<p>S1 was in the camp of those not applying to highly ranked schools because he just wasn’t interested. He knew that he would be happy at our big state u. and did not see any point in spending time and money on apps. to places he would have turned down if accepted. He got a great education, had lots of fun, graduated debt-free,no regrets.</p>
<p>S1 considered the quality and depth of the math department to be very important, which led to several top-ranked schools on his list. However, there were several top-tier math programs to which he refused to apply, period. Not for him. Not his people. Not a good fit. </p>
<p>In the end, his decision was based on which school would challenge him to grow the most as a person, and which offered opportunities he wouldn’t get in grad school.</p>
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<p>Sometimes its hard to know in September how things will look in May, and reading about a college on paper is definitely a different thing than visiting – but not all kids have the luxury of visiting. My daughter’s test scores were on the low end for her reach school, so I thought that Goucher looked like a good fit for her, and she was pretty sure that American would be a top choice – until she visited both schools. (She hated them). She had assumed that she would want a mid-sized school, 5000 students max – until she arrived in New York after a disappointing week in DC, and discovered that her true love was NYU – not even on her radar before then. But my daughter had to arrange a week off of school in October to travel from west to east coast on her own – not all kids are as intrepid or stubborn as she is. (We couldn’t have afforded the trip if I had gone). </p>
<p>I don’t think its lack of research – on paper the schools she rejected looked like good matches. </p>
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<p>There is also a lot of growth and change that takes place over the course of senior year in high school. The high school senior who applies in November isn’t always the same person as the young adult who is making a choice in April. </p>
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<p>You have to keep in mind that with the competitive nature of college admissions, there is tremendous pressure on the student to apply to a wide range of schools including reaches, so-called matches, and safeties. There is a sense in applying to the reach schools that more applications will mean improved chances – so the student who desperately wants to attend Yale might also apply to Harvard and Columbia … they are all Ivies after all – but come admission time, maybe that student is accepted to only Columbia, and realizes that everything they had envisioned about the Ivy League really doesn’t apply to Columbia’s urban campus. So maybe that student ends up choosing a college several steps down the ranking list… because when it comes down to it, that student really wants a college with lawns and foliage. </p>
<p>You have to keep in mind that the range of choices available in the spring is a different array than the range of choices when the applications are sent in - and “ranking” may also diminish in importance as the student learns the type of inside information about a school that only is conveyed to admitted students who are near the top of the applicant pool. It’s one thing to assume that school #5 offers a better education than school #48 … but down the line, the student might have received phone calls and mail from a profs and deans at school #48, inviting him to participate in some sort of specialized program related to his major. The down-track colleges do a good job of marketing themselves, with a personal touch that is often absent from the high end colleges.</p>
<p>Good post, calmom. This is exactly the kind of response I was hoping for - different perspectives. There is got to be more reasons than what I posted.</p>
<p>I do have to say one thing though - my last post was referring to objective facts that were known prior to applying, not details that came to light later.</p>
<p>Hrrm… I got into Duke, UNC, Northwestern, GT…ended up going to Florida State as well, it was much much cheaper in state back in the late 90s and my parents didn’t have any money saved for college, so I stayed at home and lived with them while I paid for my school. I’m still paying that off, can’t imagine if I would have gone out of state, though I might have made more money… but probably not.</p>
<p>“my last post was referring to objective facts that were known prior to applying”
???
“3. Students’ preferences were crystallized later when the possibility of spending four years on that school became dangerously close to reality.”
PCP, I would say that student’s preferences can be very SUBJECTIVE, rather than Objective .
