
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<p>Why don’t you just get a good GPA and go to a top tier law school, then? Actually, with a physics degree, you may, after law school, have more opportunities in patent and intellectual property law than other lawyers from the same tier of law school.</p>
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<p>Oh, I have not really kept in touch with my fellow math majors from MSU. I do remember at our commencement (years ago) that I was the only computational math major. For some reason, at MSU, the math majors did not care for computer science and the computer science majors did not care for math. At that time, MSU CS majors had to take Diff Eq, Multivariable Calculus, plus one extra math course. I am pretty sure I was the only one who went the software route. Plus I was the only “oddball” who would be taking senior-level CS courses for electives. There were a couple of my classmates prepping for the Actuary tests. I know one female was going to grad school as she did the Real Analysis option.</p>
<p>Well my recommendation for anyone entering college is Accounting, Finance, Human Resources, engineering, computer science, life science only if you are 100% certain you are going into one of the professional schools otherwise it is worthless. Esoteric BA’s even more worthless. Only majors that teach you concrete specific job skills are worthwhile now a days. </p>
<p>Gone are the days where you could get a BA in Eskimo Poetry and have an employer decide you are smart and interesting and he’ll train you on the job.</p>
<p>Glasss, I have an MBA and work in the consulting field. Money certainly isn’t the only (or even best) measure of someone’s value to society. I personally think a good teacher, for example, does a whole lot more good in the world than a consultant who is trying to figure out how to increase their client’s sales volume of cell phones or help a bank figure out how to most effectively wring the most out of their clients in fees (both of which are projects I have worked on in my consulting career).</p>
<p>I have cousins who majored in science (one chem, one physics, and one biology). One is a doctor with the Indian Health Service, one is a physics professor, and one is a nurse (also with the IHS). They have done plenty of good in the world with their science undergrad degrees, absolutely more than I have done with my undergrad business major/MBA. And all earn a reasonable middle class living and are happy with what they do.</p>
<p>I hope (and know) that my kids want more out of college that just a “comfortable life”. For example, my kid who will be a science major really thinks there is value in a research career that adds to the body of human knowledge capital. Her little piece of that may not be something that is a major breakthrough or makes her wealthy, but she takes a lot of satisfaction in the idea that it might be a building block for someone else to achieve a great scientific advancement even if she isn’t the one. Her personal hero is Dr. Norman Borlaugh, whose research has been credited with saving over a billion lives worldwide.</p>
<p>Sure, she needs to have her eyes open about where the opportunities are in the science world (a lot of students don’t), and work hard for good grades and good research opportunities. And grad school of some kind (probably in science, but maybe some other discipline she can combine with her undergrad major) is in her future.</p>
<p>You guys who consistently post out here dissing science majors and careers really ought to ease up a little. Every field/job has its drawbacks – believe me, MBAs, lawyers, and doctors shouldn’t be put on any kind of pedestal.</p>
<p>There is also value in being able to pay the grocery bills and not live in an inpoverished neighborhood or god-forbid subject your kids to it. You make it sound like we are greedy money grubbers. There is a huge difference between a CEO demanding a million dollar bonus and a chemist just asking for sick leave and $50K so he can afford his bills. Below a certain point a career is simply not viable no matter how passionate you are for it and frankly chem and bios have gone far past it. </p>
<p>Intparent not one of your kids has tried to make a career with just a biology or chemistry degree. We all know nursing and med school is good as is physics, though getting tenure is a long-shot for a career. </p>
<p>Finally if the govt, companies, and college depts keep putting out that we need more science majors blah blah blah ad. naseum people like myself will continue to make the counter point that it is a call for suckers, for very smart fools. The current situation is wasteful of educational resources and a personal tragedy for the graduates themselves.</p>
<p>I am always rooting for anyone wanting to be a math major. Hell, if a potential CS major would listen, I always tell them to do CS via the math major. There were always so many avenues with the math degree. At least 3 times in my working career, I was asked to do some technical or engineering on the premise of…and I quote…“if you can do this (Math), then you can handle that.”.</p>
<p>So what would you recommend then? That I do something I absolutely hate? I love being in a lab, and I love teaching. I don’t care if I only make 20-30K a year if it means I can do one or both of the those. I’m living very comfortably on a lot less than that now, and I’d rather do that and love what I’m doing than go back to chemical engineering where I started my college career. The only class that gave me any enjoyment and kept me going back then was organic lab. My living expenses shouldn’t get much more expensive when I’m done with school unless I have kids, and as of right now rent is only $700, power $10, food $400 or so, water $40, cable/internet $70, and cell phone $25. All of these expenses except food and cell phone are split with my boyfriend, so I only have about $10,000 of expenses a year that would still be there once I’m not paying tuition. I know I’ll have to add in gas, car insurance (car itself is paid for), and health insurance then, but that’s still at a point where $20,000 a year could handle it with some money left over and 30K would seem a bit excessive. It probably helps that I live in a fairly inexpensive area, but if I move it would be to an even less expensive place.</p>
<p>Well if you are happy making the wages of a janitor after such an expensive investment of time (opportunity costs) and tuition money and can survive like that than it is fine. Most people don’t go to college to impoverish themselves nor can they live like that especially with student loans as tuition keeps going up. If you intend to ever have a family I hope your SO makes a lot more than you because I think it is wrong to make your kids suffer because of it. </p>