When my son was initially thinking about where he wanted to go to college, at the beginning of Senior year[ when kids reeeeally can start to pull away from parents], he was SURE he wanted to go to a small, private LAC FAR from home, preferably on the EC. He had no interest in applying to big Universities at all[ hence no applications to any UC’s ]. He threw in USC only because he had visited the campus, liked it enough, and needed a safety [ which it was for students like him coming from his HS]
By the time May 1 rolled around, he had visited the 2 top eastern Ivy’s he was accepted at [ hadn’t had a chance before applying] , and made the decision that it just might be nicer to be closer to home, and not have his college education cost his parents much $$[ We had no idea that he would be offered a full tuition scholarship from USC ,as it had never happened to anyone at his school before].
In addition, I have heard time and time again from GC’s that by the end of Sr year, when push comes to shove, students often decide that it maybe wouldn’t be so bad being in a college closer to home. Students have no way these days of knowing WHERE they will be accepted, as well as knowing what they will feel 8 months from the time they send in an application. So applying to a variety of colleges in different locations seems a smart tactic, given how much kids often change during their last year of HS, not the result of not doing enough research.</p>
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But part of my point is that the subjective feelings about the objective facts are subject to change over time. The kid who wants to get as far from home as possible may have 2nd thoughts as the reality descends; the kid who thought she wanted to stay close enough to home for frequent visits may have become far more confident about leaving by the time spring rolls around. </p>
<p>The same change of perspective might happen with just about any other “objective” fact. </p>
<p>Keep in mind that high school students continue to take in new information throughout their senior year – and are influenced by their peers and reports from friends already in college – as well as other factors. A lot can happen to change the kid’s perspective on the same “objective” facts over time.</p>
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<p>This is what I had in mind when I listed number 3.</p>
<p>menloparkmom, the “objective facts” are about schools (size, distance), not the about the student’s feeling.</p>
<p>I turned down the #1 Civil Engineering Undergrad program in the country (UC Berkeley) for USC.</p>
<p>I chose USC, because, well, I love USC, and am willing to go $100k+ in debt to go here.</p>
<p>You must be a different kind of engineer.</p>
<p>Last year I turned down Case Western for Pitt, mainly because of cost but I was glad I did when there were two daytime rapes at cwru this summer!</p>
<p>Cost, cost & cost. My daughter got into RISD (top ranked art college Rhode Island School of Design) with a 'congratulations, you may now borrow $55K per year" letter. Might as well have rejected her. This caused her to reasses completely, and she took a gap year and is now reapplying to liberal arts colleges. Cost is the only factor.</p>
<p>I’m not sure about “clearly higher,” but I turned down Villanova for IU. Definitely made the right choice. Better program of study for my major, more research opportunities, better social life, better-looking campus.</p>
<p>“You must be a different kind of engineer.”</p>
<p>What do you mean?</p>
<p>I was just kidding you. I’m an engineer myself, and the engineers I know would have done a simple cost-benefit analysis and attended the school with the highest ratio of projected income vs. cost of attendance. :)</p>
<p>Haha, I gotcha.</p>
<p>But I’ve been wanting to go to USC since I was in the 4th grade. The bias was there.</p>
<p>I’ve always been a weird one nonetheless. :p</p>
<p>I suspect this is a unique case, but I believe my godbrother was accepted to four-year colleges…then his best friend was killed in a car accident. He suddenly became much more attached to his parents and just wasn’t emotionally ready anymore to go away. He went to two years of community college and is transferring.</p>
<p>I turned down UCLA for Pepperdine. Pepperdine’s more expensive, but it was always my top choice, and I really only applied to UCLA to see if I’d get in. Considering how different the schools are, and how perfect Pepperdine has been for me, I really don’t know how I would have done had I ended up at UCLA.</p>
<p>firesoul17, that’s certainly a good reason. When my neighbor passed away a few years ago, his son changed his plans and went to college nearby in order to be close to his just-widowed mother. I wonder if perhaps this situation arises a lot more than we hear about.</p>
<p>Son turned down Chicago for Michigan (in-state).</p>
<p>Of course reason #1 was money, although after scholarships that weren’t riduculously far appart and we would have paid. Reason #2 was that, “I’d like to have little fun in undergrad school.”</p>