<p>Perhaps scientists like clergy should take an oath of poverty before going into it so there is no illusion what they are in for. </p>
<p>Keep in mind many people can be happy in more than one type of career. I’d suggest people make a list of the types of careers that they feel they could be happy or at least tolerate and scratch off the ones that are nonviable either due to poor pay or poor employment prospects (or in chem and bios’ case both).</p>
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Physicists are more valuable for advancing human society. MBAs are more valuable for making rich people more money. In the capitalistic society you recognized, the latter pays more, even though the former is much more beneficial to society.</p>
<p>I’m not going the science major route, but I applaud those who do it for the love of the subject and the desire to expand the field of scientific knowledge. Humanity needs its scientists much more than it needs its businessmen. If I could trade businessmen for scientists, I would do so until every greedy hedge fund manager was replaced by an astronomer dreaming of human expansion, until every unscrupulous CEO was replaced by a chemist trying to solve human ills, until every tycoon was replaced by a biologist helping to strengthen the crops that sustain us.</p>
<p>It is your comment that is ridiculous. The long-term goals of science are far preferable to the short-term damages of capitalistic business.</p>
<p>Where do you find physical sciences major distribution is high?</p>
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<p>[College</a> Search - Harvard College - Majors](<a href=“College Search - BigFuture | College Board”>College Search - BigFuture | College Board)</p>
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<p><a href=“College Search - BigFuture | College Board”>College Search - BigFuture | College Board;
<p>It’s an investment of time, sure, but my scholarships cover all of my tuition and living expenses while in college, with plenty of extra left over since my tendency is to live frugally and save as much as possible. And even now I live in a very nice apartment and I eat very well. I wouldn’t consider my lifestyle on less than 20K impoverished, so I don’t see why my lifestyle would get worse when I make more money than this. I’ll be coming out of college with thousands, almost tens of thousands, more dollars than I came in with, not in debt. I realize that may not be the typical case but I think if people budget well enough they can do it, too.</p>
<p>My parents are both teachers and even with their low salaries they were able to save money for college for me and both of my brothers while still giving us a very nice quality of life. They were even able to buy me a car because they ended up not having to pay for my college thanks to the scholarships. So I don’t think you’re somehow ruining your children’s lives just because you only make about 50-60K between you and your SO. You just have to budget your money responsibly and avoid debt whenever possible.</p>
<p>I can’t think of any jobs I’d want to do that wouldn’t involve being in either a lab or a classroom, either. Maybe it’s just me not really knowing what else is out there, but I’ve spent four and a half years as a tutor and love it and have been doing undergrad research for almost two years now and love that as well. What else is there? I can’t go into business or anything like that, I’m shy so I know I’m not likely to get hired for anything like that.</p>
<p>Then I would suggest you aim for teaching. The pay, benefits, and job security are better and you get summers off. Chemists often get laid off frequently and have serious issues securing employment much past age 45. Even before 45 It can take a few years to find a decent nonpermatemp job.</p>
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<p>However, it appears that the labor market is willing to pay physics majors to pull them into quantitative finance and the like, rather than working in physics.</p>
<p>Sschoe, your problem may be with BIOchemists.</p>
<p>I was just talking with my former boss, who has a PhD in PHYSICAL chemistry. It seems like as long as it was PHYSICAL chemistry, his classmates all found jobs, mostly in finance or industrial RD. He was the worst, being stuck as manager at a small pharmaceutical plant. I speculate this may due to physical chemistry being just as quantitative as physics and engineering, with heavy programming and modeling skills required. Just the sort of thing you need as a manager or a financial analyst.</p>
<p>Obviously, the job market is much worse for Bio or Organic chemistry due to those being memorization based subjects.</p>
<p>Oh, yeah, there’s no way I’d want to go into organic or biochem. I loved the labs but I hated the class (not the material necessarily, just how memorization based it was). I’m mostly interested in polymers and materials and I’m getting a math minor as well. Is that any likely to be better?</p>
<p>Perhaps change into chemical or chemical/materials engineering if you are into polymers and materials? Chemical engineering has better job and career prospects than chemistry (though materials engineering alone may not be so great).</p>
<p>More math could help you into a job or career that involves math, though it may not have anything to do with chemistry (e.g. finance, a common destination for math, physics, and statistics majors).</p>
<p>Yeah math minor would be useful. I’m Chemistry major but got a few interview opportunities for analyst positions that have nothing to do with Chemistry with my math minor and some programming experience.</p>
<p>Why would materials engineering not be so great for a job? Is it significantly inferior to chemical engineering?</p>
<p>I was seriously considering grad school for materials engineering. Chemical engineering seemed to have way too much management and economics in it from the way people talk about it, though I never saw that in any of my ChemE classes. I have a minor in ME and absolutely loved every class even if I didn’t do well since it made me feel like I learned alot. But now that you say this, would chemistry majors looking to switch fields find it best to avoid materials engineering?</p>
<p>Okay, I’m only two classes short of a math minor as it stands so I’ll definitely do that.
I hated the intro chem engineering classes when I took them but I am considering going for a materials science and engineering program.</p>